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Advice on Building a PC
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sentence
Junior Member
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29. June 2009 @ 23:34 |
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Hey everyone, I just realized I've been lurking around this site for probably 3 years now and finally decided to register! I've searched around here for answers to my problems before and found some great help. I have recently decided to undergo the task of building my own computer! I have already done hours of research, but have decided to take it to the experts. I'm not exactly "swimming in gold" at the moment and unfortunately am looking at about a $450 budget (no more than $500 at the most). I already have a lot of the things I need and don't plan on using it for gaming so it shouldn't be too terrible. I plan on doing several upgrades throughout the next 1-2 years so it needs to be reasonably upgradable. I already have a pretty good idea on what I will be needing and am fairly knowledgeable when it comes to computers.
What I have:
Monitor
Keyboard/Mouse
External Hard Drive
CD/DVD Burner
Vista Ultimate/XP (I'm debating which one to use at the moment, doesn't really matter to me.)
What I need:
2-4 GB of RAM (more if my budget can afford it)
I'm thinking a quad core processor, here?
The graphics card doesn't really matter, as long as it's decent for now.
I'm not really too sure on the motherboard
Maybe a 320 GB hard drive, don't really need a lot since I have an external for mass storage
I'll also need a tower
Anything else I'll need (power supply, cables, etc.)
Almost everything I've looked at has been from newegg, but I'm fine with any other sites as long as they are fairly reputable. Before I buy the parts I'd like to know your opinions on what I should get and make sure it's compatible etc. Please keep it under $500 and keep in mind anything I said here can be lowered if it goes above the budget. Also, brands aren't a big deal to me. Right now I'm just thinking more bang for my buck.
Thanks and I hope I'm not asking too much.
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. June 2009 @ 10:33 |
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If you want to go with a Quad Core, i'll give you this link instead;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115041
The thing is, the Q6600 is an "old" processor now, and the price hasn't dropped on it for a whole year (since it was phased out, supplies have been going down and for some reason demand has gone up). I suggest you go with one of the newer Quad Cores and the one in the link above - the Q9550 - will use a little less power than the Q6600 even though it's running at 2.83GHz (430MHz more than the Q6600) because it's made using a smaller fabrication (45nm compared to 65nm), so i think it's worth the extra $20 ;)
For RAM, go with this;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166
Great price - though remember if you have a 32 bit operating system it will only use a bit over 3GB, and you might have to manually set it to 1066MHz in the BIOS.
Ooh, wait, can save you $5 if you don't mind going with 800MHz instead of 1066MHz (up to you);
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231207
For the graphics card i'm not really sure what to suggest - you don't want to game but you want something reasonably good...
I'd say go with something relatively low-end if you don't want to play games, i suggest something like the 9500GT;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127419
If you want to play new games, speak up now, because that card won't cut it ;) It will, however, run Windows Aero perfectly, along with any other 2D task, and older 3D games such as Half Life 2.
Actually, if you want to go even lower, here's the 9400GT;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500081
If the rebate works out on that then you're getting a dedicated graphics card for practically nothing :P
For the power supply, go with the Corsair 400CX, it's their lowest range power supply, but it's still quite expensive, and that's because they make darn good power supplies and they know it;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139008
If you can get the rebate, however, that's an absolute steal.
And a 320GB hard-drive, just like you asked for ^.^
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136098
I'll let sammoris choose the motherboard and the case, since he knows more about these things than me ;) He'll no doubt wonder through this thread later on.
Ahh crap, i just added all the stuff up - if you go with all the most expensive stuff and we exclude rebates, then it already comes to $430 without a case or a motherboard...
I'll come back later and sort it out :P
EDIT: I suppose you could go with a Dual Core instead, such as this;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037
Would save you $60 off the bat - then with at least $130 for the case and motherboard, it's possible.
EDIT 2:
A solid case;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042
A solid motherboard;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128372
Those together equal $155... If you go with the worse RAM and graphics card, then we get the price down to $510 without any rebates, but i think we can get it a little lower than that.
Still think Sam would be able to offer more insight into the case and board though, so i'll sit and wait.
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. June 2009 @ 16:41
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sentence
Junior Member
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30. June 2009 @ 11:43 |
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Right now I'm looking at about $555 including rebates. If I went with the dual core that would shed an additional 60 bucks and making the total about $495. Would I need any additional parts besides the main things? Like cables or anything, or should everything come with the parts?
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4 product reviews
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30. June 2009 @ 13:56 |
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Shokz's build
CPU: 10/10 (Q9550) - I spy a $10 price cut, making this an excellent value CPU. 8/10 (E8400) - Quad cores are really the future, $168 for a dual core of any caliber is a bit much.
RAM: 10/10 (8500) - $50 for 4GB of decent quality PC8500, no problem here.
7/10 (6400) - $45 for 4GB of PC6400 is pricey, and no heatspreaders is a worry.
GPU: 5/10 (9500GT), 5/10 (9400GT) - pricey for very poor graphics cards. Since gaming is not on the to do list, HD video is the only thing a graphics card will be needed for, and for that, keeping within $50 (well, almost), this should be better for the job:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102838
PSU: 10/10 - The best low-end PSU. Newegg keep changing the price up and down though. I preferred it when it was $50...
HDD: 7/10 - Only an 8MB cache 320GB HDD. An extra $10 buys you this instead: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073
Case: 10/10 - One of, if not the best low-end case.
Motherboard: 9/10 - A good low-midrange board. If overclocking is not to be considered, you need not even spend this much though, this would do fine:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128380
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. June 2009 @ 16:34 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
7/10 (6400) - $45 for 4GB of PC6400 is pricey, and no heatspreaders is a worry.
You won't find PC2 6400 for much less, though i did just see some Patriot with nice timings for $44;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820220396
You could also get two $21 (therefore $42) 2 x 1GB Corsair (it's CAS6, mind);
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148163
Good call on the GPU and motherboard, though, i didn't know the 4650 was that cheap... Still, i think the 9400GT stands if you take into account the rebate :P It should still accomplish anything he needs it for - but of course rebates don't exactly always work out.
I'd agree with the cheaper motherboard, i was just skimming through for something reasonable but that i'd heard was good - that model ($80) doesn't seem much worse than the $95 one - though i did notice the $80 one doesn't mention packaging, so i don't know if it comes with cables or not (SATA etc).
I have to admit i didn't notice the cache size when choosing the hard-drive; i just looked for one of the cheapest 320GB and went with it, but you can't really say no to $10 for double the cache size and an extra 180GB of storage.
-----
Just like to point out a section of one of the newegg reviews for the 320GB i linked to;
Quote:
There is 320 Gigs on the drive but u only get to use 298 Gigs, because the 22gigs u don't see is used for the F.A.T.(File Allocation Table).
Don't you love it when people pretend to know what they're talking about when actually they don't? ;)
320GB x 1000 x 1000 x 1000 / 1024 / 1024 / 1024 = 298GB
I think you'll find that's all you ever had, Mr :P You don't lose anything to FAT - especially considering Windows uses NTFS now -.-
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. June 2009 @ 17:10
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. June 2009 @ 17:30 |
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The 9400GT is cheap, but not really much better than integrated graphics. That and the HD4350 is better suited to the job imo.
The PC6400 memory is cheap as a whole, but without heatspreaders, it's unexemplary.
As it happens, FAT did steal space. NTFS, however, doesn't.
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sentence
Junior Member
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30. June 2009 @ 17:43 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. June 2009 @ 18:34
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30. June 2009 @ 18:08 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
The 9400GT is cheap, but not really much better than integrated graphics. That and the HD4350 is better suited to the job imo.
The PC6400 memory is cheap as a whole, but without heatspreaders, it's unexemplary.
As it happens, FAT did steal space. NTFS, however, doesn't.
That's what i meant :P But also, FAT doesn't use up nearly as much space as that guy made out - it's the same as saying in a 4GB flash drive, 275MB would be for FAT allocation. After that and the 1000 to 1024 conversion, there'd be nothing left ;)
Anyway, that's going to be a very solid computer for someone who doesn't game :)
How about Windows 7 RC 64 bit? :P
I think i'm in love with Windows 7, i've set it up so it's got a blue theme with this great blue background - i'll screenshot it some time :D
Anyway, you say that you want to upgrade it over the next couple of years, but with those components you really shouldn't have to - even if you decided you wanted to game at some point, all you'd need to do is swap the PSU and GPU.
Solid computer for a great price, and unless your motherboard doesn't come with sata cables, you shouldn't need anything else separately.
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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30. June 2009 @ 18:25 |
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That looks like a good build, especially for the price. Win7 RC would be my choice as well since it's free for 9 months :P
All the cables you need will be supplied with the components.
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sentence
Junior Member
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30. June 2009 @ 18:32 |
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Before I order it I'm going to leave this open to discussion another day. I want to make sure I'm getting what I need. Is there anything else I will need? From what I read in the specifications that motherboard should be fine for audio and an ethernet based internet connection, correct?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. June 2009 @ 22:53
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. June 2009 @ 23:58 |
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Yes. The board (like any other half-decent board out there right now) has 7.1 surround sound and gigabit ethernet.
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sentence
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1. July 2009 @ 00:03 |
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Can you recommend a decent wireless card for cheap?
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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1. July 2009 @ 00:14 |
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sentence
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2. July 2009 @ 13:27 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 13:37
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2. July 2009 @ 13:46 |
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I'd be willing to bet every graphics card comes with at least one adapter - my last card had two DVI to VGA adapters and a DVI to HDMI adapter :o
And why the better card? Decided to game after all? That's kind of a no-mans-land kinda card - faster than you need for 2D stuff, not fast enough for good settings on modern games.
EDIT:
Actually, just read one of the reviews...
Quote:
It plays Fallout 3 Ultra High settings 1680x1050 with no lag, it also stays very cool [hence Ice Q].
If that's true I'll have to eat my own hat... But honestly, I don't think my 8800GT could have managed that - at max settings at 1440x900 I swear it started to lag (maybe 25 fps at lowest, but still), not that I've played it in a while.
Though he does also say this;
Quote:
Not only that but it supports HDMI, and not only that, it amazingly not only transfers video to your TV, but sound also.
Surprised HDMI carries video and sound? :P
My DVI to HDMI carries sound just fine with my lovely SPDIF motherboard cable (gosh, both video and sound via DVI?!). Sorry for the mocking tone and all :P
(SPDIF also provided by the ever loving Gainward along with their copious amounts of adapters)
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 14:25
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2. July 2009 @ 14:17 |
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2. July 2009 @ 14:37 |
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In that case, it'll be fine - but I'm at a loss as to why the recommended is a HD2600 and above or a 8800GT and above... even an 8600GTS easily beats the HD2600...
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
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2. July 2009 @ 16:30 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 16:51
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2. July 2009 @ 20:48 |
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Well, at the moment, there's not much benefit from going with a Quad Core rather than a Dual Core (in most things the E8400 and the Q9550 would be roughly the same performance wise), but programs that utilise all four cores (programs are now starting to make use of them all) will see the Q9550 pretty much obliterate the E8400. If you're going to get a quad core, the Q9550 is a much better buy than the Q6600, but as i've said before, it's really up to you what you want to do - $60 is still a reasonable amount of money and i don't think if you got the E8400 you'd use the computer and go "oh no look how slow it is", because it really wouldn't be :P
If i were you, i'd go with the Q9550, simply because i think that even Dual Cores are in the decline now (despite quite a few people still on single cores) - i think programmers have started to take much more notice of the Quad Core market.
Anyway, onto the graphics card - the 9600GSO is actually worse than the HD4670 in most games, interstingly enough, so don't always pay attention to your friends :P
If you really want to go with a good graphics card, then the HD4850 is probably the best deal on newegg;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102770
(Same price as the 9800GT which is nearly 20% worse - what's nVidia playing at in the US?)
Interesting thing is, the budget for the graphics card has just gone up and up and up, so i think i'm going to put a cap on it here. The HD4850's certainly good for gaming - it won't make the big boys turn their heads, but it's very respectable and will play any modern game you throw at it at least reasonably well (that means Crysis at mostly high), and should last you at least a couple of years.
You should, however, get the Corsair 450VX instead of the Corsair 400CX to power it as it draws more power than the lower end cards.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.as...39003&Tpk=450vx
Overall that does push up the price by a fair amount, so it's up to you to decide what to do - if you don't mind passing off the gaming aspect then you can save well over $50...
EDIT:
Acually, no, wait, there's a GTS250 for $100 as well... I'll get back to you on that one >.<
EDIT 2:
Scrap it, i really don't trust rebates all too much - and the MSI one that's actually $100 off the bat is apparently not all too good...
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 20:56
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sentence
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2. July 2009 @ 20:57 |
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I've actually decided to go with the 650W =P
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005
Great deal!
So if I didn't get this card and decided to go for a little less expensive card what would you recommend? That way I can think about it with the two in front of me.
<EDIT>
Basically can you put up two choices of cards so I can make a final decision. I'm 100% set with everything else I'm buying this is my final big decision, thanks for all the help!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 20:59
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2. July 2009 @ 21:42 |
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Going with the E8400 or the Q9550? :P
And even though it's only an extra $20 - $25 for the better PSU (depending on which way you look at it), unless you're gunna randomly do some crazy overclocking and add an extra card for Crossfire / SLI then it's un-needed.
The PSU, whilst a vital component to get right, is a matter of, "if it's a high enough wattage, it works, if it's not, it doesn't", not "the higher the wattage, the better the computer works", unlike every other component.
Anyway, the cheaper card i would suggest is the HD4650 Sam mentioned earlier;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102838
The more expensive is still the HD4850;
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102770
They're almost neck for neck performance wise - the HD4850 is a little over twice as good as the HD4650 and a little under twice as expensive.
And just FYI - "Heart Of Fire EP" by "Interpartysystem" - randomly listening to it over and over because i can't be bothered to change the track and it sounds pretty damn cool on my headphones :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkKdfn9GpcU
Reasonably poor quality YouTube version but it'll do :P
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 21:43
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sentence
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2. July 2009 @ 21:52 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. July 2009 @ 22:00
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2. July 2009 @ 22:54 |
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To tell you the truth, i don't know the benefits of the P45 over the P43...
As far as i can tell if you're not going to overclock anything, they should perform about the same, but i'd wait to see what Sam has to say on the matter :)
PSP, all the way from 1.00 to 5.50 GEN D2 - DS Lite w/ M3DS Real (M3 Sakura v1.34)
PS3 3.01 - iPod Touch 2G 16GB Jailbroken - Xbox 360 60GB - PC, Q6600, 3GB DDR2, GTX260 (216) 896MB
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. July 2009 @ 00:16 |
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sentence: The HD4670 is a marked improvement from the HD4650 for performance, but unless you game you probably won't notice the difference from the 4650. Additionally, if you buy one, you don't need the huge HIS cooler on it, they are not hot-running cards in the slightest.
All new cards have DVI-VGA adapters, and usually DVI-HDMI adapters as well.
Shokz: The HD4670 is a remarkable card for the money (and power usage - no 6-pin!), it competes with the HD3870 and 8800GS/9600GSO, not quite 8800GT standard, that's the HD4830's territory.
Sentence: The PC version of Guitar Hero 3 was a shocking port, it was pretty poorly done, and I wouldn't really spend lots of money on getting it running. I could run it up to about 1680x1050 with my HD3870 but it was a bit laggy, the game is really quite demanding (for no reason, it's just badly programmed)
Shokz: With console ports, especially bad ones, the brand skewing for graphics requirements goes out the window, I wouldn't try and analyse that :P
Sentence: The 9600GSO is actually a bit slower than the HD4670 in a lot of things, and it costs more, a typical nvidia trend at this end of the market.
There's definitely no need to buy a Q6600, it's old, slow and very overpriced. You want a new generation 45nm quad core, the Q9550 is leaps and bounds ahead of the Q6600, which is why it costs more. The Q8200 is its comparison, the Q8400 is shaping up to be a good value chip right now, about 10-15% faster than the Q6600, uses 15% less power, and actually costs $15 less!
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115057
Going with video work, a quad core is always what I would recommend, there's simply no reason not to, the dual cores are just too expensive at this end of the market to justify it.
Okay, long story short, this is your final lineup:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136073
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102770
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139008 (that's as much power as you need)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128380
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115057
No DVD drive?
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sentence
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3. July 2009 @ 01:13 |
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Sounds great, thank you sooo much!!!
I'm definitely going with the quad core. So you are 100% positive the 400W will be enough? The system requirements say 450 or more for the GPU, I'd rather spend the extra 40 then have something go wrong.
So I should go with this GPU?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102770
For the DVD drive, I was hoping this one would be ample since I already own it.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106278
It's USB 2.0... if I do get a different DVD drive in the future it needs to be able to burn DVD+DLs VERY WELL. I burn Xbox 360 games on a daily basis and I don't plan on getting the banhammer.
About GH3, the only reason I want to play it is to have a better system of testing of custom songs I make rather than injecting them into the ark of the PS2 version, recompiling, and then burning. I'm not in it for the graphics and would most likely use this software.
http://www.scorehero.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=44851
If you want to know what I mean by customs here's a guide written by yours truly.
http://rockband.scorehero.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25086
It out to be an interesting read. If you want you can take a look at this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AAQh6DwnTJQ
I'm actually much better at the plastic drums, but my PS2 set is broken. I play real drums too so hopefully I won't be ridiculed nearly as bad *wink*
The reason I wanted to go with a farily decent GPU is in anticipation of if I decide I want to start playing PC games. Playing without the "best" settings is fine for me.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. July 2009 @ 01:20
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