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Is Microsoft incurring a loss by banning people?
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Junior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 04:23 |
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I feel that people will switch to PS3 now. I know that XBOX live is much better than PS network, but the fact is many people buy XBOX only because it can be modded. Moreover PS3 has blu ray support. Also they will loose a huge amount of gold subscribers! What do you guys think? Wasn't Microsoft better the other way round by not banning people. I mean people are paying for their consoles and games like call of duty still sell by large numbers.
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John_Donn
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 04:53 |
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haha i guess their 4th quarter profits will tell us the story lol. No one can say whether the amount of xboxs now sold plus original games will be enough to compensate for the 15 million is xbox live revenue lost per month with the bans, but some of those already have live again....it's to tough to call we will see what their console sales look like in november and december
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MR_yevrah
Junior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 05:21 |
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As soon as i was banned i bought a new console, so probably not considering the amount of people who will go out to buy a replacement console and most probably stop using back up games and actually go out and buy legitimate copies. As to whether or not they might go to Playstation, i actually heavily considered getting on instead, but it came down to xbox live and the fact that i have 15 friends who have live and 2 people with psn. I'm sure other people will be on the same position as me.
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nash79
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 06:50 |
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Got banned, if Im to buy a newer console, I'll go for a PS3 and ill get all the legit games I want to play online + God of War 3 once it goes out. I guess I'll be using PS3 for online, and XBOX 360 for offline games. Moreover we dont know if the newer XBOXs could be modded, so even the XBOX route will be for Legit only.
BUT NOWAY im getting a new Xbox 360.
PS: I can even use my PC to play online since most HUGE titles are available on XBOX/PS3/PC (except exclusives).
JB PS3 FAT 160 GB/ FW REBUG 3.55 - PS3 Slim 120 GB FW 3.65 - Wii 4.2E Soft/Hard MOD W/USB Loader 250 GB - XBOX 360 PRO 250 GB - XBOX 360 XENON JTAG - PS2 V13 - DSi/Supercard DSTWO - HP Pavilion dv7 - JB Iphone 3G/FW 4.2.1
http://g.bfbcs.com/5690/ps3_nash21979.pngThis message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. November 2009 @ 07:15
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 07:13 |
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Originally posted by MR_yevrah:
As soon as i was banned i bought a new console, so probably not considering the amount of people who will go out to buy a replacement console and most probably stop using back up games and actually go out and buy legitimate copies. As to whether or not they might go to Playstation, i actually heavily considered getting on instead, but it came down to xbox live and the fact that i have 15 friends who have live and 2 people with psn. I'm sure other people will be on the same position as me.
As soon as the ban wave hit I bought 20 :) Gotta love that walmart deal a week and a half ago. +170$ all day long
*Peeps will say there switching however 99% will buy another 360 in the long run cause xlive rules and there's always hope that iextreme lite will be as good as advertised.
No time for Leap frog!!!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. November 2009 @ 07:26
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gameover9
Suspended permanently
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16. November 2009 @ 08:20 |
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I think most people will buy a new console. Ps3 sucks LOL.
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nash79
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 09:16 |
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@gameover9: PS3 sucks in a way it doesnt play backups, but on the other hand, people to avoid bans (to be sure) can only play legit games, hence in my honest opinion, going PS3, more than never, is a serious business now. you can play online legit games (for free), and go xbox for their exclusives offline. IMMO
JB PS3 FAT 160 GB/ FW REBUG 3.55 - PS3 Slim 120 GB FW 3.65 - Wii 4.2E Soft/Hard MOD W/USB Loader 250 GB - XBOX 360 PRO 250 GB - XBOX 360 XENON JTAG - PS2 V13 - DSi/Supercard DSTWO - HP Pavilion dv7 - JB Iphone 3G/FW 4.2.1
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gameover9
Suspended permanently
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16. November 2009 @ 09:19 |
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Originally posted by nash79:
@gameover9: PS3 sucks in a way it doesnt play backups, but on the other hand, people to avoid bans (to be sure) can only play legit games, hence in my honest opinion, going PS3, more than never, is a serious business now. you can play online legit games (for free), and go xbox for their exclusives offline. IMMO
True and False. There are many games made for the 360 that is not made for the PS3 that are awesome. Of course, Ps3 seems to be improving now that I see Mw2 is there.
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nash79
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 09:25 |
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I dont know the comparison between Mw2 PS3 and XBOX 360 in terms of online gaming.
Also when we say XBOX LIVE is better tahn PSN, do we mean online gaming or other services such us shops etc?
JB PS3 FAT 160 GB/ FW REBUG 3.55 - PS3 Slim 120 GB FW 3.65 - Wii 4.2E Soft/Hard MOD W/USB Loader 250 GB - XBOX 360 PRO 250 GB - XBOX 360 XENON JTAG - PS2 V13 - DSi/Supercard DSTWO - HP Pavilion dv7 - JB Iphone 3G/FW 4.2.1
http://g.bfbcs.com/5690/ps3_nash21979.png |
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MReprogle
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 09:43 |
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Xbox live is better than PSN in every way except price. I'm cool with paying a little money for the best online gaming service. And the money that I give them is well worth the tons of free demos, awesome online multiplayer experience, and the other small things like Game with Fame.
Last I read, PSN's servers went down the night that MW2 came out. This shows that they are unprepared. Xbox servers were running steady all night long.
So, if you are too cheap to pay as little as $35 for 13 months of Xbox live on eBay, you are going to get an inferior service.
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 09:49 |
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Originally posted by nash79:
Also when we say XBOX LIVE is better tahn PSN, do we mean online gaming or other services such us shops etc?
Both.
In terms of gaming related features, here's some of the things Live has that PSN doesn't have: -
Cross-game chat
Party mode
Consistent invites/join system (varies from game to game on PSN)
See exactly what players are doing in all games (only supported in a couple of titles in PSN)
Private voice chat
Voice messaging
Reputation system
Reporting system
The inconsistency of PSN annoys me. In COD4 for example, you can only invite people if they're already playing COD4, so you have to send them a message saying "wanna play COD4?" then send them an invite once they're actually in the game. Live is also far more reliable in my experience. Modern Warfare 2 was a total mess on the PS3 for a few days because the online system was totally f***ed.
As far as the stores go, Xbox Live gets 1-3 new XBLA games every week and all of them have demos. Sometimes PSN gets no new games in an update and only about a third of all the games have demos. It's also easier to find stuff on Live. Pricing wise, the same games are regularly cheaper on Live too, at least in the UK. A lot of games and DLC that are 800 MS Points on Live (£6.80) are £7.99 on PSN and 99% of the time they're available on Live earlier.
There are other annoyances with the PS3 too, such as only being able to sign in with 1 account at a time and only being able to use 1 headset at a time. Also, title updates don't work like they do on the 360. You can sometimes find yourself playing a new game for the first time and having to download multiple large patches, all of which have to be installed. Downloaded games from PSN have to be installed too, as do demos.
I use my PS3 only for exclusives because of some of the things I've mentioned. If you've got a banned 360 then the PS3 isn't a bad purchase cos then you get to play the exclusives that both have to offer and the PS3 is a good media box and it has the Blu-Ray player, but I wouldn't buy a PS3 if you're looking for a free version of Xbox Live cos PSN in its current form is definitely not that. If you use a lot of the features Live has and you're a big online gamer, you will notice the differences. I guess a big part of it though, is how many friends you have with PS3s that you can play games with.
EDIT - Or in simple terms I could have just said what the guy above said, lol: -
Quote:
Xbox live is better than PSN in every way except price.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. November 2009 @ 09:50
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Donaldo
Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 10:12 |
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hrmm lets see 1 million consoles banned... all the kids will run out and replace them at a cost of $100 to $200
so microsoft is getting a mere 100,000,000.00 to 200,000,000.00 out of this latest wave...
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 10:15 |
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Originally posted by Donaldo:
hrmm lets see 1 million consoles banned... all the kids will run out and replace them at a cost of $100 to $200
so microsoft is getting a mere 100,000,000.00 to 200,000,000.00 out of this latest wave...
Yeah, cos the consoles cost nothing to make right? lol. AFAIK, MS still make a slight loss on the actual hardware which they recoup through sales of accessories, games, Live subs etc.
Also, the 1,000,000 consoles banned number comes from some random blogger. He said it was 600,000 in the US and Canada and then other news sites added on 400,000 to cover the rest of the world. Even if it was true, you're assuming that everyone that was banned would go out and buy a brand new console but you're talking about revenue, when it's profit that matters.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. November 2009 @ 10:17
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Donaldo
Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 10:25 |
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 10:45 |
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CNN got the figure from Information Week who didn't say where they got it from, but the original source if you trace it back is here: -
http://pinoycosplay.blogspot.com/2009/11...762f11e6ea50f6e
MS have said they will not give out numbers. Some anonymous guy who knows another anonymous guy that works in an MS call center is not a trusted source of information.
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AfterDawn Addict
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16. November 2009 @ 11:18 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
In terms of gaming related features, here's some of the things Live has that PSN doesn't have: -
Cross-game chat
Party mode
Consistent invites/join system (varies from game to game on PSN)
See exactly what players are doing in all games (only supported in a couple of titles in PSN)
Private voice chat
Voice messaging
Reputation system
Reporting system
The inconsistency of PSN annoys me. In COD4 for example, you can only invite people if they're already playing COD4, so you have to send them a message saying "wanna play COD4?" then send them an invite once they're actually in the game. Live is also far more reliable in my experience. Modern Warfare 2 was a total mess on the PS3 for a few days because the online system was totally f***ed.
As far as the stores go, Xbox Live gets 1-3 new XBLA games every week and all of them have demos. Sometimes PSN gets no new games in an update and only about a third of all the games have demos. It's also easier to find stuff on Live. Pricing wise, the same games are regularly cheaper on Live too, at least in the UK. A lot of games and DLC that are 800 MS Points on Live (£6.80) are £7.99 on PSN and 99% of the time they're available on Live earlier.
There are other annoyances with the PS3 too, such as only being able to sign in with 1 account at a time and only being able to use 1 headset at a time. Also, title updates don't work like they do on the 360. You can sometimes find yourself playing a new game for the first time and having to download multiple large patches, all of which have to be installed. Downloaded games from PSN have to be installed too, as do demos.
I use my PS3 only for exclusives because of some of the things I've mentioned. If you've got a banned 360 then the PS3 isn't a bad purchase cos then you get to play the exclusives that both have to offer and the PS3 is a good media box and it has the Blu-Ray player, but I wouldn't buy a PS3 if you're looking for a free version of Xbox Live cos PSN in its current form is definitely not that. If you use a lot of the features Live has and you're a big online gamer, you will notice the differences. I guess a big part of it though, is how many friends you have with PS3s that you can play games with.
Well put funksoulb.
I got a "PlayStation loyalist" nephew who visited me for a week, about 3 weeks ago. After being on Xbox Live all week, he saw those differences for himself. He always thought I was up-talking Xbox and down-talking PS3. Now his offer to me is to trade me his PS3 for one of my Xboxes with a physical mod, windows & lights. No flash, he's afraid of the banhammer. Seeing as to how I got a couple of unused 360s, and could use a 2nd PS3, I took him up on it.
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rapekit
Newbie
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16. November 2009 @ 11:29 |
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I can't really say if they will lose money or not, but I would think so. I have to think the majority of pirates won't go legit, but some will. Maybe MS will come out ahead. I was banned. I won't ever buy another Xbox 360. If I wanna play online I'll play on private servers on my PC, or if they figure out a way to mod it, possibly get a PS3. If they hadn't banned me they would have at least continued to get my $8 a month. Now they won't get anything.
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 11:39 |
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But if people buy a PS3 instead, they'll be buying games, so while MS may lose out on a small amount of revenue in Live subscriptions, the games industry benefits. Many people will just buy a 360 and keep it unmodded, so MS benefits in that way. I think a lot of this "I'm buying a PS3!" stuff is just sour grapes anyway.
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AfterDawn Addict
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16. November 2009 @ 12:03 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
I think a lot of this "I'm buying a PS3!" stuff is just sour grapes anyway.
Yes it is. Everybody knows that modding leads to banning, yet mod anyway, and when the ban occurs, they complain, and threaten to jump ship.
What's the benefit of jumping ship anyway? Nothing other than BluRay & exclusives. Buying a new (unmodded) 360 is the same as buying a PS3. You gotta buy retail games. But to go to PS3 simply because Microsoft banned you is immature. They were supposed to ban you if you flashed.
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metalguy
Junior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 16:40 |
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Originally posted by MReprogle:
Xbox live is better than PSN in every way except price. I'm cool with paying a little money for the best online gaming service. And the money that I give them is well worth the tons of free demos, awesome online multiplayer experience, and the other small things like Game with Fame.
Last I read, PSN's servers went down the night that MW2 came out. This shows that they are unprepared. Xbox servers were running steady all night long.
So, if you are too cheap to pay as little as $35 for 13 months of Xbox live on eBay, you are going to get an inferior service.
wow you could not be more wrong. While I do think xbl has an edge over psn I know its not much of one. the things that xbox live does well are connecting you with other gamers quickly i.e party chat and sending game invites that people can access from the dashboard.
But actual online gaming experience goes to psn hands down. They make their first party developers use dedicated servers for gods sake dude. Imagine playing a game where you don't see enemies disappear and reappear several feet away from where you were first looking at them. imagine plugging a guy with shotgun shells and seeing him fall to the ground every time, not just when you have the faster connection. imagine a game where a lag switch is flipped and the guy flipping it stops moving completely! (I noticed this happening in uncharted 2 when people lag they just stop moving, you can tell because the person will stop but the rest of their team will keep moving normally allowing you to kill them, or they will just get dropped from the game if their connection does not recover lol)
All this and more can be yours when you play online on the psn lol.
I can be the first to admit xbl does a great job with the extra features and man do I wish the psn had party chat or at least private voice chat while playing a game. but when I play game after game of seamless mayhem without most of the ridiculous glitches and lag tricks that my favorite xbox only games have, it sure makes me glad to own a ps3.
And no I'm not a fanboy I recognize the good and the bad of both systems, but if you must..... Flame on lol
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. November 2009 @ 16:54
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MReprogle
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 17:02 |
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Originally posted by metalguy:
Originally posted by MReprogle:
Xbox live is better than PSN in every way except price. I'm cool with paying a little money for the best online gaming service. And the money that I give them is well worth the tons of free demos, awesome online multiplayer experience, and the other small things like Game with Fame.
Last I read, PSN's servers went down the night that MW2 came out. This shows that they are unprepared. Xbox servers were running steady all night long.
So, if you are too cheap to pay as little as $35 for 13 months of Xbox live on eBay, you are going to get an inferior service.
wow you could not be more wrong. While I do think xbl has an edge over psn I know its not much of one. the things that xbox live does well are connecting you with other gamers quickly i.e party chat and sending game invites that people can access from the dashboard.
But actual online gaming experience goes to psn hands down. They make their first party developers use dedicated servers for gods sake dude. Imagine playing a game where you don't see enemies disappear and reappear several feet away from where you were first looking at them. imagine plugging a guy with shotgun shells and seeing him fall to the ground every time, not just when you have the faster connection. imagine a game where a lag switch is flipped and the guy flipping it stops moving completely! (I noticed this happening in uncharted 2 when people lag they just stop moving, you can tell because the person will stop but the rest of their team will keep moving normally allowing you to kill them, or they will just get dropped from the game if their connection does not recover lol)
All this and more can be yours when you play online on the psn lol.
I can be the first to admit xbl does a great job with the extra features and man do I wish the psn had party chat or at least private voice chat while playing a game. but when I play game after game of seamless mayhem without most of the ridiculous glitches and lag tricks that my favorite xbox only games have, it sure makes me glad to own a ps3.
And no I'm not a fanboy I recognize the good and the bad of both systems, but if you must..... Flame on lol
I don't believe a flame is needed here. We all have our preferences. You can't say either service is lag free all of the time. Games having their own dedicated servers seems nice, but what happens if it's an old game and the company goes under. Who pays for the server to run? I'd rather pay a little money to ensure that it works every single time I want it to. Even if I had a PS3, I wouldn't mind paying if that meant new developments and more content. It also depends on how many friends you have playing games, and what system they use. All my friends have Xbox, so it makes my experience much better.
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Senior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 17:27 |
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There are games on the 360 that have dedicated servers too. Left 4 Dead, Frontlines: Fuel of War and Section 8 being 3 examples.
Quote:
what happens if it's an old game and the company goes under
Exactly. The company doesn't even need to go under. If a game's not popular anymore then what incentive do they have to keep the servers running?
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metalguy
Junior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 19:02 |
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Originally posted by MReprogle:
Originally posted by metalguy:
Originally posted by MReprogle:
Xbox live is better than PSN in every way except price. I'm cool with paying a little money for the best online gaming service. And the money that I give them is well worth the tons of free demos, awesome online multiplayer experience, and the other small things like Game with Fame.
Last I read, PSN's servers went down the night that MW2 came out. This shows that they are unprepared. Xbox servers were running steady all night long.
So, if you are too cheap to pay as little as $35 for 13 months of Xbox live on eBay, you are going to get an inferior service.
wow you could not be more wrong. While I do think xbl has an edge over psn I know its not much of one. the things that xbox live does well are connecting you with other gamers quickly i.e party chat and sending game invites that people can access from the dashboard.
But actual online gaming experience goes to psn hands down. They make their first party developers use dedicated servers for gods sake dude. Imagine playing a game where you don't see enemies disappear and reappear several feet away from where you were first looking at them. imagine plugging a guy with shotgun shells and seeing him fall to the ground every time, not just when you have the faster connection. imagine a game where a lag switch is flipped and the guy flipping it stops moving completely! (I noticed this happening in uncharted 2 when people lag they just stop moving, you can tell because the person will stop but the rest of their team will keep moving normally allowing you to kill them, or they will just get dropped from the game if their connection does not recover lol)
All this and more can be yours when you play online on the psn lol.
I can be the first to admit xbl does a great job with the extra features and man do I wish the psn had party chat or at least private voice chat while playing a game. but when I play game after game of seamless mayhem without most of the ridiculous glitches and lag tricks that my favorite xbox only games have, it sure makes me glad to own a ps3.
And no I'm not a fanboy I recognize the good and the bad of both systems, but if you must..... Flame on lol
I don't believe a flame is needed here. We all have our preferences. You can't say either service is lag free all of the time. Games having their own dedicated servers seems nice, but what happens if it's an old game and the company goes under. Who pays for the server to run? I'd rather pay a little money to ensure that it works every single time I want it to. Even if I had a PS3, I wouldn't mind paying if that meant new developments and more content. It also depends on how many friends you have playing games, and what system they use. All my friends have Xbox, so it makes my experience much better.
I totally agree with you on paying for extra features, I would gladly pay to see a party chat function on the ps3. Also, I agree with your comment about having friends to play with. The only reason I bought a 360 at first was because it was cheaper but I still play it today because most of my friends only own a 360.
That being said I'll always prefer an online experience that is fluid most if not all of the time, ( the only lag I have ever seen in a ps3 exclusive is in uncharted 2 and it only effected the person who lagged) to am experience that will be available indefinitely but have the same issues throughout its existence.
honestly my only point is that the psn is not as bad as some people on here try to make it out to be, and for my type of gamer its especially practical. Honestly I don't get much out of my gold membership as I don't tweet, use facebook,use messenger, watch webisodes, or even download demos. I just play online. and you can do all of those on the ps3 anyway since it has a built-in web browser.
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metalguy
Junior Member
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16. November 2009 @ 19:10 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
There are games on the 360 that have dedicated servers too. Left 4 Dead, Frontlines: Fuel of War and Section 8 being 3 examples.
Quote:
what happens if it's an old game and the company goes under
Exactly. The company doesn't even need to go under. If a game's not popular anymore then what incentive do they have to keep the servers running?
Nice that some 360 games have those servers, wish they had them for halo, gears of war, call of duty 4, mvc 2 or any of the other games I play religiously though.
And I was only stating that sony requires their first party companies to have the servers not that there are no xbox games with them.
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ebxtreme
Member
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16. November 2009 @ 19:37 |
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Analysis: Microsoft's Plan to Ban 360s was Poorly Planned
From associatedcontent.com:
"I was at GameStop the other day and listened to a customer's questions about Microsoft's banning of modded X-Box 360s. The worker tried to explain that this banning was for those people that hacked their X-Box 360. The customer was worried that if her child downloaded any kind of content through the X-Box 360 that this might constitute a reason for a banning for her son's system. She was confused, so she decided to purchase a PS3 instead. I was told by the manager at that GameStop that this was not an isolated incident. They had received over 50 calls that day about the banning.
What Microsoft appears to have forgotten by earmarking this time of year for the banning of modded X-Box 360s is that most of the systems that are purchased this time of year is by parents and grandparents. The game systems that are purchased this time of year are usually done by those that do not have a firm grasp on the industry. Simply put, the systems are usually purchased by people that are fairly clueless about video games."
Full Story: associatedcontent.com
Note: All of this is very true. I had several friends visit a local Gamestop (NY) this past weekend to unload their banned consoles and the PS3s were sold out! Shame, shame MS.
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