Originally posted by Scaldari:

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Always an enjoyable read Russ

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Originally posted by SoulGLOW:

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Someday I'm gonna read something that Russ writes and I'm gonna shit myself for laughing so hard.

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Originally posted by Scaldari:

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I can answer the filibusterer, it is because we are not really a democracy, we are a republic. The filibuster serves the purpose of not letting a simple majority dominate and persecute a minority opinion. it takes a 60% vote to stop a filibuster, which gives a minority position time to build support for their cause..

The Electoral College was created for two reasons. The first purpose was to create a buffer between population and the selection of a President. The second as part of the structure of the government that gave extra power to the smaller states.

The first reason that the founders created the Electoral College is hard to understand today. The founding fathers were afraid of direct election to the Presidency. They feared a tyrant could manipulate public opinion and come to power.

The Senators were not supposed to be directly elected by the people, but appointed by the state legislatures to represent the interests of the states themselves. That change i think was a grave mistake and should be corrected, as the states themselves seem to have little say in what goes on in Washington.

So we are supposed to have the house, which is directly elected by the people and is their voice, with a 2 year turn over rate. THe Senate, appointed by the state legislators which had a 6 year term unless recalled by said state. The reason for only 2 per state irregardless of population was that they did not represent the peoples interests, but the interests of the state itself, thus kept one state from having any greater say then another. An electoral college which for the most part followed the popular vote, but had the power to go against it if they felt the people were making a grave mistake and helped balance the power between the larger and smaller states.

It is due to the fact we have pulled away from our republic foundations that we are having this problem with the Corporations. If we were still following a system of great power at the State level, little power at the Federal level it would be much harder for a corporation to influence things nationally as they due now, since they would have to focus on 50 fronts to pass their agenda. A governing body closer to its population is more likely to follow the actual will of the population making a Corporations job even harder.

Our system works, when we follow it. The problem is we have not followed it for most of the last 100 years it seems, and look at the mess we are in ;).

P.S. Military Adventurism was never part of our founding structure, and is not supported by the population at large. I would go as far to say it is mostly a product of undue corporate influence.

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Originally posted by Scaldari:

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I can answer the filibusterer, it is because we are not really a democracy, we are a republic. The filibuster serves the purpose of not letting a simple majority dominate and persecute a minority opinion. it takes a 60% vote to stop a filibuster, which gives a minority position time to build support for their cause..

The Electoral College was created for two reasons. The first purpose was to create a buffer between population and the selection of a President. The second as part of the structure of the government that gave extra power to the smaller states.

The first reason that the founders created the Electoral College is hard to understand today. The founding fathers were afraid of direct election to the Presidency. They feared a tyrant could manipulate public opinion and come to power.

The Senators were not supposed to be directly elected by the people, but appointed by the state legislatures to represent the interests of the states themselves. That change i think was a grave mistake and should be corrected, as the states themselves seem to have little say in what goes on in Washington.

So we are supposed to have the house, which is directly elected by the people and is their voice, with a 2 year turn over rate. THe Senate, appointed by the state legislators which had a 6 year term unless recalled by said state. The reason for only 2 per state irregardless of population was that they did not represent the peoples interests, but the interests of the state itself, thus kept one state from having any greater say then another. An electoral college which for the most part followed the popular vote, but had the power to go against it if they felt the people were making a grave mistake and helped balance the power between the larger and smaller states.

It is due to the fact we have pulled away from our republic foundations that we are having this problem with the Corporations. If we were still following a system of great power at the State level, little power at the Federal level it would be much harder for a corporation to influence things nationally as they due now, since they would have to focus on 50 fronts to pass their agenda. A governing body closer to its population is more likely to follow the actual will of the population making a Corporations job even harder.

Our system works, when we follow it. The problem is we have not followed it for most of the last 100 years it seems, and look at the mess we are in ;).

P.S. Military Adventurism was never part of our founding structure, and is not supported by the population at large. I would go as far to say it is mostly a product of undue corporate influence.

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Originally posted by pmshah:

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@Scaldari,

Thanks for clarifying the intent of the provisions BUT just see how these are being misused. Blocking every move by Obama that would alleviate the hardships of the general public being blocked by the republicans filibustering! After all that is said and done, it is not what the original intent is, I include ALL religions in this, it is how it is practiced / misused that matters.

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Originally posted by SoulGLOW:

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And Another thing....quite off topic but in line with the flow of this conversation...if we didn't have an Electoral College then I can guarantee you that Ron Paul would be our next President. (which I am fine with BTW) And don't go flinging any mud about his 'ideas' on foreign policy. The fact remains that if you keep sticking your dick in another mans woman he will eventually cut that thing off. Bullies eventually get stomped out even if the whole neighborhood has to gang up at once. Doesn't mean we would puss out cuz we pull out, it just means that we understand previous said notion AND we stand ready just in case some dumbass tries to bring that bullshit in our yard. As for WW2 or other cases of mass bullying that is why we have a congress to invoke military action through a VALID declaration of war. Mass hysteria which ensues after a frightening event notwithstanding; FACTS should come to light before action is taken. And not manufactured 'facts' either.

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Originally posted by Scaldari:

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Originally posted by pmshah:

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@Scaldari,

Thanks for clarifying the intent of the provisions BUT just see how these are being misused. Blocking every move by Obama that would alleviate the hardships of the general public being blocked by the republicans filibustering! After all that is said and done, it is not what the original intent is, I include ALL religions in this, it is how it is practiced / misused that matters.

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In all honesty you have to temper the Republican filibuster with Majority Leaders refusal to allow the other sides bills to come to the floor for discussion, let alone vote. I admit the senate is broken, but it is both sides that are responsible for the breaking.

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Originally posted by pmshah:

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Originally posted by Scaldari:

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Originally posted by pmshah:

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@Scaldari,

Thanks for clarifying the intent of the provisions BUT just see how these are being misused. Blocking every move by Obama that would alleviate the hardships of the general public being blocked by the republicans filibustering! After all that is said and done, it is not what the original intent is, I include ALL religions in this, it is how it is practiced / misused that matters.

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In all honesty you have to temper the Republican filibuster with Majority Leaders refusal to allow the other sides bills to come to the floor for discussion, let alone vote. I admit the senate is broken, but it is both sides that are responsible for the breaking.

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Oh I am well aware of the how the politicians operate. In almost all issues their stand is solely dependent on whether they are the ruling party or in opposition, not unlike Romney's stand on Obamacare ! They may fight like cat and dog in the legislature but after 8:00 they would be clinking glasses and discussing the merits of their latest opposite sex conquests.

If well being of the nation is to be the prime concern, I believe that the voting, even in congress and the senate should be secret. It should always be issue based and never on party lines.

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Originally posted by IgzhCUArFroQJRd:

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memang lah kita semua love peace, sapa yg suka kekerasan? org yg x nomarl je suka kezaliman.Malaysia ni dah demokrasi ke? Kalau dah demokrasi,knape PEMIMPIN sendiri tak protect RAKYAT SENDIRI? knape pemimpin SPRAY air kimia kat RAKYAT? patut ke bende ni berlaku? Ape tugas pemimpin? utk melindungi rakyat.matlamat dorg mengadakan BERSIH RALLY ni ada tujuan baik,takkan la dorg saje2 nak adakan rally tanpa tujuan? mesti la ada sebab.

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