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Burning VHS's to DVD's
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VG11489
Newbie
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2. August 2004 @ 20:03 |
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Hey all
Im a noob at copying vhs's to dvds but copying dvds and games and such I know. What I wanted to know is what I need to copy a vhs to dvd. What software do I need (also the steps to copying the vhs with this software)and if I need any hardware. I know that I will need a tv capture card which I have,a ATI AIW 9800 Pro and also I have a VCR lol I heard that you would need a microvision hack coughcough link cough. I wanted to know where do I connect the VCR to. Is it that purple cable connecter box which has the s-video and composite connections. And I just connect it to the VCR right. And also if there is a do it yourself guide that relates to the videocard and what im doing then post the link. I will be copying home movies and also movies I bought.
I need all the help that I can get
thx
VG
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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3. August 2004 @ 12:40 |
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Well You can use the "ATI Multi-Media Center" also called MMC software that came with your Card to capture directly to Mpeg2...
You have to capture to Mpeg2 useing a resolution of 720+480 for NTSC and 720+576 For PAL, and a Mpeg1 Layer 2 audio Sample rate of 48000HZ ..
The Video bitrate you would use would depend on the Length of the Movie you are Putting on the DVD..If the Movie is 90 minutes you would use a Video bitrate of about 6500kbs and an Audio bitrate of 192kbs..For a 120 Minute movie you would use a Video bitrate of about 4850kbs and an audio bitrate of 192kbs...
You would just make a Custom Capture Profile in the ATI MMC Software useing these settings and capture the Movie to your Hard drive...
After you have the Mpeg2 file captured you will have to put the File on to DVD so you will need a DVD Authoring Program to do this...
For a Really simple Program to use I suggest "Tmpgenc DVD Author" cuz it is really simple to use but it also doesn"t have a Lot of Features, If you want to make a DVD with more Intricate Menu"s and other features then I suggest "DVDLab" as it is a very good program and fairly easy to use and has lots of features...
You can download 30 day demo versions of both of these Programs on there web sites....
One problem you are probably going to run into is Macrovision Copy Protection that is on most Retail VHS Tapes...If the Tapes are Copy protected you will notice the Video goes Bright and then Dark the Bright then dark ECT and you can get Squigily Lines going through the Video...
To overcome this you will need to get a Video Stabilizer or something like the Sima Copy Master which will remove the Macrovision Copy protection from the Signal when Captureing...
To hook up your VCR to your AIW Card you just hook the RCA outputs from the VCR into the RCA Inputs on the Purple Breakout Cable or if your VCR has S-Video outputs you can just hook the 2 Audio RCA Cables and the S-Video cable into the Purple Breakout Cable...
When captureing through the RCA ports you select "Composite" as the Video source in the Capture Software and you choose "S-Video" as the Video source for the S-Video port...
Also make sure that the Audio from the Breakout Cable goes into your "Line In" port on your Sound Card....
Hope this helps...Cheers
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burning2
Newbie
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3. August 2004 @ 17:18 |
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I recently purchased an all-in-one machine (GoVideo) one touch copy of VHS to DVD, but I'm finding that I can't copy retail movies like you mentioned Minion. My question is how come we can't copy movies that we already own like we can for DVDs? Also, is there a way that I can bypass this and copy using this machine that's not hooked up to my PC. I just wanted to preserve my VHS movies since I have been doing that with my DVDs.
Thanks in advance for any help/advice.
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VG11489
Newbie
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3. August 2004 @ 19:01 |
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ok I understand everything but I have one question
about the copy protection for the VHS is the only way to remove the microvision is to use a hardware solution is there a software solution?
thx
VG
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pastyboyz
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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3. August 2004 @ 19:35 |
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BY the way it's called Macrovison
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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4. August 2004 @ 11:03 |
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There is No Software solution that I know of for Removeing Macrovision Protection, The only solution is a Hardware solution Like a Video stabilizer or a Sima Copy Master....
You can remove the Copy protections From DVD"s because the Medium is digital so there are software solutions to the Copy protections, but VHS Tapes are Analogue and Capture Cards have Built in Hardware detection of the Analogue Copy Protections so as soon as your Capture device knows the Signal is copy protected the Signal get scrambled so you can not Properly capture it....
A Basic video stabilizer costs about $30 Max and will remove the Copy protection so you can capture VHS Tapes, The Sima Copy Master is a more expensive device but I think it can also remove copy protection from DVD"s .....
Cheers
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Newbie
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5. August 2004 @ 10:26 |
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I have captured the VHS tape to the hard drive in Mpeg2 format and it looks and sounds great on the hard drive. However, when I burn it to the DVD using Pinniacle 9 the audio is great but the picture is lower quality than the VHS tape. Anyone know why this would happen? Should it not be at least as good as the VHS tape?
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VG11489
Newbie
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5. August 2004 @ 11:28 |
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the macrovision protection made the qulilty of the video bad
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Minion
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6. August 2004 @ 12:19 |
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If your Video source is VHS then the Quality of the Captured file or the DVD Made from the Captured file will be of Lower Quality than the VHS Tape....
Captureing Video and Compressing it is a Very Lossy process and it becomes even more lossy when useing Crappy Capture Software and Crappy Mpeg2 encoders like the Ones built into Pinnacle Studio 8/9....
I find the Best Quality method of Analogue capture to DVD is to capture the video to Uncompressed AVI or to AVI useing the HuFFYUV codec and then useing a Good Quality Mpeg2 encoder and some Video filters to clean up the Image and to encode the AVI file to Mpeg2 for DVD....I use AVISynth to Filter the Video and clean up any Backround Noise and Frame serve the File to CCE SP 2.67 to encode it to Mpeg2 and the Quality usually turns out pretty good....
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chocyman
Newbie
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16. August 2004 @ 19:00 |
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Hi folks..
Have been reading all the threads on this for a while, so had a bit of free time (about time!!) on my hands, so I set about copying some of my cherished VHS tapes onto DVD.
So my set-up is an Athlon XP2500, Gigabyte GA-600F 1364 mobo, 2 x 120Gb SATA HDD (not raid) and 1G RAM, MX460 Gfx and Leadtek Win2000XP Expert tuner/capture card.
Ok...now I know quality vs source is a big issue, but the results Ive had so far are pretty pleasing. Considering some of the tapes are a little weathered, the results are not bad at all. Now..ive got a few little question on the whole process Im hoping someone can help me out with.
Ive followed the following process..
Captured via RCA the VCR signal using the HuffyUV codec using Yuv (didnt see any difference between RGB and Yuv apart from Yuv compressed much better!) with Virtual Dub. From there Ive used TMPGenc and DVD author to compress to MPEG2 and author to a DVD.
Now..what Id like to do is to sharpen and generally clean up my catured .AVI using the filters in Virtual dub.
What are the settings I need (in Virtual Dub). Ive tried in full processing mode (direct stream copy doesnt allow you to apply any filters) with no compression configured, and using the deinterlace and sharpen filters, the file size balloons up to more than 80G!..in fact it wont fit on the drive.
Im thinking that I would again need to select the HuffyUV codec as the compression codec??. Would I be right in thinking that I wouldnt loose quality as this codec is supposed to be lossless?? Im not understanding why Id need to re-compress the video stream, when its already compressed?. Id also like an idiots guide to frame servers as well...could someone explain how these work and could it benefit the final output??
The other question is whilst I am viewing or capturing, the image is pretty good, but Ive noticed that when there is rapid movement of the picture, I get horizontal lines appearing around the edge of the thing/person that have moved fast. Is this simply a limitation of the ADC on the card?? Its supposed to be 10bit, which im told isnt too bad! Im capturing at the PAL standard of 25fps if thats any help.
Apologies for the length of the post, but if anyone can point me in the right direction or answer the questions,Id really appreciate it.
Oh..one final final question...anyone know anything about IRQ/PCI slot priority? Ive been told that depending on what slot your capture card is, will depend on the priority given to the signal by the motherboard? Therefore I guess improving the input signal by having a higher priority as far as the processor and I/O go....
Anyone else heard of this??
Thanks for any help people can be.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. August 2004 @ 19:24
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turkey
Member
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16. August 2004 @ 21:14 |
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chocyman:
you are correct about needing to recompress your AVI with huffyuv in vdub. only with direct stream copy is there no recompression, otherwise vdub must uncompress the file to make changes, then recompress it in real time if you set it to do so. this process takes a while though, so that is what frameservers are for. but thats about all i know about frameservers cuz i am in the process of doing some research myself...
the alternating lines you see with movement on screen is called interlacing. it occurs by design, so there isn't anything you are doing wrong. try a deinterlace filter or set your mpeg encoder to use "progressive" field order. this should take care of the issue.
finally, unless your CPU is at 100% usage and you are dropping frames or the audio is hissing/crappy, changing the IRQ/PCI of your capture card is not going to improve performance. IRQ/PCI priority used to be a problem for older computers, but with your motherboard and with either Win 2000/XP you shouldn't worry.
i like to eat turkey...
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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16. August 2004 @ 22:16 |
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You can frameserve your Captured file with the Virtual-Dub Filters to TMPGEnc without haveing to Render a New File ....
This is how you do it...
#1)First go into the V-Dub folder and run the "AuxSetup.exe" file and click "Install Handler" then click OK" and then clise the AuxSetup.exe file..
#2)Now just load your AVI file into V-Dub and set up your Filters & Settings Like you normaly would if you were to use V-Dub to render your File...
#3) Now instead of saveing a New file you go to "File" to "Start Frameserver" and then click "Start" and now give the Frameserver file and Name but with a VDR extention ,Something like "Movie.vdr" and save it....
#4) Now just load the VDR File into TMPGEnc and encode it like normal...If TMPGEnc give you a problem with the File then go to "options" to Enviromental Settings" to VFAPI Plugins" and Disable the "Direct show File Reader" and raise the "AVI VFW Combatibility reader" to "1"....
The encoded file will be filtered useing the Virtual Dub filters you set up in V-Dub.....
Cheers
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chocyman
Newbie
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16. August 2004 @ 22:45 |
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Thanks Minion and Turkey for your responses.
I too was reading about frame servers, and they make good sense...
Basically it seems as though they cut out an additional file save (which i guess would have been the output from Virtual Dub) almost making the virtual dub filtering/image processing transparent.
Neat little idea that...
Im currently trying to get my head around AVISynth as it seems there are more filters available for it than virtual dub, which would help improve image quality event more (reading about Chroma noise and artifacts...making my brain hurt!!!).
Oh and one quick question that someone could answer...does Virtual dub mind if the AVI file its processing is more than 2Gig (im using XP..so file sizes are not an issue as far as the OS goes)??Ive seen in some guides that spill drives need to be setup, and to break the capture into smaller 2G files.
Is this right and are there any benefit to encoding or processing with smaller file sizes?
Once again..thanks :)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. August 2004 @ 22:49
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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17. August 2004 @ 11:58 |
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Yes there are more Filters for AVISynth that there are for V-Dub but V-Dub is a Little easier to use and in some cases(Depending on the Filters used) it"s a faster Frameserver....I personally prefer AVISynth better but it is Hard to learn to the Point were you can write a Scrips without thinking to much...lol
Virtual-Dub will handle files bigger than 2gb in Most cases, as long as you have a NTFS File system...
I can"t see the advantage of Working with Smaller Files especially if you have to Join them together before Authoring to DVD....
There are a Couple Basic GUI"s for AVISynth that you can use to help you write scripts like "Gordain Knot" and one called "AVIScript"...I usually use "Gordain Knot" to write the Basic Script and then edit the script so I can add more Filters and Functions as Gordain Knot only has settings for "Resizeing", "De-Interlaceing" ,De-Noiseing and Adding Borders....
Cheers
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chocyman
Newbie
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17. August 2004 @ 16:16 |
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Thanks for the reply Minion...
Ive had a few test runs and the results seem to be good. I`ll check out Gordian Knot and see if it can do a few bits easier. Mind you...the scripting part isnt difficult...its understanding what each plugin does and what the values you enter in mean!!..especially if your not familiar with some of the terminology in video editing. Its a case of try it and see I think.
Cheers for your help..hopefully this post will come in useful to others as well.
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Joanr
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18. August 2004 @ 08:56 |
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I recently purchased a TDK IndiCapture USB 2 device. I know it's not the best option for capturing analog to DV but it works fairly well. My only beef is that I can't get it to work with hardly any software. Only works with Sonic MyDVD, Pinnacle and WinDVD. I'm using WinDVD2 at this point to capture to mpeg2 and then run it through Nero Vision express to DVD. WinDVD's capture files have an .mpeg extension but I can't get them read by VDub or some of the other apps I'd rather use for encoding to DVD. Anyone know why this is? Thanks.
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Joanr
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18. August 2004 @ 09:16 |
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Hi, I forgot to ask: When capturing a VHS tape some apps just stop in their tracks when encountering macrovision. OTOH, some, like SonicMyDVD will go ahead and capture anyway. What I'm seeing is yellow and pinkish bands in the capture files. Is this from the macrovision or is this another issue? TIA.
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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18. August 2004 @ 12:52 |
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Hi, If you are Captureing Directly to Mpeg2 then you should Not use Nero vision Express to Author to DVD because Vision Express will ALLWAYS Re-Encode your Source file which Lowers the Quality of the Movie and takes a lot longer to create the DVD...
If your Captured Files are allready in the Correct Mpeg2/DVD Format then you should use a DVD authoring program that will NOT re-encode your Files Like "DVDLab" ...It will also be a Lot Quicker than Vision express and you can download a Full working 30 day demo off the net....
Macrovision copy protection Usually manifests it"s self as a Darkening and Brightening of the Image and sometimes you can get Diaginal Lines going through the video and a Distorted Image....
You can get a Device called a Video stabilizer that will remove the Macrovision Signal while Captureing...
They usually sell for under $30....
Virtual-Dub does not support Mpeg2 files unless you get the Mpeg2 version of Virtual-Dub which you can download here:
Virtual-Dub-Mpeg2
http://fcchandler.home.comcast.net/stable/VirtualDub-MPEG2.zip
Cheers
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Joanr
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18. August 2004 @ 19:01 |
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I was using Nero Vision Express because it uses a two pass system to produce better quality (or so they say). I was capturing some very old family vhs tapes and experimenting with various methods for each tape. The best looking one was captured with WinDVD2 and encoded to DVD with Vision Express, believe it or not. I never expected excellent results, considering the source, but the Vision DVD's are actually quite viewable, even on a large widescreen RPTV, compared to the ones that I let Sonic or WinDVD encode to DVD.
Seems there is no way to control the initial encoding with this indicapture device, so I can't do lossless AVI. If I were to uncompress the mpeg2 to AVI and then re-encode it with Vdub or whatever, is there a recommended app to uncompress the mpeg? I have the Huffy codec installed but can't use it. The problem is the capture mpeg files that WinDVD2 creates. They don't seem to work with most of the apps that you have mentioned in previous posts, and the indicapture is not compliant either. So I don't have a whole lot of options. What will Vdub mpeg version do to improve matters? That is, if it accepts the mpegs files.
One thing that truly surprised me was that the S-Video out of the JVC SVHS into the indicapture s-video in, did not really improve the video quality at all. ??? I thought it would, but no. Why not? Thanks for your suggestions.
Cheers!
Joanr
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Minion
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19. August 2004 @ 13:42 |
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If you are Captureing to Mpeg2 allready then any encodeing no matter how good it is will Lower the Quality and would be a Useless Step because the Captured files are allready in the Correct Format....
I would suggest you download something like DVDLab and try it...It will Not encode your Captured file and has much better authoring Features than any Program in it"s Price range....
And because it doesn"t re-encode your Files you will be able to create the DVD in less than a Half hour and with Better quality than if you were to re-encode the File....
Nero Vision Express is Notorius for it"s Crappy encodeing so if at all Possible I would use it in any Circumstances....
If most of the DVD authoring Apps will not accept the Captured file as DVD Compliant then it is because your Capture setting are not DVD Compliant....
What I use for Mpeg2/DVD Capture is "Intervideo WinDVR 3.0" and when useing a custom DVD profile or one of it"s own DVD profiles the Files are allways 100% DVD Compliant and it is one of the Best Mpeg2 Capture programs available....
Virtual-Dub-Mpeg2 wouldn"t be any use to you because it can Load Mpeg2 files but it can not encode to Mpeg2, and decompressing to AVI useing HuffYUV and then re-encodeing would produce the same Quality as Just re-encodeing the Mpeg2 file would....
So try to adjust you capture setting so that the Setting are DVD Compliant then you will not have to re-encode and you would achieve Better quality in a Much shorter Time.....
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Joanr
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19. August 2004 @ 16:05 |
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Thanks Minion, I'll try the Windvr3.0 and see if it will accept the TDK capture device. Hopefully. And you are right, it is taking a long time having to re-encode the mpeg files. I'll try the DVDlab also. I'm using the DVD Template that comes with WinDVD2 for the capture, you'd think it would be 100% compliant, but who knows.
Amd what about the S-video issue? I read to only capture using an s-video output from a VCR, so I searched the net looking for such a creature and only found two. The JVC which ran about $150.00 and then some pro models that cost well over 700 bucks. I can't really see any improvement using the s-video. Is it a crap VCR or is it just useless for improving VHS quality? My cheapo samsung vcr captures look better than the JVC s-video. Thanks again.
Cheers!
Joanr
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Minion
AfterDawn Addict
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19. August 2004 @ 19:05 |
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S-Video should Produce a Clearer Image but if It isn"t then i wouldn"t know why...I know on my DVD Player I get a Much Better Image useing the S-Video over the RCA Jacks and I get Better quality useing the S-Video output on my Digital cable Box over the RCA Jacks so i don"t know why it isn"t better for You....
It also could be that you Just don"t see the Improovement on your PC Monitor because PC Monitors display Video differently than TV Sets do, TV sets are Made to display interlaced Footage were Monitors disply Progressive Footage so you never get a True representation of how the Video truely looks when you see it on your Monitor.....
Cheers
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thbrad
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9. September 2004 @ 16:22 |
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I am investigating capturing VHS and enjoying this forum, thanks to all. Minion addrsses something I can't quite grasp yet, maybe unrelated. Resolution of a commercially puchased DVD movie.... Are they MPEG-2 and if so, a resolution of 720x480 doesn't sound like something that would look good on a big screen TV, maybe a 15" computer screen. I realize resolution on a Computer monitor (pixels per inch) is different that resolution on on a TV screen, but haven't quite gotten a refernece on this from PhotoShop User's Forums etc. Minion (or anyone) know where you can get a good explaination? Tried the glossary.
Finally: Is the resolution of commerial DVD's 720x480?
What processor clock rates are needed for capture to AVI and MPEG-2 so that you end up with close to same quality as original?
What is DVD Compliant?
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Minion
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9. September 2004 @ 17:49 |
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All Standard NTSC TV sets are the same Resolution, From the Small 13in TV sets to the Big screen(Non-HD) TV sets....NTSC TV signals are Transmited with 525 Lines of Resolution at 60hz so all standard TV"s have to be Made to those specifications..
HDTV"s on the Other hand use up to 4 times the resolution of a standard TV Set....
The Max Resolution a regular TV set can display is only slightly bigger than the Full D1 DVD resolution(720+480)...
Your PC Monitor can display Video at a Much Higher resolution than a TV set and even Higher than a HDTV set Plus it displays Video as Progressive Frames were your TV set Displays Video one Field at a time which only utilizes half of the TV"s resolution at any one time....
You probably have Noticed that Video Looks Crisper and Clearer on a Small TV set as Opposed to those Older Big screen TV"s which looked Blurry when you got up close, This is Because those Big screen TV"s have to display the same ammount of Pixels and Lines of resolution as a Small TV does but it has to spread them over a Larger Screen area which makes the Video loose it"s detail and crispness....
It is the same when you try to watch a Movie file at full screen on your PC Monitor, You will probably notice that it looses it"s detail but in a small window it looks a Lot better.....
The Video on a Standard NTSC DVD uses a resolution of 720+480 and it is stored in Mpeg2 format, But that is Not the Only Resolution that can be used to Make DVD"s...
The NTSC DVD Video Standard Allows for 4 different Resolutions that can be used to Make DVD"s, and useing these other resolutions allow you to get more Video on a DVD because they use a Lower resolution and a Lower bitrate to encode them which means you can fit more on a DVD...
These are the Resolutions you can use to Make a NTSC DVD:
Full D1...Broadcast D1....Half D1.....SIF/CIF........
720+480.....704+480.......352+480 ....352+240........
2 hours.....2 hours.......4 Hours ....6 Hours........
.4750kbs....4750kbs.......2175kbs.....1475kbs........
.Mpeg 2......Mpeg 2........Mpeg2 ...Mpeg1 & Mpeg2....
DVD Quality.DVD quality.SVCD Quality.VCD/VHS Quality..
Those are the Names of the Standards and approximately the amount of Video you can fit each DVD useing these other DVD Standards when useing the Correct bitrate and the Quality you can achieve useing these Standards.....
Well I hope this Explains some of Your Questions...
Cheers
PS: "DVD Compliant" means a File that Conforms to the DVD Standard, A 640+480 Mpeg2 file is Not DVD Compliant but a "720+480 or a 352+480 or 352+240" Mpeg2 file is DVD Compliant and as long as it"s audio is DVD Compliant meaning it is at 48000hz and either LPCM/Wav ,Mpeg1 Layer 2,DTS, Or Dolby AC3 audio....
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thbrad
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10. September 2004 @ 03:37 |
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I take it from your answer that:
Movie DVD?s purchased at Wal-Mart are MPEG-2 providing a resolution of 720+480, which is as good as it get when viewed on a standard NTSC TV. Your other answers provided me with several paths to take for further edification. I plan to find out how you relate resolution (?x?) to bandwidth and lines of resolution. But at least I now know that converters producing 720x480 will (from a resolution standpoint anyway), allow me to transfer from tape or video sources to DVD with the results I need. One down; more to go.
ANYWAY, I cannot properly express my appreciation for such a complete answer to my question(s). I spent 20 years as a television broadcast engineer, but some of the home video recording (AVI, MPEG etc) is a bit hard to get at. Happily I did my research and purchased digital hardware and software that has let me make DVD?s flawlessly from the very first, but now analog? Always another mountain (I know).
Sidebar: I was given a copy of Pinnacle 9 and their firewire capture box to evaluate, but according to their manual my P4 1.7GHz Pent with 1 GB RAM (Dell PWS 340) is not good enough. The outside of the box says 800 Mhz minimum, 1.5 Ghz recommended, but inside (in the manual) they state the software does not allow capture to MPEG-2 if the processor is less than 2.2 Ghz. Surprise! Fortunately, I am not on the hook and will return it today. I?ll do some more research before trying another system. I?m really thinking better to capture AVI, then convert to MPEG-2 for DVD. I need to learn more about these file types (AVI, MPEG, VOP, IFO, BUP, ISO etc.)
AGAIN, A BIG "THANK YOU"!! and Best Regards.
P.S. Don?t you ever sleep?
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