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Soldering a modchip properly
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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17. March 2009 @ 06:34 |
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I've been using pci cards as tests boards to attempt to sauder 30awg wire on those TINY little legs that the wii has for the D2Pro chip and i have absolutely no success...
Apparently i am doing the technique wrong and i cant find any video online that breaks it down for me so hopefully someone here can help.
I have only been able to get 1 wire attached but it bridged so that test failed.
I'll tin the iron tip, tin the wire, there will be a small bead of solder about mid way down the wire or sometimes at the very tip. I take the wire, hold it to the leg( which is almost impossible too) and take the iron to heat up the wire... The solder never heats up enough to run down to the leg... then if i move the iron closer, i end up partially melting the leg...
One of my buddies told me to apply flux on a leg with a paper clip but that really didnt work either because if i were to put more on there, the flux would have been touching multiple legs.
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wiiNinja
Junior Member
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17. March 2009 @ 12:01 |
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I work in the electronic industry, and thought that I was pretty good at soldering, until I attempted to solder a WiiKey. I personally think that this is a job for the pros; they have the proper equipment (correct size soldering iron tip, heat gun, etc...), and the experience with surface mount components to accomplish the task. I gave up on the idea and paid someone to do it for me. That saved me the frustrations, and let me concentrate on playing the games.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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17. March 2009 @ 12:20 |
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I have the right tools that were to told to me by modchip users. Not personally but from research.
Anyway, it's my technique and it's killin me.
I already repair and mod some video game systems but I'd like to be able to do this as well as added experience.
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Junior Member
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17. March 2009 @ 13:03 |
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Full marks for practicing first!
Here are some suggestions: tape the wire into place, bring the iron to the wire whilst simultaneously moving the solder to the point where the iron and wire are touching. the solder should flow into and around the joint by capillary action. The whole process should take a second or less. Another technique is to load the solder on to the iron and bring it to the wire and pad which you have previously fluxed.
Make sure you are using a thin electronics grade solder - Don't use plumbing solder or plumbing flux!
Have a look on youtube there are a number of soldering videos on there.
I'm an electronics engineer - so I know which is the hot end and have the burns to prove it! ;-)
Pat Pending
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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17. March 2009 @ 13:58 |
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I'll try that method on this pci card I'm usin to test with.
I got a couple other ideas but I'll try yours.
I'll let u know what happens by tomorrow night.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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18. March 2009 @ 19:21 |
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I'm about to give up for real.
I clamped the wire vertically with the wire straight down to a leg. I held iron at the high end and applied solder at the midpoint... The solder ran all the way down to the leg and stopped right before getting there and solidified... As if it's not transferring enough heat through the wire!?!? I have a 640F iron.
I tried taping the wire down but i was getting way too close to the board and actually scarred it a couple times.
I started doin research on PCB precision soldering pens but they only go up to like 380F, my solder just barely melts below that point so that wont work either.
I wish there was non conductive solder... I could just spread it across the legs easy and line the wires up properly.
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Seewolf78
Junior Member
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18. March 2009 @ 19:38 |
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I haven't tried it with a Wii...but I've had great succes with a cold heat soldering iron in tight places. I'm not sure that it'll work in this situation, but it may be another avenue to try before pating someone or simply giving up on it. Either way best of luck, and as posted before ... Bravo for the practicing!
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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18. March 2009 @ 20:26 |
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well, i see how it's possible, and i also am experiencing on how my tools are aggravating me at the same time.
As soon as i get everything right, hehe, i might actually be able to do it right.
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. March 2009 @ 00:05 |
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NO NO NO NO NO NO NO
Did somebody really suggested on using a Cold Heat iron? Really?
With soldering to the IC legs, you just take the end of a wire and tin it with solder. Apply a little bit of flux on the leg, do not melt it yet. Place the wire on top of the chip itself and use a razor to bend the wire down to the IC leg. Use your iron to touch the wire and add a little bit of pressure so that it sticks to the leg.
Here's a pic for reference-
click to make it bigger.
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. March 2009 @ 00:36 |
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Listen to NDarkness, he knows what he is doing. He installed a modchip on my Wii and it is still working. I actually swapped the drive that had the Modchip on it with a friend so I could get an updated modchip (going to get a WiiClip to install the updated 1).
But anyway my friends kid somehow screwed up the drive. So I ordered another drive and just swapped the drive board that had the Modchip on it to the new drive and it still works.
So he does great work that lasts.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 19. March 2009 @ 00:37
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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19. March 2009 @ 06:23 |
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now that sounds like a more convenient way of doing it.
I shall practice this method.
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Junior Member
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19. March 2009 @ 09:18 |
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Quote:
I clamped the wire vertically with the wire straight down to a leg. I held iron at the high end and applied solder at the midpoint... The solder ran all the way down to the leg and stopped right before getting there and solidified... As if it's not transferring enough heat through the wire!?!? I have a 640F iron.
- That is definitely the wrong technique! Even if you could get the solder to run down to the pad, the solder would freeze on the pad and give a dry joint. You have to apply the iron where you want the joint.
Quote:
I tried taping the wire down but i was getting way too close to the board and actually scarred it a couple times.
- What size is your iron? It sound like it is way too big if you are burning the board!
NDarkness technique will work fine, and is a good way of limiting the amount of solder that you are applying to the joint (less chance of bridging an adjacent pin).
Are you using lead free solder? This generally has a higher melting point than lead/tin solders.
You can use a solder resist to stop bridging across adjacent legs
Pat Pending
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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19. March 2009 @ 19:55 |
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Well, it's gonna be another week before i do this again.
I ordered another iron.
I was using the 15w Soldering iron from radio shack but apparently i need somethin smaller.
I ordered a 12w PCB precision soldering iron from Ngineering. The tip is about the looks of the needlepoint on a compass so pretty precise.
I also ordered 0.020" solder instead of the 0.031" i was using. I also ordered a spade tip just in case i need it for something.
I was curious about something-
Is it ok if l leave electrical tape on top of a chip? Not on the legs, just across the chip itself to keep the wires stationary? These chips do not get hot enough to irritate the tape does it?
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. March 2009 @ 20:58 |
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Originally posted by shizzzon:
I was curious about something-
Is it ok if l leave electrical tape on top of a chip? Not on the legs, just across the chip itself to keep the wires stationary? These chips do not get hot enough to irritate the tape does it?
You will actually need to cover the whole chip including the legs and anywhere else you have soldered to avoid short circuiting. Do not cover the hole in the middle of the drive though.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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19. March 2009 @ 21:30 |
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Ok gotcha.
I'm gonna keep this 15w iron i got from radio shack to make those soldered connections on the new x360 liteon drives so i can dump\flash those newer systems since i'm not working in a microscopic environment, hehe, but at least i'm headed in the right direction, :) Thanks again.
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penguin98
AfterDawn Addict
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20. March 2009 @ 00:43 |
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Believe it or not I was able to solder my wiikey (my first install job in my own wii) with a cold heat. I used the long-wire method and it wasnt easy and looking back on it now I see it was a dumb risk. But at the time I was thinking that I had no choice since the tip of my normal soldering iron was totally shot and I couldnt find a new tip that fit it.
My later installs were all with a normal iron. I would advise using the standard soldering iron over the cold heat on any job, but ESPECIALLY fine detail stuff like expensive electronics.
I wasn't soldering to IC legs though. I wouldn't even try that with a good soldering iron.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. March 2009 @ 00:47
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Seewolf78
Junior Member
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20. March 2009 @ 01:24 |
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No need to yell. I was merely trying to help. I thought I, rather clearly, stated that I hadn't tried the technique with a Wii. Stating in turn that I'd had success in other situations when soldering in tight quarters. I do wish you the best of luck shizzzon. I hope that you get it to work for you.
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wiiNinja
Junior Member
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20. March 2009 @ 03:15 |
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shizzzon,
I'm rooting for you. I was about this point when I gave up. You seem determined to get this done. Be careful not to damage the chip while you're doing this; wear ground strap if you have it. Good luck.
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moocow07
Newbie
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21. March 2009 @ 04:31 |
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hi, i'm Dave, i've been in electronics for 25 years, yes i'm an old bastard, any way to clear this all up, i rework defence lead based fine pitched quadies, removed 255 bga's and it's like telling somone how to weld, when they have never touched a rod, just pay your local installer, he/she and i put lots of research in and resources and charge very little for what we do, lets say you don't destroy your unit and put heat stress amongst a dozen different other things, and get the wire on the pins, probably a 80% chance they will come off anyway.
have a good one.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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21. March 2009 @ 09:39 |
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i'm using test boards to do this and practice with other boards for other easier experiments but the ones that have been soldered on are on there very tight. i can hold the whole board via wire without a problem.
Hopefully by this coming tuesday\wednesday, my new equipment will be in so i can test with them this time.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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24. March 2009 @ 22:56 |
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ok here is some up to date info so far-
My new iron came in but i decided to continue to try with my 15w from radio shack.. Hey, why not? if others can, i should be able to also.
Anyway, after trying technique after technique, i resorted back to what Ndarkness was saying-
tape down wire onto chip, bend wire down onto leg and solder..
Well, the problem i was having was i had the wire tinned prior to doing so so when i would heat the point up real quick then move the iron away, the solder would attract to the iron then re-solidify onto another point causing a bridge...
So what i did was i taped the wire down on the chip, bent it down onto the leg untinned. I then grabbed the solder and lined it up with the leg laying flat on this test pci card, perpendicular with the 30awg wire.
I then took the iron and ran it across the wire and swiftly across the solder at the same time, split second.
The solder solidified right onto the end of the wire freezing the wire into place at the bottom of the leg.
the first time i did this, the wire actually snapped off at the cover!
So... i just now did it again and letting it cool over night because i'm bout to go to bed.
After i get off work, i will check it's strength and attempt to solder more wires onto each leg side by side.
If i can get that precise consistently, then i should be ready.
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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26. March 2009 @ 21:53 |
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Well.. got a problem here.
I've been using a 3x magnification lens and i was able to solder multiple wires on an IC leg one after another side by side just fine...
So i took the test board over to a friends house to have it inspected under a 10x mag lens and it turns out solder had bridged the legs together from behind?!?!
The point is, i can't see this under a 3x lens but can under a 10x...
I'm thinkin about purchasing a 7-10x hands-free mag lens..
I hope i can do it then because FOCAL DISTANCE for these mag lenses are only approximately 1" so i hope i have enough room to work under there.
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Junior Member
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27. March 2009 @ 05:54 |
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It sounds like you are getting closer. keep persevering, it is a skill well worth developing.
Best of luck
Pat Pending
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shizzzon
Junior Member
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27. March 2009 @ 20:36 |
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I think i finally found he godsend of magnification i was looking for the right price.
Capability of magnifying between 10x minimum and 20x all being no closer than 2" away which gives plenty of work room and up to 30x @ 0.8" away if tilted at an angle.
It is a BigC video microscope that is hooked up to a pc and the image viewed on the monitor.
I have extra monitors so all i gotta do is lower the output res on em to 800x600 since the video res is 640x480 and i should be ready to try again once i order one.
So again... give me another week and hopefully, just hopefully, i'll be able to master these tests.
also, this thing can take pics or vids while working zoomed in that close so i can post my work when i do it consistently right :)
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Junior Member
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28. March 2009 @ 04:48 |
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The disadvantage of the microscope is that you wont be directly looking at what you are doing - you will be looking at a screen which makes it harder to coordinate your movements. A good quality gooseneck or cantilever magnifier would be a better solution.
Pat Pending
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