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Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr.: iPad is eliminating American jobs
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The following comments relate to this news article:
article published on 17 April, 2011
Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. of Illinois has made news this weekend with his claim that the iPad (and similar tech) has lead to the elimination of thousands of American jobs.
The representative is a big fan of the efficiency of the iPad, and has even proposed that all Illinois students eventually be given one as a learning tool, but says it does not help the growing problem of unemployment.
... [ read the full article ]
Please read the original article before posting your comments.
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HxCMANIAC
Junior Member
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17. April 2011 @ 14:48 |
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Free market.
Other stores have to be able to compete, until they become obsolete and die out.
I see no problem.
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KamiXal
Newbie
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17. April 2011 @ 14:54 |
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What an idiot.
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SomeBozo
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17. April 2011 @ 15:19 |
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I agree that Mr. Jackson has a point, but he is raising issues that are surface issues, not the root cause of the problem. I like the analogy that the world needs eggs, and somewhere the U.S. stopped selling just the eggs, but sold and gave away the chickens. Then we wonder why no one wants to buy our eggs any longer... This is what the U.S. has done in the pursuit of higher monthly/yearly income statements that Wall Street wants to see, by means of outsourcing or shipping jobs oversea because labor is cheaper. I could go on for hours about the issues involved but in a nutshell at least some parasitical politician is awake there some problem, but as normal i think out of touch with what is really going on. He is using one hand to raise the problem with the economy yet with the other using it to pass laws or lobby for legislation that is the cause and root of the problem.
One example specific to this i remember seeing a study indicating how the corporate mega box stores where killing off all the book stores in an area back east (New Hampshire if i remember correctly) along with some of the old family specialty book stores because a B Dalton and Barns & Noble opened. Over time the mega stores closed as people shopped on the internet, in the end the mega stores caused all the book store jobs where lost, now a place which for decades had a sustainable market no longer has one. Bottom line none of its residents have a job in order to buy a book.
I'm curious does this mean Mr. Jackson will stop allowing so much abuse of the H1-B policies or outsourcing work overseas? I work in a large software company i'm certain everyone know about, just look out your window, in my group we had about 250 people, i was one of 5 U.S. citizens, and they were starting to ramp up outsourcing jobs to go overseas, that was 4 years ago. Today i now see some teams are now getting as large or larger overseas then the teams on-site. Oh well, i'm glad i'm old enough by the time the problem will be really bad i most likely won't be alive to worry about it.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. April 2011 @ 15:41
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Member
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17. April 2011 @ 17:31 |
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Originally posted by HxCMANIAC:
Free market.
Other stores have to be able to compete, until they become obsolete and die out.
I see no problem.
This, a million times over.
And he's complaining about the lack of jobs in the United States and the deficit; well, you can hit two birds with one stone with deregulation: it lets people come up with better jobs, and we don't have to spend money forcing what people can't do.
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slackdast
Suspended permanently
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17. April 2011 @ 17:42 |
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I guess his ancestors were bitching about printing presses putting monks out of business.
Wonder if they bitch about how ending slavery ruined farming?
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17. April 2011 @ 17:42 |
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welcome to the new age fool! Why don't you blame all Amazon Kindle, Nook by Barnes and Noble or any smart phone device that can read any books? I'm not planing to say that I like Ipad, but is unfair that you only going after one thing but not the others.
Being nice always has its own consequences
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. April 2011 @ 17:59
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kragshot
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17. April 2011 @ 18:51 |
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Most of you guys are letting your technophile sensibilities get in the way of the real message.
"The Chinese are taking advantage of our American right to freedom of speech."
What he is saying is that the congress should not get rid of IPads; he is saying that the American congress should do something to make Steve Jobs (and similar countries that have gone overboard with exporting and outsourcing jobs) produce those devices here in the US.
And I totally agree with him on that viewpoint. The US is slowly losing status as a first-world country and becoming a second-world one. We are producing less and less and consuming more and more from other countries. The problem is that we are bulking up the rest of the world's production capital and the only people who are benefiting from our mass consumption are the corporations and those other countries who are now holding jobs that Americans once held.
Jobs and the other high-tech producers are taking advantage of American tax breaks, consumers, and venture capital, but are not putting anything back into the country's economic base. He's hired a ton of Americans to work at the Apple stores across the country at or just above minimum wage, but how many people can make a living and support a family working at the Apple Store?
The original concept of production-based entrepreneurial interest comes simply from the idea that a manufacturer sets up shop in a given community. The wages he pays his workers helps maintain his business as those wages return to him and the other businesses in the community via consumer spending. The perfect example of that was the Detroit Auto industry. You worked at the GM/Ford/Chrysler plants, got paid, and you spent your wages on sustenance goods and among other things, Automobiles for your family; thereby your wages went back to the company and helped maintain your job. When American consumerism turned to purchasing foreign produced vehicles, the Auto industry began to falter as that money began to leave the country. But when those foreign-owned companies began to open American-based production plants, the Auto industry stabilized as the cycle between American labor and consumerism was reestablished.
That is what is happening now except we have to add to this the fact that a new information technology medium is rapidly replacing an older one. If the maintenance and production of this new technology was remaining in the US, then it would balance out.
These corporations and their practices should be made accountable to American consumers and our economy because if their corporations were being ran in any other country, their governments would exert more control regarding their negative impact on their local economies. But we live in a country where corporate interest supersedes citizen welfare.
TL;DR
Rep. Jackson's statement isn't about restricting technology; it is about making American companies accountable for the economic impact of their exporting and outsourcing American jobs on the American economy.
"It''s a celebration, bitches..."
"Cocaine''s a hell of a drug, you know...."
Rick James
1948-2004- R.I.P.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. April 2011 @ 19:06
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kragshot
Newbie
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17. April 2011 @ 18:56 |
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Originally posted by Hyasuma:
welcome to the new age fool! Why don't you blame all Amazon Kindle, Nook by Barnes and Noble or any smart phone device that can read any books? I'm not planing to say that I like Ipad, but is unfair that you only going after one thing but not the others.
Uh...he's using Apple and the iPad as an example because the iPad is the foremost and most visibly profitable of eReader/tablet technology. He is not calling for direct targeting of Apple, but instead asking the congress to hold American companies like Apple liable for the economic results of their outsourcing jobs that directly affect the American economy.
If Apple produced and manufactured their products in the US, then the decline of publishing companies could be offset by the creation/maintenance of manufacturing/production jobs making iPads, iPhones, iPods, etc.... But those jobs are being held by foreign workers.
"It''s a celebration, bitches..."
"Cocaine''s a hell of a drug, you know...."
Rick James
1948-2004- R.I.P.
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Senior Member
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17. April 2011 @ 20:39 |
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The world we live in is not the world of the 1800's. This is a GLOBAL society, a Global market.
You cannot simply force Apple to not build their pads in China. It wouldn't even be possible.
How would you do it? Tell Apple they're not allowed to sell them here? American's would not allow that.
Tell Apple that they have to pay a huge import tax? China would not allow that.
We all know that China especially and other countries, generally, are not playing fair on the trade market. They pay their labor force nothing and make our goods prohibitively expensive to their people. But you cannot simply start imposing arbitrary rules on other countries without consequences! If we placed Tariffs on China goods then China would do the same to us, or worse, call in our debt! These types of things can be every bit as terrible as an actual, shooting war.
That being said, the thing that really troubles me here is not that Apple builds its icrap in China, but that this idiot seems to be saying that we would be better off without technology at all because it causes old tech to become obsolete, thereby causing unemployment.
I think the same argument was made by the buggy whip manufacturers when the automobile was built!
These Liberal Democrats always seem to know what the problem is, but when it comes time to actually fix it they almost always just say... "Well, we'll take it from the rich to give to the poor."
This does not work. Technology WILL grow and evolve no matter what this idiot says and we had better be at the forefront or we WILL be relegated to third-world status.
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AfterDawn Addict
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17. April 2011 @ 21:12 |
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Neither he nor his father have ever HAD a real job, so how would he know if they are being eliminated by ipads.
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Junior Member
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17. April 2011 @ 23:43 |
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I'm sure all the people who bred horses around 1900 said the same thing about the invention of the combustible engine. Adapt or die. Don't stop progress for the sake of it.
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17. April 2011 @ 23:47 |
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i agree with him but one with i don't is yeh they are but its making things more efficient
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. April 2011 @ 01:08 |
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I don't agree with most of the things that this guy said, but it would be nice if more things had, "Mad in the USA" stickers on them...as it is, you can't even be sure that a new Chevy/Dodge/Ford is made in the USA (although a new Toyota is almost certainly made in the USA). Unless you are buying food, tools, or a foreign car, it is very hard to find something made in the USA.
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Member
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18. April 2011 @ 01:11 |
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Originally posted by kragshot:
Originally posted by Hyasuma:
welcome to the new age fool! Why don't you blame all Amazon Kindle, Nook by Barnes and Noble or any smart phone device that can read any books? I'm not planing to say that I like Ipad, but is unfair that you only going after one thing but not the others.
Uh...he's using Apple and the iPad as an example because the iPad is the foremost and most visibly profitable of eReader/tablet technology. He is not calling for direct targeting of Apple, but instead asking the congress to hold American companies like Apple liable for the economic results of their outsourcing jobs that directly affect the American economy.
If Apple produced and manufactured their products in the US, then the decline of publishing companies could be offset by the creation/maintenance of manufacturing/production jobs making iPads, iPhones, iPods, etc.... But those jobs are being held by foreign workers.
"Steve Job sure is doing pretty well" I think he is directly targeting Apple more than anything.
Being nice always has its own consequences
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jookycola
Member
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18. April 2011 @ 01:17 |
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So when we run out of oil to provide energy or have nuclear war and there is no more electricity how do people plan to read? Sorry call me old fashioned, but i like my books to be paper.
Just saying.
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. April 2011 @ 02:06 |
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Originally posted by jookycola:
So when we run out of oil to provide energy or have nuclear war and there is no more electricity how do people plan to read? Sorry call me old fashioned, but i like my books to be paper.
Just saying.
If there is a nuclear war, the only survivors will be in deep bunkers with their own atomic reactors...no worries about power there (and if power is lost, everyone will die of CO2 poisoning).
As for a non-nuclear societal collapse, there are always solar panels, manual generators, wind power, etc...it does not take much power to run an iPad, and it is the most power hungry of the bunch.
My only concern is the 1984 factor...if all books and documents are digital, and they are all in the cloud or on internet connected devices with DRM, it is theoretically possible that Winston's job could actually exist. However, a device with the DRM stripped out stops all that.
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Member
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18. April 2011 @ 02:27 |
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This politician is an idiot. Things like newspapers and brick and mortar book stores are relics of the past. Maybe he can introduce legislation that will subsidize book stores and newspapers so Americans can keep working there.
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FreddyF
Junior Member
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18. April 2011 @ 04:31 |
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TEXTBOOKS!!! What a MORON! Textbooks are the worst example of a product hurt by technology. They are the best example of an overpriced sunsidized bad product that people are forced to buy. Just a few months ago congress was saying they should require e-textbooks to make them more affordable. Requiring all textbooks to be electronic would save billions! The problem is the same as with any other media, they don't want people to know that most of the cost goes to overpaid management that does absolutely nothing. WIth thextbooks they release new versions,with few changes to force printing and sales of new books, and increase profits, of course.
I find it interesting that none of the booksellers are complaining about e-books because they are making millions selling them. E-books are generally more expensice than paper books, even though they cost less to produce and e-books have a longer lifecycle than paper books. Once you take the printing out, you can look at the pennies the author gets and see publishing houses take most of the money from books, movies and CDs.
Of course, he isn't up there because he had some great inspiration. I expect if anyone checked they would fing his inspiration came in the form of a campaign contribution.
The world is changing, we either change with it or we become obsolete. Congress can do absolutely nothing to stop the change, they either need to stop being the problem and be the solution. Unfortunetely they get paid lots of money by companies that can't accept change and aren't creative enough to understand how to profit from it.
As far as how much is made in China, that doesn't worry me as much as how much is made by one company in China, FOXCONN. They make almost every apple product and laptop sold today. That's scares me a lot more.
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nowe
Newbie
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18. April 2011 @ 04:51 |
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Originally posted by Hammid:
Adapt or die!
So, Jesse Jr. wants Americans to have the low wage jobs the Chinese "enjoy" instead of the high wage jobs Apple pays its employees. Brilliant! I wonder when Jesse Jr. will be submitting a bill to repeal the minimum wage, because there is no way an American made iPad will only cost $500.
Who voted for this person?!
ah - maybe the priority should be jobs rather than price of iPads???
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. April 2011 @ 08:02 |
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Originally posted by nowe:
Originally posted by Hammid:
Adapt or die!
So, Jesse Jr. wants Americans to have the low wage jobs the Chinese "enjoy" instead of the high wage jobs Apple pays its employees. Brilliant! I wonder when Jesse Jr. will be submitting a bill to repeal the minimum wage, because there is no way an American made iPad will only cost $500.
Who voted for this person?!
ah - maybe the priority should be jobs rather than price of iPads???
Corporations are there to make money. They are actually obligated to break the law, pollute the planet, destroy economies, and do anything else which will make them money...failing to do so can actually constitute a crime.
If you want a corporation to do anything, you have to put it into a situation where doing what you want is the most profitable route. Sometimes that means suing for pollution, sometimes it means bringing crimes to light and thus hurting sales, sometimes it means grass roots organization against a product that does more harm than good.
In the case of apple, there really isn't any hope...the loyal fanboys will keep buying whatever they make, even if the devices fail to start due to shorts caused by the blood of the 3rd world children who build them. The case of the iPhone5 could be made from the bones of children, and it would still sell out 3 months before launch.
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. April 2011 @ 16:57 |
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All ebooks will be government "content checked" before download, therefore keeping mind control of what is perceived correct, what they deem should be correct. You can't do this with printed books. Soon they will have complete control when every precinct in country has electronic voting machines -one button push will rearrange vote total to their liking. It's gonna be so much fun living in "Animal Farmington USA."
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ZeusAV
Member
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18. April 2011 @ 17:31 |
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People don't realize that China also falsely devalues its currency in order to keep the price of its exports down. Which in turn makes their goods even cheaper for American corporations. It's pretty much economic warfare on the US and EU. No politician in the US has the balls to stand up to the Chinese so they just continue to do it and get richer in order to have more money for the US government to borrow for its wars.
Also note that many countries charge taxes on goods imported from the US while in the US most goods from other countries are allowed to come into the country for free.
People also don't know that prior to WWI the US government made so much money from import duties that there wasn't even a personal income tax on citizens.
No country in history has maintained its military or "superpower" status while suffering economically (see early 20th century Britain). Unless some major changes take place, expect China to be running things 15-20yrs from now.
The only people who benefit from outsourcing are large corporations and the governments of nations like China and India. They're allowed to do so because corporations run the US government.
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SomeBozo
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20. April 2011 @ 11:41 |
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