|
I think my motherboard is dead
|
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
14. September 2007 @ 06:52 |
Link to this message
|
I posted this in the software section first, because I thought it was a software problem. Here is the copy of my posts there:
It started 2 days ago. I went to use the computer (it was left on), but I found that it was in the process of restarting. But it came to a screen that said windows was not shutdown properly, etc. It gave me the options start in safe mode, start normaly, start at last known good point, and a few others. None of them would get windows to start. I would choose one, and the computer would restart. Tried this a few times. I tried leaving it off for 20 min, but still nothing
I left the computer off for a few hours, and tried it again. It took me to the same screen with the options, but thistime the "Last known good point" (Or whatever it is called) one started it. Was on for a few hours and it just shut down and restarted again. Same thing, it just kept restarting.
But now if I leave it off for like 20 or 30 min, it will work for a short time.
Here is the Hyjackthis log (in case it is needed):
Logfile of HijackThis v1.99.1
Scan saved at 10:51:13 AM, on 9/11/2007
Platform: Windows XP SP2 (WinNT 5.01.2600)
MSIE: Internet Explorer v6.00 SP2 (6.00.2900.2180)
Running processes:
C:\WINDOWS\System32\smss.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\winlogon.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\services.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\savedump.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\lsass.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\svchost.exe
C:\WINDOWS\System32\svchost.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\spoolsv.exe
C:\WINDOWS\Explorer.EXE
C:\Program Files\NavNT\vptray.exe
C:\Program Files\QuickTime\qttask.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\AOL\1142616145\ee\AOLSoftware.exe
C:\Program Files\Zone Labs\ZoneAlarm\zlclient.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\InstallShield\UpdateService\issch.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\RUNDLL32.EXE
C:\Program Files\Common Files\Real\Update_OB\realsched.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\AOL\ACS\AOLDial.exe
C:\Program Files\Java\jre1.6.0_01\bin\jusched.exe
C:\Program Files\Seagate\DiscWizard\DiscWizardMonitor.exe
C:\Program Files\Seagate\DiscWizard\TimounterMonitor.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\Seagate\Schedule2\schedhlp.exe
C:\Program Files\Messenger\msmsgs.exe
C:\Program Files\Google\GoogleToolbarNotifier\GoogleToolbarNotifier.exe
C:\Program Files\Yahoo!\Messenger\YahooMessenger.exe
C:\Program Files\Veoh Networks\Veoh\VeohClient.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\ctfmon.exe
C:\Program Files\Adobe\Acrobat 7.0\Reader\reader_sl.exe
C:\Program Files\BigFix\BigFix.exe
C:\Program Files\Metacafe\MetacafeAgent.exe
C:\Program Files\Real\RealPlayer\RealPlay.exe
C:\Program Files\Verizon Wireless\V CAST Music\V CAST Music Monitor.exe
c:\program files\common files\aol\1142616145\ee\services\antiSpywareApp\ver2_0_7\AOLSP Scheduler.exe
C:\Program Files\Vongo\Tray.exe
c:\program files\common files\aol\1142616145\ee\aolsoftware.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\Seagate\Schedule2\schedul2.exe
C:\PROGRA~1\COMMON~1\AOL\ACS\AOLacsd.exe
C:\Program Files\NavNT\defwatch.exe
C:\WINDOWS\eHome\ehRecvr.exe
C:\WINDOWS\eHome\ehSched.exe
C:\Program Files\ewido anti-malware\ewidoctrl.exe
C:\Program Files\NavNT\rtvscan.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\nvsvc32.exe
C:\Program Files\Common Files\New Boundary\PrismXL\PRISMXL.SYS
C:\Program Files\Vongo\VongoService.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\ZoneLabs\vsmon.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\MsgSys.EXE
C:\WINDOWS\system32\wscntfy.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\dllhost.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\rundll32.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\igfxsrvc.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\wuauclt.exe
C:\WINDOWS\system32\svchost.exe
C:\HJT\HijackThis.exe
R0 - HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Internet Explorer\Main,Start Page = http://www.gatewaybiz.com
O2 - BHO: btorbit.com - {000123B4-9B42-4900-B3F7-F4B073EFC214} - C:\Program Files\Orbitdownloader\orbitcth.dll
O2 - BHO: AcroIEHlprObj Class - {06849E9F-C8D7-4D59-B87D-784B7D6BE0B3} - C:\Program Files\Adobe\Acrobat 7.0\ActiveX\AcroIEHelper.dll
O2 - BHO: (no name) - {53707962-6F74-2D53-2644-206D7942484F} - C:\Program Files\Spybot - Search & Destroy\SDHelper.dll
O2 - BHO: SSVHelper Class - {761497BB-D6F0-462C-B6EB-D4DAF1D92D43} - C:\Program Files\Java\jre1.6.0_01\bin\ssv.dll
O2 - BHO: Google Toolbar Helper - {AA58ED58-01DD-4d91-8333-CF10577473F7} - c:\program files\google\googletoolbar4.dll
O2 - BHO: Google Toolbar Notifier BHO - {AF69DE43-7D58-4638-B6FA-CE66B5AD205D} - C:\Program Files\Google\GoogleToolbarNotifier\2.0.301.7164\swg.dll
O3 - Toolbar: AOL Toolbar - {4982D40A-C53B-4615-B15B-B5B5E98D167C} - C:\Program Files\AOL Toolbar\toolbar.dll
O3 - Toolbar: &Google - {2318C2B1-4965-11d4-9B18-009027A5CD4F} - c:\program files\google\googletoolbar4.dll
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [Recguard] C:\WINDOWS\SMINST\RECGUARD.EXE
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [vptray] C:\Program Files\NavNT\vptray.exe
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [QuickTime Task] "C:\Program Files\QuickTime\qttask.exe" -atboottime
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [HostManager] C:\Program Files\Common Files\AOL\1142616145\ee\AOLSoftware.exe
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [Zone Labs Client] "C:\Program Files\Zone Labs\ZoneAlarm\zlclient.exe"
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [ISUSPM Startup] "C:\Program Files\Common Files\InstallShield\UpdateService\isuspm.exe" -startup
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [ISUSScheduler] "C:\Program Files\Common Files\InstallShield\UpdateService\issch.exe" -start
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [NvCplDaemon] RUNDLL32.EXE C:\WINDOWS\system32\NvCpl.dll,NvStartup
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [nwiz] nwiz.exe /install
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [NvMediaCenter] RUNDLL32.EXE C:\WINDOWS\system32\NvMcTray.dll,NvTaskbarInit
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [TkBellExe] "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Real\Update_OB\realsched.exe" -osboot
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [AOLDialer] C:\Program Files\Common Files\AOL\ACS\AOLDial.exe
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [SunJavaUpdateSched] "C:\Program Files\Java\jre1.6.0_01\bin\jusched.exe"
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [KernelFaultCheck] %systemroot%\system32\dumprep 0 -k
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [DiscWizardMonitor.exe] C:\Program Files\Seagate\DiscWizard\DiscWizardMonitor.exe
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [AcronisTimounterMonitor] C:\Program Files\Seagate\DiscWizard\TimounterMonitor.exe
O4 - HKLM\..\Run: [Acronis Scheduler2 Service] "C:\Program Files\Common Files\Seagate\Schedule2\schedhlp.exe"
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [MSMSGS] "C:\Program Files\Messenger\msmsgs.exe" /background
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [updateMgr] C:\Program Files\Adobe\Acrobat 7.0\Reader\AdobeUpdateManager.exe AcRdS7_0_0
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [swg] C:\Program Files\Google\GoogleToolbarNotifier\GoogleToolbarNotifier.exe
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [Yahoo! Pager] "C:\Program Files\Yahoo!\Messenger\YahooMessenger.exe" -quiet
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [Veoh] "C:\Program Files\Veoh Networks\Veoh\VeohClient.exe" /VeohHide
O4 - HKCU\..\Run: [ctfmon.exe] C:\WINDOWS\system32\ctfmon.exe
O4 - Startup: Adobe Gamma.lnk = C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe\Calibration\Adobe Gamma Loader.exe
O4 - Startup: Metacafe.lnk = C:\Program Files\Metacafe\MetacafeAgent.exe
O4 - Startup: V CAST Music Monitor.lnk = C:\Program Files\Verizon Wireless\V CAST Music\V CAST Music Monitor.exe
O4 - Startup: Vongo Tray.lnk = ?
O4 - Global Startup: Adobe Reader Speed Launch.lnk = C:\Program Files\Adobe\Acrobat 7.0\Reader\reader_sl.exe
O4 - Global Startup: BigFix.lnk = C:\Program Files\BigFix\BigFix.exe
O4 - Global Startup: Metacafe.lnk = C:\Program Files\Metacafe\MetacafeAgent.exe
O4 - Global Startup: Microsoft Office.lnk = C:\Program Files\Microsoft Office\Office10\OSA.EXE
O8 - Extra context menu item: &AOL Toolbar search - res://C:\Program Files\AOL Toolbar\toolbar.dll/SEARCH.HTML
O8 - Extra context menu item: &Download by Orbit - res://C:\Program Files\Orbitdownloader\orbitmxt.dll/201
O8 - Extra context menu item: &Grab video by Orbit - res://C:\Program Files\Orbitdownloader\orbitmxt.dll/204
O8 - Extra context menu item: Do&wnload selected by Orbit - res://C:\Program Files\Orbitdownloader\orbitmxt.dll/203
O8 - Extra context menu item: Down&load all by Orbit - res://C:\Program Files\Orbitdownloader\orbitmxt.dll/202
O8 - Extra context menu item: E&xport to Microsoft Excel - res://C:\PROGRA~1\MICROS~2\Office12\EXCEL.EXE/3000
O8 - Extra context menu item: Get Flash by &Arty Flash Ripper - C:\Program Files\Softdigger\FlashRipper\IEMenu.htm
O9 - Extra button: AOL Toolbar - {4982D40A-C53B-4615-B15B-B5B5E98D167C} - C:\Program Files\AOL Toolbar\toolbar.dll
O9 - Extra 'Tools' menuitem: AOL Toolbar - {4982D40A-C53B-4615-B15B-B5B5E98D167C} - C:\Program Files\AOL Toolbar\toolbar.dll
O9 - Extra button: Research - {92780B25-18CC-41C8-B9BE-3C9C571A8263} - C:\PROGRA~1\MICROS~2\Office12\REFIEBAR.DLL
O9 - Extra button: Share in Hello - {B13B4423-2647-4cfc-A4B3-C7D56CB83487} - C:\Program Files\Hello\PicasaCapture.dll
O9 - Extra 'Tools' menuitem: Share in H&ello - {B13B4423-2647-4cfc-A4B3-C7D56CB83487} - C:\Program Files\Hello\PicasaCapture.dll
O9 - Extra button: Real.com - {CD67F990-D8E9-11d2-98FE-00C0F0318AFE} - C:\WINDOWS\system32\Shdocvw.dll
O9 - Extra button: Messenger - {FB5F1910-F110-11d2-BB9E-00C04F795683} - C:\Program Files\Messenger\msmsgs.exe
O9 - Extra 'Tools' menuitem: Windows Messenger - {FB5F1910-F110-11d2-BB9E-00C04F795683} - C:\Program Files\Messenger\msmsgs.exe
O16 - DPF: {17492023-C23A-453E-A040-C7C580BBF700} (Windows Genuine Advantage Validation Tool) - http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=39204
O16 - DPF: {70BA88C8-DAE8-4CE9-92BB-979C4A75F53B} (GSDACtl Class) - http://launch.gamespyarcade.com/software/launch/alaunch.cab
O16 - DPF: {A90A5822-F108-45AD-8482-9BC8B12DD539} (Crucial cpcScan) - http://www.crucial.com/controls/cpcScanner.cab
O16 - DPF: {F58E1CEF-A068-4C15-BA5E-587CAF3EE8C6} (MSN Chat Control 4.5) - http://chat.msn.com/controls/msnchat45.cab
O18 - Protocol: ms-help - {314111C7-A502-11D2-BBCA-00C04F8EC294} - C:\Program Files\Common Files\Microsoft Shared\Help\hxds.dll
O18 - Filter hijack: text/xml - {807563E5-5146-11D5-A672-00B0D022E945} - C:\PROGRA~1\COMMON~1\MICROS~1\OFFICE12\MSOXMLMF.DLL
O20 - Winlogon Notify: igfxcui - C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\igfxdev.dll
O20 - Winlogon Notify: NavLogon - C:\WINDOWS\system32\NavLogon.dll
O20 - Winlogon Notify: WgaLogon - C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\WgaLogon.dll
O23 - Service: Acronis Scheduler2 Service (AcrSch2Svc) - Acronis - C:\Program Files\Common Files\Seagate\Schedule2\schedul2.exe
O23 - Service: Adobe LM Service - Adobe Systems - C:\Program Files\Common Files\Adobe Systems Shared\Service\Adobelmsvc.exe
O23 - Service: AOL Connectivity Service (AOL ACS) - America Online, Inc. - C:\PROGRA~1\COMMON~1\AOL\ACS\AOLacsd.exe
O23 - Service: DefWatch - Symantec Corporation - C:\Program Files\NavNT\defwatch.exe
O23 - Service: ewido security suite control - ewido networks - C:\Program Files\ewido anti-malware\ewidoctrl.exe
O23 - Service: Google Updater Service (gusvc) - Google - C:\Program Files\Google\Common\Google Updater\GoogleUpdaterService.exe
O23 - Service: Norton AntiVirus Client (Norton AntiVirus Server) - Symantec Corporation - C:\Program Files\NavNT\rtvscan.exe
O23 - Service: NVIDIA Display Driver Service (NVSvc) - NVIDIA Corporation - C:\WINDOWS\system32\nvsvc32.exe
O23 - Service: PrismXL - New Boundary Technologies, Inc. - C:\Program Files\Common Files\New Boundary\PrismXL\PRISMXL.SYS
O23 - Service: Vongo Service - Starz Entertainment Group LLC - C:\Program Files\Vongo\VongoService.exe
O23 - Service: TrueVector Internet Monitor (vsmon) - Zone Labs, LLC - C:\WINDOWS\system32\ZoneLabs\vsmon.exe
Thank you for any help you can give. I really have no idea why it is doing this.
[ + quote]
Jason123
Junior Member
13. September 2007 @ 20:03 Link to this message
OK, now i think the motherboard is dead. I turn the computer on, and it does nothing now. The fan in the case and the power supply turn on, and the light on the DVD drive is one, but that is it. No other sign of life.
Any ideas?
|
|
Advertisement
|
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
14. September 2007 @ 09:05 |
Link to this message
|
|
Well, what's happened is you've got an instability, such that the PC became unstable and restarted and wasn't stable enough to run windows, and now isn't even stable enough to POST. This could be faulty memory or motherboard, there are other causes but those two are most likely. Do you have more than one stick of memory? if you do, you could try removing one and trying them single to see if the situation is rectified. If it is, then just replace the faulty stick of RAM, if it isn't, then it may be the motherboard. If you only have one stick of RAM, try and borrow someone else's, or make it time for an upgrade and buy more!
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
16. September 2007 @ 13:12 |
Link to this message
|
|
I just tried it with only one of the 2 memory sticks, than the other one. Still nothing. It is time for an upgrade anyway, so I am going to look for new parts.
Thank you.
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
19. September 2007 @ 16:36 |
Link to this message
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
2 product reviews
|
19. September 2007 @ 20:02 |
Link to this message
|
|
Do the fans turn on? Try all of them outside the case(wooden bench should be fine) with the bare essentials. Video card, keyboard, are essential. Also have everything plugged into the mobo and turn it on.
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
20. September 2007 @ 04:24 |
Link to this message
|
|
Check the obvious:
Power switch connected to the right header
20/24 pin ATX attached to motherboard firmly
Extra 4-pin +12V plug attached firmly
What make power rating is the power supply you used? The Power supply might even have been the cause of the original problem, and since you've gone with a cheap case it makes it all the more likely you've got a cheap power supply.
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
20. September 2007 @ 07:44 |
Link to this message
|
|
The power supply is a Power Up! 550W. When I get time tonight, I will try another power supply, but it will have lower watts though.
As best I can tell I have all the connections right. But I did have a problem with the power switch, reset switch, and a few others. The book tells you which one goes where, and which pin on the motherboard is for the positive and which for the negitave. But the connectors from the case are not marked as + or -. All of the connectors have one white wirer and one that is a different color (each connector has a different color). The only markng on the connector asside from what the switch is for is a G on the white wire side and a downward pointing arrow on the other wire's side.
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
20. September 2007 @ 11:40 |
Link to this message
|
|
Try using the power switch cable the other way up then. The power supply is pretty rubbish, so even if you get the PC working, you need to change it. It may very well have been that power supply that killed your old motherboard, so do it soon.
|
|
Huskie
Junior Member
|
20. September 2007 @ 12:08 |
Link to this message
|
|
For what it's worth, I was having the same random restarting problem with my A8N-SLI Deluxe. And just like you said, eventually it wouldn't even get me to windows again. It drove me almost insane and in the end it was the stupidest thing of all: the HD wire connector had a bit of dust/filth on one of it's ends. After I cleaned it, it went back to normal.
|
|
ianski7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
21. September 2007 @ 19:19 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hi, if all the connectors are correct and the cpu fan wire is plugged in, you probably got the front case connectors wrong. Disconnect all the front panel connectors. Check the manual for the proper jumpers to power the board. With a metal key,screwdriver, lightly touch the two jumpers for the power and see if it turns on. (BE SURE NOT TO TOUCH ANY OTHER PART OF THE BOARD!!) If it does, take your time and through trial and error you will get it right.....
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mohandas Gandhi
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
22. September 2007 @ 06:30 |
Link to this message
|
I just tried redoing the case connectors, still nothing. Then I tried an older PSU I had (The one that came with my old Gateway), it is 305W. But still nothing. Just the one light on the motherboard. And I tried to cross the power switch with a screwdriver the other day, but nothing.
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
22. September 2007 @ 07:02 |
Link to this message
|
Stick with the gateway power supply and then replace the motherboard. Throw away the Powerup unit, even if it doesn't appear faulty, it may have caused the problem.
|
|
ianski7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
22. September 2007 @ 07:39 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hi, try this.....
Disconnect every cable including power to wall
Remove cmos battery
Remove memory
Wait fo 2 minutes
Reconnect every thing and try to start it with the screwdriver.
Make sure the memory is in the proper slots..
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mohandas Gandhi
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
23. September 2007 @ 12:35 |
Link to this message
|
I did like you said ianski7, I removed everything (battery too), replaced it, connected the gateway psu, and still nothing.
Should I send back just the moterboard? The processor to? Might be causing the problem?
|
|
ianski7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
23. September 2007 @ 15:42 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hey, sounds like a good idea. If it's under warrenty and wont cost you any furher money let the seller check and replace if necessary.
I would return the board, cpu and memory......good luck
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mohandas Gandhi
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. September 2007 @ 15:43
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
1. October 2007 @ 09:11 |
Link to this message
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
1. October 2007 @ 10:56 |
Link to this message
|
|
Good choice, that's an excellent power supply.
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
5. October 2007 @ 20:32 |
Link to this message
|
|
I was just sent this email:
"Dear valued customer,
We have recently received the RMA you have sent back to us for replacement. This email is to inform you that your item is currently out of stock or has since been discontinued. Because we cannot guarantee when this item will be available, and you are within our 30-day refund time period, a full refund will be credited to your account.
This credit will be applied back to the card used to originally place the order. If this account is no longer active, a check can be requested. We deeply apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused. If you have any questions please don't hesitate to give us a call. It was truly a pleasure serving you and we hope for the opportunity to do business with you again in the near future.
If you have any questions or concerns, please direct your inquiries to rmabackorder@newegg.com or call 1-800-390-1119 during regular business hours for immediate assistance."
I do not know how New Egg does things. It is the memory that is out of stock, but will they refund all three parts I sent back (memory, CPU and board) or just the memory?
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
6. October 2007 @ 03:42 |
Link to this message
|
|
I would guess just the memory if that's what's out of stock, but not being in the US I don't use newegg so I couldn't say for sure.
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
6. October 2007 @ 06:29 |
Link to this message
|
|
They just sent me an email today that they are refunding all the parts I sent back.
|
|
ianski7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
7. October 2007 @ 07:12 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hey, make sure they refund the shipping costs if you shelled out any money to ship back the parts.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mohandas Gandhi
|
Senior Member
|
8. October 2007 @ 12:02 |
Link to this message
|
|
now thats greedy lol
i7 3770 12GB ram terrabyte sata drive 1 750Gb sata drive 285GTX graphics Sony dvdwriter same NZXT Nemesis case
Still playing Black Hawk Down why did I upgrade?
|
|
Jason123
Junior Member
|
9. October 2007 @ 07:43 |
Link to this message
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
9. October 2007 @ 08:01 |
Link to this message
|
|
Just be aware that no matter which brand it is, you'll get low quality parts, and the limited upgrades will ALWAYS cause you problems further down the line. I can appreciate why you can have limited patience, but if you have the knowledge to build your own PC, getting a premade like those simply isn't the answer.
|
|
Advertisement
|
|
|
|
ianski7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
9. October 2007 @ 09:23 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hey, looks like a decent system. As sammoris stated, the parts may be of cheaper quality but the only ones of real concern are the motherboard and power supply. The thing you should be concerned with is does this system suit your needs now and in the future. This system has only 2 SATA connectors(all i can see in the pic)and may only have 1 IDE channel.
If you plan on installing hard drives and optical drives, you may find that the board can't handle them. You then have to buy PCI cards for expansion of IDE or SATA. Right now it looks like the DVD is an IDE and the HD is SATA. If you want to add another IDE burner and drive, and if there is only 1 IDE channel, you will have to pick one or the other, or get a card.
What do you expect to install in the new machine?
The 410 systems all have only two standard PCI slots but they do have a x16 PCI for a video card.
The memory is 4 and 8GB capacity depending on model so its no problem.
This looks like a decent system for the price but be sure this will suit your needs.
Contact newegg and ask them what the capabilities of the motherboard are and you can decide then.
Oh and NO!!! Asking for return of the shipping charges that you spent on junk that wont work is not cheap....its smart and it lessens the aggravation...........
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. - Mohandas Gandhi
|
