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dam check microsofts stock
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kingsplay
Newbie
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22. November 2009 @ 23:25 |
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Obviously as everyone knows alot of people decided to buy new consoles because of xbl. microsofts stock went up 5 points 2 days after the banning. lots of moneys for shareholders :P
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JediOrc
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23. November 2009 @ 01:37 |
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Originally posted by kingsplay:
Obviously as everyone knows alot of people decided to buy new consoles because of xbl. microsofts stock went up 5 points 2 days after the banning. lots of moneys for shareholders :P
ticker msft usually didn't go anywhere but these recent moves have been big for them. Of course people were going to buy more 360's after the ban, it was already proven in the previous waves (lol). I am VERY curious how m$ 4th quarter earnings will be... despite the fact they lose money per 360... maybe live, DLC, and some games (now that people fear "backups") will earn the profits and make up for the loss which I believe is still -$100 per counsol (give or take a few $).
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Aiur
Member
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23. November 2009 @ 02:11 |
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Originally posted by JediOrc:
ticker msft usually didn't go anywhere but these recent moves have been big for them. Of course people were going to buy more 360's after the ban, it was already proven in the previous waves (lol). I am VERY curious how m$ 4th quarter earnings will be... despite the fact they lose money per 360... maybe live, DLC, and some games (now that people fear "backups") will earn the profits and make up for the loss which I believe is still -$100 per counsol (give or take a few $).
Microsoft has been making a profit on every 360 sold since late 2006.
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23. November 2009 @ 04:52 |
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Originally posted by Aiur:
Microsoft has been making a profit on every 360 sold since late 2006.
Source?
As far as I am aware, Microsoft lose out on every console sold and make up the money in software and peripherals.
Try searching, its fun.
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AfterDawn Addict
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23. November 2009 @ 10:35 |
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It was reported quite awhile back that MS had reduced hardware costs to the point that they were finally making a profit on each console sold.
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Member
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23. November 2009 @ 13:09 |
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Originally posted by bhetrick:
It was reported quite awhile back that MS had reduced hardware costs to the point that they were finally making a profit on each console sold.
But they are still 4 Billion in the hole from the XBOX 1, another 1 billion down on the 360 RROD repairs + extended 3 year warranty on the hardwares poor reliability and whatever else they lost up until now on the 360 selling at a loss so they've got a long way to go yet before the XBOX brand can be considered to be a success.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. November 2009 @ 13:10
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gameover9
Suspended permanently
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23. November 2009 @ 13:13 |
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Originally posted by RMF:
Originally posted by bhetrick:
It was reported quite awhile back that MS had reduced hardware costs to the point that they were finally making a profit on each console sold.
But they are still 4 Billion in the hole from the XBOX 1, another 1 billion down on the 360 RROD repairs + extended 3 year warranty on the hardwares poor reliability and whatever else they lost up until now on the 360 selling at a loss so they've got a long way to go yet before the XBOX brand can be considered to be a success.
source? I didn't even know the first xbox had problems lol
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23. November 2009 @ 13:36 |
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Originally posted by gameover9:
Originally posted by RMF:
Originally posted by bhetrick:
It was reported quite awhile back that MS had reduced hardware costs to the point that they were finally making a profit on each console sold.
But they are still 4 Billion in the hole from the XBOX 1, another 1 billion down on the 360 RROD repairs + extended 3 year warranty on the hardwares poor reliability and whatever else they lost up until now on the 360 selling at a loss so they've got a long way to go yet before the XBOX brand can be considered to be a success.
source? I didn't even know the first xbox had problems lol
The xbox 1 didn't have problems other than poor reliability on the thompson DVD drive. That's not what I was saying, that wasn't the reason for the loss.
http://www.joystiq.com/2005/09/26/forbes...n-and-counting/
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Senior Member
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23. November 2009 @ 13:43 |
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The E&D Division figures since the launch of the first Xbox: -
2001 ($1,666,000,000)
2002 ($866,000,000)
2003 ($938,000,000)
2004 ($1,011,000,000)
2005 ($464,000,000)
2006 ($1,329,000,000)
2007 ($2,066,000,000)
2008 $267,000,000
2009 $5,000,000
Losses in brackets. The original Xbox was still being sold at a loss when it was withdrawn from sale. In an interview in the middle of 2008, MS said that they were "making inroads" in terms of making the 360 hardware profitable, so all we know is that it was definitely making a per unit loss one year ago. People who think that MS are raking it in from their console business clearly have never looked at their financial reports.
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Aiur
Member
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23. November 2009 @ 14:04 |
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Senior Member
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23. November 2009 @ 14:13 |
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Originally posted by Aiur:
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2006/11/16/ps3-loses-up-to-306-per-unit-xbox-360-profits-76-per-sale.htm
I would be willing to guess that the manufacturing costs have come down so much so that they even make profits off of the Arcade.
You can trust iSuppli's estimates over MS saying they don't make money on the hardware (in 2008 anyway) if you like.
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Member
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23. November 2009 @ 14:16 |
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Originally posted by Aiur:
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2006/11/16/ps3-loses-up-to-306-per-unit-xbox-360-profits-76-per-sale.htm
I would be willing to guess that the manufacturing costs have come down so much so that they even make profits off of the Arcade.
The costs have come down, but so has the price of the machine at retail. The article you posted is more than 3 years old.
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Member
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23. November 2009 @ 15:25 |
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i have a friend who worked for sony as a games tester (not a good job as it goes) who said that sony make a loss on consoles as do microsoft, it is widely accepted to be the norm, lose money on the hardware and get profit from the software ie games xblive etc.
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AfterDawn Addict
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23. November 2009 @ 18:54 |
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Well, seeing how MS is publicly traded on the stock exchange, I'd be more willing to believe what they report on console profits than what some other independent site reports or what some "friend" claims. Sure, MS could fudge some numbers. But they've got way too much to do by doing so. Just look at Enron, Adelphia, Worldcom, Tyco, etc.
So if they're reporting a profit on the console 3 years ago, I wouldn't bet that at todays current price they're taking a loss on it.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. November 2009 @ 18:56
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Aiur
Member
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23. November 2009 @ 19:24 |
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Originally posted by RMF:
The costs have come down, but so has the price of the machine at retail. The article you posted is more than 3 years old.
Exactly. That was 3 years ago, and manufacture costs go down and not up over time.
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John_Donn
Member
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23. November 2009 @ 19:51 |
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Originally posted by bhetrick:
Well, seeing how MS is publicly traded on the stock exchange, I'd be more willing to believe what they report on console profits than what some other independent site reports or what some "friend" claims. Sure, MS could fudge some numbers. But they've got way too much to do by doing so. Just look at Enron, Adelphia, Worldcom, Tyco, etc.
So if they're reporting a profit on the console 3 years ago, I wouldn't bet that at todays current price they're taking a loss on it.
agree completely, they make xbox's 360 today for cheaper then what they actually sell for which is insane because of how bad it was 4 years ago but think about it. A top of the line computer that sold for a grand 4 years ago you can build for 400 dollars today, plus they buy in massive bulk for 4 years now. They also make tens of billions in revenue so a few billion loss on consoles doesn't hurt. They care about the future and how the xbox 720 or whatever it will be called will sell and outsell sony's ps4 and nintendos die. also look at this link from 2006!!!it prob cost 100 dollars a day to make the xbox 360
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/multimedia/...1120132150.html
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. November 2009 @ 19:53
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Member
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24. November 2009 @ 02:27 |
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Originally posted by Aiur:
Originally posted by RMF:
The costs have come down, but so has the price of the machine at retail. The article you posted is more than 3 years old.
Exactly. That was 3 years ago, and manufacture costs go down and not up over time.
I'd be willing to bet that price of the console has dropped more that the manufacturing cost has. There's no way in hell that there can be $70 of profit in the console at it's current price. It's that simple.
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Aiur
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24. November 2009 @ 04:13 |
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Originally posted by RMF:
I'd be willing to bet that price of the console has dropped more that the manufacturing cost has. There's no way in hell that there can be $70 of profit in the console at it's current price. It's that simple.
Sony apparently cut their manufacturing costs by 70% from when they launched the PS3. Using the link John gave, let's cut those prices by 30% to get to that 70% mark that Sony is at.
Motherboard - $142.80
Wireless Board - $3.32
Optical Drive - $13.61
Hard Disk Drive - Does not apply for the Arcade, only could speculate for the Elite.
Power Supply - $17.85 (probably less considering this was the cost for the old power supply's)
Hardware/Enclosure - $14.35
Manufacturing Costs - $4.27
Grand total of $196.20 for an Arcade (add in a little more for the HDMI and 512 MB internal hard drive, take some away for the power supply). You can probably say that Microsoft is right around the break even mark for the Arcade.
It's hard to speculate on the HD cost of the Elite. Microsoft uses old FUJITSU MHW2120BH's, and they are pretty much obsolete. The price range on them seems to be in the $60-$120 range.
This is being very generous as well, considering Sony cut their production costs by 70% in less than 3 years. In reality, Microsoft has probably cut their production costs by at least 80% since launch.
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Senior Member
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24. November 2009 @ 04:18 |
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Originally posted by bhetrick:
So if they're reporting a profit on the console 3 years ago, I wouldn't bet that at todays current price they're taking a loss on it.
Where are they reporting a profit on it 3 years ago? In 2006 the Entertainments & Devices Division made a loss of $1,329,000,000. People are just quoting iSuppli's estimates as fact. People will believe what they want. The same thing happened with the "1,000,000 banned!" thing even though the figure had no factual basis.
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dt5500
Junior Member
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24. November 2009 @ 05:11 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
Originally posted by bhetrick:
So if they're reporting a profit on the console 3 years ago, I wouldn't bet that at todays current price they're taking a loss on it.
Where are they reporting a profit on it 3 years ago? In 2006 the Entertainments & Devices Division made a loss of $1,329,000,000. People are just quoting iSuppli's estimates as fact. People will believe what they want. The same thing happened with the "1,000,000 banned!" thing even though the figure had no factual basis.
The above comment on losses is more than likely company / department wide. This is not specifically on console sales alone Which is the arguement.
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Senior Member
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24. November 2009 @ 05:23 |
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Originally posted by Aiur:
Originally posted by RMF:
I'd be willing to bet that price of the console has dropped more that the manufacturing cost has. There's no way in hell that there can be $70 of profit in the console at it's current price. It's that simple.
Sony apparently cut their manufacturing costs by 70% from when they launched the PS3. Using the link John gave, let's cut those prices by 30% to get to that 70% mark that Sony is at.
Motherboard - $142.80
Wireless Board - $3.32
Optical Drive - $13.61
Hard Disk Drive - Does not apply for the Arcade, only could speculate for the Elite.
Power Supply - $17.85 (probably less considering this was the cost for the old power supply's)
Hardware/Enclosure - $14.35
Manufacturing Costs - $4.27
Grand total of $196.20 for an Arcade (add in a little more for the HDMI and 512 MB internal hard drive, take some away for the power supply). You can probably say that Microsoft is right around the break even mark for the Arcade.
You haven't included the cost of the controller, cables, packaging, shipping, storage etc. and you haven't taken into account the retailer's cut, tax and import duty.
Also, I think it's a false assumption to say that MS cut costs more than Sony because much of Sony's price reduction would have come from the reduced cost of the Blu-Ray drive.
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JediOrc
Member
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24. November 2009 @ 08:47 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
Originally posted by Aiur:
Originally posted by RMF:
I'd be willing to bet that price of the console has dropped more that the manufacturing cost has. There's no way in hell that there can be $70 of profit in the console at it's current price. It's that simple.
Sony apparently cut their manufacturing costs by 70% from when they launched the PS3. Using the link John gave, let's cut those prices by 30% to get to that 70% mark that Sony is at.
Motherboard - $142.80
Wireless Board - $3.32
Optical Drive - $13.61
Hard Disk Drive - Does not apply for the Arcade, only could speculate for the Elite.
Power Supply - $17.85 (probably less considering this was the cost for the old power supply's)
Hardware/Enclosure - $14.35
Manufacturing Costs - $4.27
Grand total of $196.20 for an Arcade (add in a little more for the HDMI and 512 MB internal hard drive, take some away for the power supply). You can probably say that Microsoft is right around the break even mark for the Arcade.
You haven't included the cost of the controller, cables, packaging, shipping, storage etc. and you haven't taken into account the retailer's cut, tax and import duty.
Also, I think it's a false assumption to say that MS cut costs more than Sony because much of Sony's price reduction would have come from the reduced cost of the Blu-Ray drive.
actually M$ did. See the cell processor that sony has is almost identical as far as power that what M$ has. HOWEVER, the chipset and other hardware that is in the M$ is lower as far as the hardware quality is concerned. To be more specific, this is why we have had +50% of malfunctioned 360's and PS3 reports far less (YRod or something like that which has been happening only recently). Not choosing sides here, only facts guys. In a nutshell: the power is almost identical, just the build and chipset is jacked up (360), thats all.
Now going back to cost, even if they did make money (which I still have not found via google how much they are making/lossing NOW) its still a very small number and they make up for it in 1st party equipment/software/utilities. M$ did something VERY smart, banned a crap load of people before the holiday season. I said this before and got flamed but I guess the MSFT ticker proved me right...
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Senior Member
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24. November 2009 @ 08:59 |
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Quote:
actually M$ did.
Did what?
lol@the ticker "proving you right".
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JediOrc
Member
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24. November 2009 @ 09:16 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
Quote:
actually M$ did.
Did what?
lol@the ticker "proving you right".
what you said about cutting costs. They had cut costs by going for a lower bidder to build the system leading to +50 rrods/damaged systems.
well when you see the price of the stock go up, it is no questioned they did something right, in this case it was the ban waves. So they proved me right when I said a while back it was timing that they did this ban wave for holiday season. Im glad that you had a laugh at that though, its always good to smile and have a good LOL once in a while. :-)
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AfterDawn Addict
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24. November 2009 @ 09:32 |
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Originally posted by funksoulb:
Originally posted by bhetrick:
So if they're reporting a profit on the console 3 years ago, I wouldn't bet that at todays current price they're taking a loss on it.
Where are they reporting a profit on it 3 years ago? In 2006 the Entertainments & Devices Division made a loss of $1,329,000,000. People are just quoting iSuppli's estimates as fact. People will believe what they want. The same thing happened with the "1,000,000 banned!" thing even though the figure had no factual basis.
Everyone is talking about the console. You keep bringing up the gaming division. You're on a different page than us.
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