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worried about burn in.
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diabolos
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4. October 2005 @ 18:11 |
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CKY_2084, have your ever seen a $4,000 Plasma screen with burn-in? The better question is, do you think manufatures spend billions annually on a technology that is flawed? No, they don't. Do you think more retailers (including CC) have begun selling Plasma because noone wants to buy them cause they won't last? That would be bad customer serivce.
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after leaving it on for20 hrs it produced a burn in image
Wow, your customer specialest sounds like a moron. CC employees don't work on commission! Did he attempt to white wash? Why is he such a careless person?
Truth:
Quote:
Well it's obvious you don't know that plasma's were developed in the 70's
And I thought I was the only person who knew that...lol. Excellent job poolpro. Eh, look at that we agreed on something :)
Plasma TV history:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_tv#History
Myth:
Quote:
Plasma sales have been on the decline since large LCD screens were possible.
Truth:
Plasma sales have been on the rise due to competitive pricing by name brands. Also Flat Panel LCD screens are no larger than 40" inches. You can't mount a projection LCD flush to the wall!
--LATER--
Warrantys and stuff:
http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=54474
LCD vs Plasma:
http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=technologyN...
Flat panel TV sales forcast:
http://www2.sbsun.com/entertainment/ci_2950391
Keep it comin, good stuff thus far!
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 4. October 2005 @ 20:23
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poolpro
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5. October 2005 @ 06:51 |
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The other thing that you have to get for a plasma tv to look great is a CLEAN POWER FILTER which is another at least for a cheaper one is $300. It seems funny that a plasma supposedly being a great tv that you have to buy other equipment to make it look top notch.
I just wouldn't pay for something so expensive that's will run the risk of getting burn in.
I asked an old high school buddy of mine at Best Buy that why the majority of plasma tv's went down $1000 and he told me that at the meeting they have that they were getting alot of complaints about the picture not looking the way it does in the store and that people were also complaining about images staying to long on the screen.
I mean it's obvious Diabolos that you are fixated on Plasma so good for you and I'm fixated on a worry free tv in DLP OR LCD so let's leave it at that.
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diabolos
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5. October 2005 @ 16:38 |
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I said it before and I'll say it again. I'm not trying to argue. It just seems that people love misconceptions. If a sales person has to bash a technology because they don't know about it or don't think they can sell it, they are wrong and should be charged with misrepresenting the sale.
The latest is:
Half a Myth:
Quote:
you have to get for a plasma tv to look great is a CLEAN POWER FILTER which is another at least for a cheaper one is $300. It seems funny that a plasma supposedly being a great tv that you have to buy other equipment to make it look top notch.
Truth:
1) Clean Power will help any piece of electronics preform at its best. It has nothing to do with Plasma. I sell it and recommend it to everyone.
2) All digital tvs require a digital source and good quality hook-ups to preform at thier best even at standard quality.
It comes down to your life-style, budget, and what makes since to you as a person.
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. October 2005 @ 16:42
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BIGBOB22
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5. October 2005 @ 18:20 |
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I have been watching this back and forth between poolpro, diabolos and others regarding Plasma Displays vs DLP, LCD, LCOS, Etc. and just have to respond...
It looks like most people here are looking for good solid info not A/V Urban Legands, with that said, here goes:
First and foremost it is an exercise in futility to attempt to argue that Plasma displys are not susceptible to "burn-in". Virtually all of the manufacturers of Plasma displays will tell you that ANY static image displayed over a given period of time, can and most likely will damage the panel! (Pixel orbiting or shifting, whitewash and other schemes not withstanding)
What poolpro found with his own research would occur over and over with any Plasma display. In addition, depending on how high the contrast was set, it could and does occur in even shorter periods of time! Even the ESPN logo will "burn-in" on set tuned to that channel for long periods of time. In fact, the ESPN logo is so bright, it will "Burn-in" on CRT's displayed in retail stores. Video Games, forget about it...
Secondly, when it comes to the resolution of Plasma vs DLP, LCOS, DILA, SXRD, or LCD (which has not even been addressed) it is not even close! Most Plasma displays have a "Native" resolution of either 1366 x 768 or 1024 x 1024 allowing them to resolve just over 1,000,000 pixels or 720P. In contrast, DLP(3 chip), LCOS(3 chip), DILA(3 chip), SXRD(3 chip) and LCD(3 panel) can display 1920 x 1080 allowing them to resolve 2,200,000 plus pixels or 1080P! It is not even close! (to be fair, you could spend $75,000.00 on an LG 71" Plasma and get 1920 x 1080 or $100,000.00 for the Samsung 100" coming soon) Also the "Black Level" of DLP, LCOS, DILA and SXRD is very close to the best CRT's, while Plasma displays really only render what could be called dark grey at best. Plasma displays do have up to 160 degrees viewing angle which is outstanding.
Then if you want to talk about 9" CRT's with the Accurate Inaging 9, Reference 9X, Runco, Sony G90, and others having the ability to resolve 3200 x 1600 and better, some able to resolve over 2000 lines, double 1080P HDTV! plus, the best "Black level" period.
As for the lifespan issue, what a laugh. Very few if anyone on this forum has stayed with the same display for even 8 or 10 years, let alone for 18. In addition, when you replace a lamp, the display then performs as BRAND NEW!, while the plasma gets dimmer every second it is powered up, the same as a CRT! So, give it a rest!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. October 2005 @ 18:30
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BIGBOB22
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6. October 2005 @ 10:56 |
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[Quote] have you ever seen a $4,000 Plasma with burn-in?
ANSWER: YES MANY TIMES, EVEN SOME $15,000 PLASMAS. COST MEANS ZERO, IT IS THE TYPE OF DISPLAY THAT IS THE PROBLEM.
ANY PLASMA DISPLAY WILL SUFFER BURN-IN WHEN DISPLAYING A STATIC IMAGE FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME OR EVEN A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME IF THE CONTRAST IS SET AT A HIGH LEVEL (AS IT OFTEN IS IN SHOWROOMS) PERIOD, END OF STORY! PIXEL ORBITING OR SHIFTING, WHITEWASH AND OTHER SCHEMES ARE OF VERY LITTLE VALUE AND WILL NOT CORRECT A DAMAGED PANEL.
DIABOLOS, IF PLASMAS CAN NOT BE BURNED-IN, I HAVE A NUMBER OF DAMAMGED PANELS I WOULD LOVE TO SELL YOU AT DEALER COST BECAUSE YOU MUST BE ONE OF THE FEW PEOPLE IN THE WORLD WHOSE VISION IS SO POOR THAT YOU CAN'T NOTICE THE GHOST IMAGES BURNED INTO THESE DISPLAYS. IT WOULD NOT SURPRISE ME IN THE LEAST, IF IN FACT YOU EVEN OWN A PLASMA DISPLAY, THAT YOUR DISPLAY HAS BURN-IN ISSUES! YOU JUST CANT SEE THEM. THATS OK, NOT EVERYONE HAS GOOD VISION. PERHAPS GLASSES OR CONTACTS WOULD ASSIST YOU...
YOU ARE FIGHTING A FIGHT THAT YOU CAN NOT WIN. EVEN THE PLASMA PANEL MANUFACTURERS WILL TELL YOU NOT TO DISPLAY STATIC IMAGES ON THIS TYPE OF DISPLAY OR YOU MAY SUFFER GHOSTING OR IMAGE BURN-IN! THIS IS ALSO TRUE FOR ANY TYPE OF CRT, WHETHER YOU ARE TAKING ABOUT CONVENTIONAL TUBES (RARELY SEEN, BUT POSSIBLE) OR PROJECTORS!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. October 2005 @ 17:19
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poolpro
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6. October 2005 @ 11:20 |
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Exceptionally put BIGBOB22
You know your stuff. Big Ups to you.
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diabolos
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6. October 2005 @ 15:57 |
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Quote:
IF PLASMAS CAN NOT BE BURNED-IN
I never said that.
I'm not fighting the truth.
What I said is that it isn't as big of a deal as everyone says it is! I know about ghosting and burn-in.
Are you saying that permanent burn-in is unavoidable? Are you saying that the newer plasmas are as susceptible as older models?
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COST MEANS ZERO, IT IS THE TYPE OF DISPLAY THAT IS THE PROBLEM.
I agree with that stament. The LG that I sell leaves ghosting screens like crazy. But, its by no means permanent or noticeable.
How did the screens you have get damaged?
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ANY PLASMA DISPLAY WILL SUFFER BURN-IN WHEN DISPLAYING A STATIC IMAGE FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME OR EVEN A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME IF THE CONTRAST IS SET AT A HIGH LEVEL
Each cell has an amount of memory. The longer its a certain color the longer it wants to stay that color.
Are you saying that no amount of white-washing could help the situation, even a tiny bit?
Looks like I stirred up the hornets-nest! Well its why I love this place so...
Ced
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BIGBOB22
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8. October 2005 @ 09:06 |
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Diabolos : Good points. I should have been more specificand not painted everything with such a broad stroke.
1)
A) Permanent burn-in is NOT unavoidable if you are careful about not displaying static images for extended periods of time, Also, like everything, some displays are more suceptible than others.
B) You are correct that newer models are much better than the early generation sets were. No question about that!
The basic point is that DLP, LCOS and LCD do not have and have never had these worries, although LCD panels can have some different issues (minor) that I know you are aware of...
2)
A) True
B) Customers playing video games for extended periods and commercial customers (sports bars and universities) displaying the same channels for 18 hours or more per day. In the case of one university, some of the displays are on 24 hours per day in several locations of a student center.
3)
A) No Pixel Orbiting or Shifting and others similar schemes can and do prevent a certain amount of ghosting and burn-in depending on the source material and length of display of said material. Whitewashing can and does eliminate or reduce ghosting in the short term. With that said, the fact remains that once a panel suffers long term serious burn-in, there is no other solution except to replace it.
Good measured response diabolos. I came at you pretty strong. Bob
FASTEST OFFSHORE BOAT IN 1982 "LOVE IT" WORLD RECORD AT 103 MPH! |
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8. October 2005 @ 22:26 |
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thanx you guy. this threat give me a good understanding about plasma, lcd, dlp...etc.. but most people that i know they don't care about the quality. they just want their friends to see that they mounted 5 G on their wall... lol
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diabolos
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10. October 2005 @ 16:11 |
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@ everyone,
Awsome! :) I'm cool with everything that was said.
Not to pad myself on the back but I did make an excellent call here...
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The Sony grand wega is definitly a great tv but is starting to show its age. I mean rumor has it that a buget "Qualia" based projection is around the corner. Sony has already shifted its high-end projections to LCos from LCD. I believe that next year, all the budget 1080p tvs will be DLP or LCos based!
A couple of days ago I saw the most beautiful picture I have ever had the pleasure to see with my own eyes at bestbuy. The Sony KDS-R60XBR1, which is 1080p capable, is my new favorite projection tv. Its LCos based (which is my favorite projection technology) and has an invisible pixel structure! It uses the SXRD chips, Sonys proprietary 3 Chip LCos design, just like the Qualia 006 and uses the WEGA light engine. I just wish I cold afford it. I mean, I felt like I was looking through someone elses eyes, literraly!
KDS-R60XBR1:
http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/eCS/Store/en/-...
Qualia products (Qualia 006):
http://www.qualia.sony.us/qualia_main.cgi
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. October 2005 @ 18:33
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BIGBOB22
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12. October 2005 @ 10:29 |
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Everyone: AGREED
The Sony R60XBR with Sony's SXRD 3 Chip LCOS is by far the most afforable and best performing display available at this time. They list for $13,000, but they can be found for around $10,000. Still alot of money, but you get full 1920 x 1080 capable of 1080p! I have this display showing 1080p and people are just blown away by the picture.
For the most part, when consumers go to a store to look at HDTV, the store may have models (like the R60)that are 720p or 1080i/1080p capable, but they lack the ability to connect it directly to a 720p or 1080i/1080p source. Best Buy, Circuit City, Etc. or at least all that I have been to, can not show this set to it's fullest capabilities because they lack a direct connection to 1080i/1080p and in some cases even 720p sources in their stores, and it still looks great!
Also a good outboard Video Processor (DVDOIScan, Faroudja Native Rate)is a must with this set so that you can feed it 480 DVD and let it upconvert it to 1080p, DSS and DISH 720p would be upconverted, while 1080 would pass thru unprocessed connected by a single DVI/HDMI cable. They will do a much better job of upconverting and adjusting aspect ratios then any display will (I would recommend only the best available from StraightWire, Monster, Audio Quest, XLO, Kimber, Wireworld, or other top cable manufacturers) I can't stress enough how much difference high quality cables make at this level of performance!
When customers see this Sony properly set up (1080p Source directly connected, ISF calabration, proper room light levels) they now understand what all the fuss is about with HDTV for the first time.
Video Game Crowd: Play round the clock if you want with this display!
XBox360 should be the ultimate with this set since it outputs 1080!
Bob
FASTEST OFFSHORE BOAT IN 1982 "LOVE IT" WORLD RECORD AT 103 MPH!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. October 2005 @ 10:32
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diabolos
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28. October 2005 @ 21:30 |
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Down_Tube
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7. February 2006 @ 13:59 |
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