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Please help! i'm clueless
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Senior Member
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15. July 2004 @ 12:36 |
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Ritek Ridata 2.4X DVD+RW is a good choice. One or ten? I would get more than one ... only because if you scratched the only one you had, it could make it unreadable. And so I would want a backup. I have well over 200 burns on a couple of mine, and I'm still going strong. The rest depends on your personal needs and your budget.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. July 2004 @ 12:37
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asi2577
Newbie
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15. July 2004 @ 22:34 |
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That's strange, your error post (the long one) said you had 1.0A not 1.0B:
(Recorder: <_NEC DVD_RW ND-1300A> Version: 1.0A - HA 2 TA 0 - 6.3.1.17)
Where do you live because the site you posted is not the USA site
(www.NEC.com-USA - www.de.NEC.de-Not USA)?
You may want to remember how you got that drive, there are different firmware updates for that same drive...
From: http://forum.rpc-1.com/dl_firmware.php?download_id=1517
NEC ND-1300A - 1.05, 1.06, 1.07, 1.08, 1.09, 1.0A, 1.0B / 1.10 , 1.11 , 1.16 (for OEM drives with 1.1x firmware) / 1.21 (for Iomega OEM drives with 1.2x firmware) / 103D (for Dell OEM drives) / 1.42 (for Fujitsu OEM drives)
NEC does not post the firmware on there site, it tells you to goto the manufactures website. (Our drives are sold directly to computer manufacuters. Please contact the company that sold you the drive for drivers, firmware and support.).
You may really want to check if the right firmware is installed.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. July 2004 @ 22:37
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asi2577
Newbie
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15. July 2004 @ 22:45 |
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Did you read the Readme file
-this Update works only with NEC ND-1300A (retail&bulk), not with OEM releases.
(OEM means part of a full PC package or external USB/FireWire variant of this burner)
For OEM products contact your dealer, distributior or manufacturer of PC package.
-Warranty will be lost during false updating procedure (especially modified firmwares were used before).
We (NEC) cannot guarantee correct updating, if "modified" firmwares, e.g. "herrie.rpc1.org" or
"etna.rpc1.org" etc., were used before, it is true such "hacks" offer a recovery function, but their
manufacturers had only assembled firmwares (NEC will never release original firmwares!), so
>YOU WILL NEVER HAVE THE SAFETY THAT
>YOUR DRIVE HAS THE ORIGINAL FIRMWAREVERSION AGAIN!
In such cases we could not offer you a solution any more. You have to repair it by cost then.
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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16. July 2004 @ 08:53 |
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MindGod,
Again I say, you have the correct firmware for that drive - SOMEBODY, QUICK MY SIG -
Quote:
The NEC guide on NEC.com listed TDK as a recommended media.
It's fine for Data backups, MP3 and even .Jpg and .Gif files BUT when we do DVD backups, it's another story -
(Here we go again Flip)
MindGod, I know you're not using Memorex but I'm going to use Memorex as an excellent example as media goes, figures as high as 50% coasters have been reported (One member bought a stack of 50 and got 23 good burns.), not what I would call an impressive record. There are 4 different companies that manufacture Memorex BTW and product quality varies widely as you might imagine. Easy to see now why the quality of a big-named company can't be trusted - " Who's making your Memorex tonight ?" Note: Memorex in the singles, 5 or 10 pack, as a rule, cause less problem than those Memorex sold in bulk BUT they still aren't recommended for DVD backups.
Is it just Memorex ? No ! I just used Memorex as an example. Fuji, Sony, TDK, Orange Pack and many Ritek and Verbatim discs aren't suitable as a DVD backup media - that's why we are specific in the type of media we are recommending.
1. * Cheap media freezes, skips, pixelats and may refuse to be recognized :-(
Besides "Freezing", "skips" and pixelations, many times you'll get a "Cyclic Redundancy error" or an "I/O error". This message can mean that your discs are scratched or dirty, it can also mean that your burner won't accept your "cheap" media :-(
Another problem which "pops up" is a "*Power Calibration Error". This can stop you right in your tracks and most often is caused by, Yep, you guessed it, inexpensive media.
*A "Power Calibration Error" can also be attributed to the Optical Components of a DVD Writer, though this isn't usually the case. Trying to shut down your software and ejecting your DVD then restarting your program and re-inserting the same media recently cleaned has been known to help.
Inexpensive media or even average media is great for text, Data, Spreadsheets, .Jpg and .Gif pictures and is good even for MP3 music BUT for DVD backups - BLAaaaaaT! It SUCKTH in an extremely Big-th way !
2. A good grade, Hi-quality media is needed for DVD reproduction !
"Branded" Ritek G04's or Branded Verbatim are what we're looking for OR any media boasting "Advanced Metal AZO." - BUT it MUST SAY "METAL" AZO !, this indicates a superior dye application, while they are sometimes a bit "pricey" they are acceptable.
Prices online from Meritline.com have gotten Ritek G04 starting at about a 1/2 dollar($ .50 USD) a disc -
Question - If you make coasters out of 3 cheap or even average discs and good copies from 3 Branded Verbatim discs or 3 "Branded" Ritek G04 discs - which ones then will you say are too expensive ? The 3 "Cheapo's with no movie backup OR, the 3 recommended discs with a perfect backup on each disc ?
Bear in mind, Memorex, Fuji, Sony, TDK, Orange Pack and others are quite good for your MP3 music, picture archives, Spread sheets, Data and your text backups and archives, they just don't work well for DVD backups. Even DataSafe G04's made by Ritek have been reported as an inferior quality media and are evoking that "Oh no, I shouldn't have gotten those."
Remember, for DVD backups, purchasing inexpensive media or even average media is a gamble, some people win, the majority of people lose, varying amounts but, they still lose :-(
Let's try the right media for the job - just buy a 5 pack of what we recommend that will settle it once and for all - Don't cheat though, buy the EXACT media we recommended -
Using good grade media can guarantee you one thing to an absolute certainty; it surely cannot hurt.
BTW, In an effort to clear the air, when I speak of "Cheap" or "Inexpensive" media, I'm not referring to the price you pay at the counter - I'm referring to the type of composite some manufactures use, their method of dye application and the lack of OR the poor quality control used during manufacturing. when I say "Branded" that means that when you pick up a disc in your hand, it says "Ritek" or "Verbatim" on the disc itself. The monetary cost of the media we recommend many times is cheaper than that you are buying now.
cheers,
Pete
PS
FAIR WARNING. . . Using that "Cheap" media, your backups may not last all that long -
One thing I haven't addressed is the life of a backup made on an "el cheapo" disc. We all know that data, music and video backups on CD's and DVD's will last forever, well, if not forever for at least 100 yrs or so - That's what we've read and that's why we backup our treasures to disc, so that they'll be safe. "BLAaaaT" (the bone chilling sound of an emergency air horn), Wrong, Dead Wrong ! Don't throw the originals away, you may very well need them. Your video camera tapes and family picture CD's and DVD's, may not be there the next time you want to look at them. "Point of fact," inferior discs have a tendency to "Break down]" in time. In a very short time, we're talking disc breakdown in less than a single year, in as little as 6 to 8 months.
Important, please read -
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/science_technology/story.jsp?story=513486
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. July 2004 @ 08:56
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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16. July 2004 @ 10:54 |
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Thanks pete for your detailed response,well I am about to buy Ritek Ridata 2.4X DVD+RW
That should be perfect for DVD backups right?
And the post about the firmware freaked me out...I do have the RIGHT firmware right..
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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16. July 2004 @ 10:56 |
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In case my answer got lost somewhere,
I suggest you get single-write media, not RW stuff.
Remember, allot of standalones don't play RW media.
I use my RW stuff for practicing with, storing backup PC data on and the like - When you wish to have discs to play on standalones, use good quality single-write media -
cheers,
Pete
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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16. July 2004 @ 11:03 |
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Yea but, I have a Sony DVD player and it plays RW media very well. I never had a problem. I am reluctant to buy a DVD-R because what happens if an error happens? Then that Disc is USELESS. RW can be re-used.
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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16. July 2004 @ 12:03 |
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Quote:
I have a Sony DVD player and it plays RW media very well. I never had a problem.
OK, if you're never going to take a disc out of the house and you can afford that many RW discs, I reckon there's no problem at all. Me, I have about 700+ DVDs and to back them up using RWs compared to the single-write Ritek G04's and "branded" Verbatims that I use would have costs me literally many of hundreds of dollars more, not a few bucks but many hundreds of dollars more - The numbers of coasters ? Maybe $10.00(USD). I can afford $10.00, I can't afford Hundreds more -
Quote:
I am reluctant to buy a DVD-R because what happens if an error happens? Then that Disc is USELESS. RW can be re-used.
I hope that holds true for just your DVDs.
Imagine if you felt that way about driving and you stayed home forever because you could have an accident - see where I'm coming from ?
When I begin using a new proggy, I use RWs too. When I make a couple of burns and all goes well, I switch to single-write because I want to have that movie for as long as possible. Once you get the "Hang" of it - the chance of errors drops to near zero. I use quite a few proggys to do backups because I like the variety :) I know how to use them all now so coasters are rare BUT if I get a coaster, I switch to RWs until I iron out the problem -
Each to his own, as I said in the beginning, if you'll always have that player or one that will play RWs, fine.
cheers,
Pete
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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16. July 2004 @ 16:26 |
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thanks pete and thanks to everyone who replied and everyone on this forum. THis is a very neat forum with helpful suggestions. I ended up ordering a ten pack of Ritek Ritadas (DVD+RW) and as you suggested pete, i also ordered a couple of GO4s. (well just one lol). I will post the results as soon as I try them. If this won't solve the illegal disc problem, well then I will throw my drive out the window! (just kidding)
thanks for all the support!!!!!!
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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16. July 2004 @ 17:17 |
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Time to say your prayers -
"P"
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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17. July 2004 @ 17:57 |
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STRANGE!!!. I did some various tests on the TDK (i'm still waiting for the RITEK) DVD+RW and what I found was that the SAME disc that did not work once (said illegal disc) worked today perfectly. What I did was try to erase each blank disc through Nero, this makes the disc formatted and improves it's performance. WEll as I stated the discs that said illegal disc error during the erase yesterday worked today with no problems. THE SAME DISCS!!!. So is this just a result of "cheap media" or marginal media, or is this something unique with my computer. thanks. BTW, No additional programs worked in the background.
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Senior Member
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17. July 2004 @ 18:09 |
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Yes ... bad media. Nero will recognize good RW media and set up to write right away.
Am I reading your latest post correctly, in that your results are different than before?
Quote:
I set Ultrabuffer to automatic and the RW erased perfectly, then when the copy started it said: disc formatted successful and then it started writing and boom illegal disc error again! As for medias that worked already, when i erase them and try again, they work well. weird.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) |
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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17. July 2004 @ 18:18 |
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Here's the thing: What I noticed is, with bad media that is (tdk, fujifilm) is that if you put the disc in and erase it through quick-erase in Nero and the erase is successful, then the disc will work during back-up. Why? because the quick-erase function formats the disc.
SO i tried this. Yesterday, I tried about 5 TDK DVD+RW discs and Nero WOULD NOT ERASE THEM. It said ILLEGAL DISC. TODAY, I tried the SAME 5 (about 5) discs and they erased perfectly.
what i'm wondering: is this just bad media or something else, like a bad drive.
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Senior Member
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17. July 2004 @ 19:14 |
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Bad drives tend to be consistent - either good or bad. I know that what is happening defies logic. It's the media ... in combination with your drive ... in combination with the software. You might get different results with a different drive, but why would you want to stay with crappy media anyway?
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. July 2004 @ 19:15
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mindgod
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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17. July 2004 @ 22:04 |
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Quote:
Bad drives tend to be consistent - either good or bad. I know that what is happening defies logic. It's the media ... in combination with your drive ... in combination with the software. You might get different results with a different drive, but why would you want to stay with crappy media anyway?
I ORDERED RITEK RIDATA DVD+RW, SO MY BAD MEDIA DAYS ARE OVER. BUT THE POINT IS BEFORE I TRY OUT THE GOOD RITEK MEDIA, I REALLY WANT TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS ISSUE. I WAS ALWAYS A FIRM BELIEVER IN LOGIC NOT CHANCE, AND I AM STILL (EVEN AFTER DOC AND PETE'S EXPLANATIONS) BEWILDERED BY THE FACT THAT THE VERY SAME MEDIA THAT DIDNT WORK BEFORE WORKED NOW.
BUT I CAN'T SAY ANYTHING WITH REAL CREDIBILITY UNTIL I TEST THE RITEK. IT SHOULD WORK FOR THE FIRST TRY RIGHT?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. July 2004 @ 22:06
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Senior Member
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17. July 2004 @ 22:26 |
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Quote:
I REALLY WANT TO GET TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS ISSUE
First, please don't use capitals. It's rude. Read the rules.
Second, you are obviously a logical person looking for a logical answer. That's why I mentioned logic. To get a little more detailed, different manufacturers use different dyes, and their manufacturing processes vary. Drives also vary in their ability to read info. If you really want to understand all this, there is a load of research data on the web that makes for some pretty dry reading, and if you are really determined to wade through it, I think you will begin to understand.
Third, if Ritek doesn't work for you, you will be the first person I've ever known about. As far as Ritek "working the first try" ... it sounds like you are trying to shift responsibility to the people kind enough at AD to give you well-founded, free advice. Please understand that your problem is ultimately your responsibility. And, it is certainly your option to not follow the advice given to you.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 18. July 2004 @ 01:30
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Moderator
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17. July 2004 @ 22:48 |
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Yea, No all caps ... It's considered yelling.
Mindgod,
I was going throught your posts and noticed you've got three optical drives. Is your dvd burner an internal or external drive? If it's internal can you post the exact setup? Have you tried making the dvd burner the master drive on one ide cable, making the dvd-rom the slave on the same cable and removing your cd burner completely?
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Senior Member
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17. July 2004 @ 23:44 |
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mindgod...
This is a start on some research. Search "DVD Dyes".
http://www.opticaldisc-systems.com/2003JulyAug/Recordble36.htm
A low-grade dye will have "pits" with poorly defined boundaries, and these can also deform into adjacent pits. Dye stability is also an issue with RW media. And, you also have to have an electro-mechanical device that must be tuned just right to read, but mostly write, these nano-sized pits. Too much laser and you get a big, oversized pit. Or, the dye may not be matched for your drive's lazer, which means a normal pulse could yield a big pit. The dye layer must also be precisely applied, or results will vary. All of this makes for a marginal situation. And, this is just the start of the variables that you begin to deal with. Here's a link about just how small these pits are, and their spacing. It's easy to see how they could overlap.
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/dvd4.htm
Yes, conceptually, things should work, and this is the logic of it. In practice, there are a lot of variables we don't take into account. Media is the biggest variable we deal with.
Could your problem be something else besides media? There is always that chance that something was overlooked.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 18. July 2004 @ 01:35
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2004 @ 12:23 |
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Quote:
Media is the biggest variable we deal with.
Yep, the "Doc's" right, there're soooo many problems that are media releated - most have no idea -
As long as we are discussing media, here's another link that may answer some of your questions - and if you want to do DVD backups, you should have questions -
DVD's Demystified may answer some of those questions -
http://dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html#4.3
cheers,
Pete
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Senior Member
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18. July 2004 @ 12:56 |
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) |
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2004 @ 13:21 |
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Yea, yea, yea, y'all say you like to see me but it's only my shark you really know and love - - -
lol
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Senior Member
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18. July 2004 @ 14:24 |
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Ya makes me laugh, Pete. :-)
When I see da shark, 'itsa conditioned response ... know what I mean??? eh???
And ... thanks for the post "over there." I see the big fish is alive and well.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) |
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2004 @ 16:14 |
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Hope we took a little wind out of his self-inflated sails and got him to listen to you Doc, sometimes the little guys "Know too much" Heh, heh :-)
Sea Ya Buddy,
Pete
(Here sharkie, Here sharkie - )
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Senior Member
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18. July 2004 @ 17:03 |
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ummm.
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I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. (Pablo Picasso) This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 19. July 2004 @ 14:59
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ScubaPete
AfterDawn Addict
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19. July 2004 @ 14:35 |
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Well Doc, these threads are really supposed to be for the purpose of helping Newbies not us "Gabbing" :)
Sooooo, if I don't see a "Newbie" in distress, so to speak, I'm going to ask that this thread be closed - :P)
Me, I'm headed back to the ole water cooler, the one by the "Potted Palm."
You're welcome to join me, you too Flip ole' Buddy -
an, as they say in the underwater world,
Sea yaaaaaaaaaaa . . . .
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