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Bloomberg: Upcoming Xbox to use custom AMD processor
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The following comments relate to this news article:
article published on 8 April, 2013
Microsoft will use an AMD processor in its upcoming Xbox console, say sources, allowing the company to keep costs lower and giving developers an easier way to create games.
The Wii U and the upcoming PlayStation 4 both use AMD chips.
Reports claim the "Xbox will use an AMD system-on-a-chip that combines powerful "Jaguar" central processing units with graphics chips," moving away from ... [ read the full article ]
Please read the original article before posting your comments.
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Senior Member
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8. April 2013 @ 21:41 |
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Well that's dumb... So now you have to keep your old console or buy the old console to play previous generation games. Way to screw the gamers... Guess I will be waiting on the alleged next gen consoles from Microsoft and Sony...
They better start making TVs with a lot more HDMI inputs unless people plan to ditch all the games they have now with their current consoles from Microsoft or Sony.
If Microsoft and Sony are going to pull this crap of killing off backwards compatibility then they should remake all the games for digital distribution to the new console and give them to the people that bought the original game for free or for very very cheap like a $1
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. April 2013 @ 21:53
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Senior Member
28 product reviews
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8. April 2013 @ 23:03 |
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If these rumours are true, then they are doing a really shitty job at marketing their new consoles. I think I'm finished with Microsoft, I'll be buying the PS4 and not the new Xbox, unless they...
1) Get rid of Xbox Live, PlayStation owners don't have to pay to play online and use services such as Netflix, youtube, so why the hell are we paying for it?
2) ADD Backwards compatibility, how hard is it really?
3) ADD Blu-ray, enough with 2 DVD's for a game, time to move on.
4) No DRM, if I can't play offline, and can only play a game on 1 console, then see ya later.
If Microsoft doesn't do all these things, I'm out, the only real things I like about Xbox is the Controller and some exclusive games. I'm sure there will be 3rd Party Xbox controllers that will work with the PS4.
Yes these are just rumours, but then again, the confirmed specs for the PS4 were also just rumours too by the same sources.
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DDR4life
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8. April 2013 @ 23:31 |
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@mike.m
Wait, playstation owners don't pay for Netflix? Really?!?
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A5J4DX
Senior Member
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8. April 2013 @ 23:43 |
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hmm....
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8. April 2013 @ 23:48 |
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Originally posted by DDR4life:
@mike.m
Wait, playstation owners don't pay for Netflix? Really?!?
I think he means with XBL you need to have a gold account which requires a subscription fee to use Netflix. Based on PSN's history I am not against paying a small fee for online services and seeing as XBL is more stable and secure and I have not ever paid more than $40 a year for the service it is worth $3-$4 a month. Although I hear PSN has some nice perks with their paid service.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. April 2013 @ 23:48
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8. April 2013 @ 23:59 |
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OMG, I am so having the last laugh. :)
But as to the backward compatibility arguments they'll just expect you to re-buy games you want to play again... like they do now. I haven't minded that too much as they have been somewhat cheaper and in HD too but it's lame to redo it again for the next gen and no improvement in game specs this time around either.
EDIT: I suppose old last-gen 720p games will be in 1080p with higher anti-aliasing so that might make it worth it to re-buy for some perhaps.
Funny how it's x86 architecture.
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Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. April 2013 @ 00:24
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9. April 2013 @ 08:16 |
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Originally posted by Jemborg:
OMG, I am so having the last laugh. :)
But as to the backward compatibility arguments they'll just expect you to re-buy games you want to play again... like they do now. I haven't minded that too much as they have been somewhat cheaper and in HD too but it's lame to redo it again for the next gen and no improvement in game specs this time around either.
EDIT: I suppose old last-gen 720p games will be in 1080p with higher anti-aliasing so that might make it worth it to re-buy for some perhaps.
Funny how it's x86 architecture.
Well I look at it this way. Both the 360 and PS3 had at least some backwards compatibility initially which allowed for a bit of a transition from one console to another. Once the console was established they saw the need for that died down. Now that both the PS4 and NextBox are essentially going PC architecture I see little to no need to invest in those consoles and instead will invest that for a better video card for my already quad core HTPC connected to my TV and go PC gaming. It was the convenience of a console connected to my Big screen TV that kept me more of a console gamer but now that technology allows for connectivity to TVs all digital through HDMI a locked console seems worthless aside from a few exclusives from each brand.
I think many gamers will also come to this conclusion and do the same. At least if they are smart.
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Bozobub
Senior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 09:44 |
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Getting upset about the lack of backward compatibility seems supremely silly to me; apparently everyone has forgotten that NO consoles were ever backwards-compatible with an older model, until the PlayStation and XBox lines.
Anyone here ever play an NES cartridge on their SNES? No, you did not =) .
Nearly all of the people who have games for an older system still have that system. Whether you hook it up to a different TV, use a different input on the TV (likely), use an HDMI (or w/e input cable) switch, or simply swap cables, you can still use the older system. It's not like the older games will look any better on the new hardware; in fact, they generally look worse!
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9. April 2013 @ 10:06 |
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Originally posted by Bozobub:
Getting upset about the lack of backward compatibility seems supremely silly to me; apparently everyone has forgotten that NO consoles were ever backwards-compatible with an older model, until the PlayStation and XBox lines.
Anyone here ever play an NES cartridge on their SNES? No, you did not =) .
Nearly all of the people who have games for an older system still have that system. Whether you hook it up to a different TV, use a different input on the TV (likely), use an HDMI (or w/e input cable) switch, or simply swap cables, you can still use the older system. It's not like the older games will look any better on the new hardware; in fact, they generally look worse!
Times have changed since the NES/SNES cartridge based console days my friend. Maybe Nintendo has spoiled me by having backwards compatibility to at least one console previously at least initially in the new console life. Because if the games were not directly compatible they made them available as much as they could for free or a reasonable price. I got some NES, SNES, N64 games as part of promotions when I bought a new game on initial release. For example I got a Zelda collection disc set that had some older Zelda games like Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Link to the Past when I bought Wind Waker on the GameCube. Nintendo offers a huge library of Virtual Console games for older consoles that is very popular amongst the gamers.
Also like I mentioned above the fact that I have to keep the old console around makes me want to abandon those consoles all together because TVs have only so many inputs and you can only cram so many devices around your TV. Looks like my next $400 is going to a video card for a PC already capable of running the vast majority of games that come out for those consoles.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. April 2013 @ 10:12
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AfterDawn Addict
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9. April 2013 @ 10:08 |
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Originally posted by Bozobub:
Getting upset about the lack of backward compatibility seems supremely silly to me; apparently everyone has forgotten that NO consoles were ever backwards-compatible with an older model, until the PlayStation and XBox lines.
Anyone here ever play an NES cartridge on their SNES? No, you did not =) .
Nearly all of the people who have games for an older system still have that system. Whether you hook it up to a different TV, use a different input on the TV (likely), use an HDMI (or w/e input cable) switch, or simply swap cables, you can still use the older system. It's not like the older games will look any better on the new hardware; in fact, they generally look worse!
The simple fact is that most people don't want to use multiple consoles for gaming...they want one small console that doesn't take up much room by the TV, and ideally it should play BluRays so they don't need a standalone unit for that too. Half the time when someone says they don't like PC gaming, their reason is that they would have to take up space for a PC case near their TV, and they simply refuse to do that. Will such a person have a stack of old consoles?
On the paid online front, I agree that (at least) 3rd party services like NetFlix should not require you to pay money to Microsoft just to access them. It is bad enough that you have to connect to their servers at all when their servers are not providing the service, as PS3 users discovered when their netflix stopped working because the PSN was down.
Personally, my computer has maintained software support over the extreme long-term, even picking up support for the console games over time. Now all the consoles are going back to x86-based chips, and I figure that is very good for me because more games will have PC versions and the job of making emulators to play the remaining titles will take far less time and processing power.
BTW...I did play NES games on my SNES...the adapters were about the same cost as one game. That's the only cartridge console I remember that had this feature...but there may have been others that just didn't make the magazines.
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9. April 2013 @ 10:14 |
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Originally posted by KillerBug:
Originally posted by Bozobub:
BTW...I did play NES games on my SNES...the adapters were about the same cost as one game. That's the only cartridge console I remember that had this feature...but there may have been others that just didn't make the magazines.
Thats true, I also had an adapter that allowed me to play Gameboy games on my SNES. Nintendo has always done what they can for the gamers to keep their past library alive and accessible to the gamers.
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Senior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 12:05 |
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Originally posted by bobiroc:
Well I look at it this way. Both the 360 and PS3 had at least some backwards compatibility initially which allowed for a bit of a transition from one console to another. Once the console was established they saw the need for that died down. Now that both the PS4 and NextBox are essentially going PC architecture I see little to no need to invest in those consoles and instead will invest that for a better video card for my already quad core HTPC connected to my TV and go PC gaming. It was the convenience of a console connected to my Big screen TV that kept me more of a console gamer but now that technology allows for connectivity to TVs all digital through HDMI a locked console seems worthless aside from a few exclusives from each brand.
I think many gamers will also come to this conclusion and do the same. At least if they are smart.
Can't say I disagree Bob. You and I are birds of a feather. Good use of bragging rights too mate, nice rig :). I myself built a mATX quad core gaming HTPC for the exact same reasons. Except in my case I'm going to upgrade the board and main processor etcetera. The card I have is the dual gpu HD5970 so I'll keep that (albeit noisy) bugger for a bit longer.
I use the great Xpadder for games (and any progs) that don't have a controller interface btw.
It's a nice contrast against the OUYA I'm getting don't ya think? :D
Cheers.
PS: PC games still don't exploit more than 4 logic cores in the cpu right?
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
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Senior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 12:13 |
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Originally posted by Jemborg:
PS: PC games still don't exploit more than 4 logic cores in the cpu right?
Not Usually. I also have an AMD A10 Powered HTPC that I probably would slap in a nice mid-higher end Radeon Card in that is about $300 - $450 to make that a gaming machine. Already use it for my BluRay player and media streaming device and I have an XBOX controller for PC so I am almost all set anyway. Just load on my Steam account and maybe throw in a secondary hard drive for game storage (I think I have a 2TB laying around somewhere) and away we go. It may not get the super high res or extreme Frames Per Second that it would get on a ultra high end gaming PC but neither do consoles and would provide a similar experience.
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aw2600
Junior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 12:34 |
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Originally posted by Bozobub:
Getting upset about the lack of backward compatibility seems supremely silly to me; apparently everyone has forgotten that NO consoles were ever backwards-compatible with an older model, until the PlayStation and XBox lines.
Backward and cross compatibility has been been available in consoles since the 80's. The Atari 7800 was backwards compatible with the 2600. There were 2600 adapters for the Intellivison and Colecovision. The Sega Genesis had the System Changer for Master System compatibility. There was the Super GameBoy for the SNES. Nintendo handhelds have almost always had one generation of backward compatibility. Most Wiis play GameCube games. Most PlayStation consoles are backward compatible one or two generations. XBox 360 plays XBox games.
We have come to expect a certain level of backwards compatibility to ease the transition to a new system.
I am lucky in that I have a room in my basement that I can use to setup many of the older systems that I collect. Most people don't want multiple systems connected to the family TV.
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Senior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 13:02 |
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Well if 1080p is your highest res Bob then no worries. I'm happy with that and 60 fps myself.
I just use my Xbox controller with the wireless adapter... works with the xbox FF steering wheel too. Mind you, Xpadder allows me to create my own complex and subtle controller interfaces if I don't like the one that comes with the game (if it has one). I also use it to control VLC remotely. What the heck, I also have the Logitech K400 wireless KB and touchpad, which is a nice size... not too big.
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. April 2013 @ 13:15
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SProdigy
Senior Member
5 product reviews
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9. April 2013 @ 15:46 |
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Get rid of the backward compatibility, get rid of the movie players and other crap, and give me a console at a lower cost. That's what I say.
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Senior Member
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9. April 2013 @ 15:52 |
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Originally posted by Jemborg:
Well if 1080p is your highest res Bob then no worries. I'm happy with that and 60 fps myself.
I just use my Xbox controller with the wireless adapter... works with the xbox FF steering wheel too. Mind you, Xpadder allows me to create my own complex and subtle controller interfaces if I don't like the one that comes with the game (if it has one). I also use it to control VLC remotely. What the heck, I also have the Logitech K400 wireless KB and touchpad, which is a nice size... not too big.
I will have to look into that XPadder.. I have a solar powered keyboard for my HTPC and a wireless mouse already but If I could use the controller to get into and launch some games or apps that would be pretty cool.
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DDR4life
Member
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9. April 2013 @ 17:05 |
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Originally posted by bobiroc:
Originally posted by DDR4life:
@mike.m
Wait, playstation owners don't pay for Netflix? Really?!?
I think he means with XBL you need to have a gold account which requires a subscription fee to use Netflix. Based on PSN's history I am not against paying a small fee for online services and seeing as XBL is more stable and secure and I have not ever paid more than $40 a year for the service it is worth $3-$4 a month. Although I hear PSN has some nice perks with their paid service.
Sorry, was being sarcastic. I'm fully aware that XBL Gold is a paid service, and ,imho, completely worth the price (XBOX 360 owner).
My comment was in reference to mike.m's first point:
... PlayStation owners don't have to pay to play online and use services such as Netflix, youtube, ...
At first read, it does sound like he said playstation owners dont pay to use netflix. Lol. I wasn't expecting anyone to take me seriously, though.
As for backward compatibility, There was an unlicensed cartridge adapter called "Super8" made for the SNES. It had three ports: one for standard NES cartridges, one for the Japanese Famicom cartridges, and one for SNES cartridges. Only one cartridge would fit in each slot at a time. After the peripheral was attached and the device turned on, a menu would appear on the tv screen; giving the user a choice between an 8-bit or 16-bit game. The user was able to play any one of the cartridges plugged in the system at a time.
SNES games operated identically to their original versions. NES games, however, had their controls remapped for the SNES controller. The Super 8 also played Super Famicom games, as there were no tabs to block the insertion of the flat back cartridges. (image: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Super8-plugged.jpg )
On the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive side. Sega had their official "adapter" called the Power Base Converter. A separate device that sits between a Master System cartridge and the Mega Drive's cartridge slot. The Power Base Converter did not contain any Master System components, instead functioning as a pass-through device, and consisting almost entirely of passive circuitry. The converter contained a top slot for cartridge-based games along with a front slot for card-based games, as well as the 3-D glasses adapter. When a Master System game was inserted, the system would put the Z80 in control, leaving the Mega Drive's main 68000 processor idle. (image: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sega-...e-Converter.jpg )
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. April 2013 @ 18:40
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10. April 2013 @ 01:45 |
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First off from all the reports I have seen that next Xbox will be cheaper than the PS4. The fact that backward compatibility won't be a part of the next gen of consoles doesn't break my heart. I mean there are games that I do play from a few years ago. There are only a few folks that go back and play the really old game because they love them so much. As for paying for XBL I don't have a problem with that since they have added some nice features. Add to that having to pay to play online, weeds out most of the D-bags that play multi-player games. Not all of them but once they act up and the whole room files a complaint. Well now they have to go and pay for a new membership. Can't wait for E3 this year and see what they have in store for us this holiday season.
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Senior Member
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10. April 2013 @ 02:51 |
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Originally posted by bobiroc:
I will have to look into that XPadder.. I have a solar powered keyboard for my HTPC and a wireless mouse already but If I could use the controller to get into and launch some games or apps that would be pretty cool.
Yeah, I just love it. I actually paid for this one... only one programmer, nice guy, and it's dirt cheap. Easier and much better than the other alternatives I assure you. You can set it up to auto-run profiles too by windows names or program titles. Xpadder keeps a track of the last progs run so it's easy to tell what to pick. I have a default windows profile for simple navigation then select whatever. Sometimes I have to auto-run a blank profile for certain games with a controller interface I like so there's no conflict with the default profile.
You can share profiles on the XPadder site. I built this mad profile for Bioshock2 that confounded some poor baby noobs because it was a little complex but utterly awesome (if I do say so myself :)) once you got the hang of it.
You can use any kind of controller by the way Bob, as long as the pooter recognises it.
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Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. April 2013 @ 11:06
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Mysttic
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10. April 2013 @ 09:34 |
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I look at the issue of no backwards compatibility as this: if it allows developers to orient on deving for PC games foremost and first to then be able to port over to a console version; I would presume it's a lot easier to dumb down a game than it is to have to program different variants of your code to have it compatible across all platforms. That will make the PC gaming market dominate again, and we won't be left with crappy ports with little heart waiting months for fixes leaving a sour taste in our mouths as we move on to PC exclusive titles. Don't get me wrong tho, I love my console gaming, it's no secret I a huge collector: but I think Sony and MS switch to x86 architecture was a very smart move. Too bad it's not 64-bit, but understandable when the majority of households are still using x86 PCs. Let this trend continue going to consoles forward and it'll be easier to be backward compatible for future generations to come.
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10. April 2013 @ 10:01 |
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Much to my surprise I've had several gaming rigs commissioned today. I think there's something in the fact people are underwhelmed with the direction of the new consoles... pretty much in line with what others have been saying here.
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
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Senior Member
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10. April 2013 @ 10:15 |
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Originally posted by Mysttic:
I look at the issue of no backwards compatibility as this: if it allows developers to orient on deving for PC games foremost and first to then be able to port over to a console version; I would presume it's a lot easier to dumb down a game than it is to have to program different variants of your code to have it compatible across all platforms. That will make the PC gaming market dominate again, and we won't be left with crappy ports with little heart waiting months for fixes leaving a sour taste in our mouths as we move on to PC exclusive titles. Don't get me wrong tho, I love my console gaming, it's no secret I a huge collector: but I think Sony and MS switch to x86 architecture was a very smart move. Too bad it's not 64-bit, but understandable when the majority of households are still using x86 PCs. Let this trend continue going to consoles forward and it'll be easier to be backward compatible for future generations to come.
The AMD APU being used is a 64bit processor. Not sure if operating systems to be used for those consoles is 64bit or not but the processor is capable of it.
As far as your other points about making it easier to port over games from PC I totally agree but still think if they are going to make this drastic change they should offer some good incentives to people that have a huge game library of the previous console. After all they will be saving all this money and time not having recode games for each console right?
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AfterDawn Addict
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10. April 2013 @ 12:41 |
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Originally posted by bobiroc:
Originally posted by Mysttic:
I look at the issue of no backwards compatibility as this: if it allows developers to orient on deving for PC games foremost and first to then be able to port over to a console version; I would presume it's a lot easier to dumb down a game than it is to have to program different variants of your code to have it compatible across all platforms. That will make the PC gaming market dominate again, and we won't be left with crappy ports with little heart waiting months for fixes leaving a sour taste in our mouths as we move on to PC exclusive titles. Don't get me wrong tho, I love my console gaming, it's no secret I a huge collector: but I think Sony and MS switch to x86 architecture was a very smart move. Too bad it's not 64-bit, but understandable when the majority of households are still using x86 PCs. Let this trend continue going to consoles forward and it'll be easier to be backward compatible for future generations to come.
The AMD APU being used is a 64bit processor. Not sure if operating systems to be used for those consoles is 64bit or not but the processor is capable of it.
As far as your other points about making it easier to port over games from PC I totally agree but still think if they are going to make this drastic change they should offer some good incentives to people that have a huge game library of the previous console. After all they will be saving all this money and time not having recode games for each console right?
So far the rumors have been $80 games and possibly always-on DRM...sounds like a great set of incentives!
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10. April 2013 @ 12:47 |
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Originally posted by KillerBug:
Originally posted by bobiroc:
Originally posted by Mysttic:
I look at the issue of no backwards compatibility as this: if it allows developers to orient on deving for PC games foremost and first to then be able to port over to a console version; I would presume it's a lot easier to dumb down a game than it is to have to program different variants of your code to have it compatible across all platforms. That will make the PC gaming market dominate again, and we won't be left with crappy ports with little heart waiting months for fixes leaving a sour taste in our mouths as we move on to PC exclusive titles. Don't get me wrong tho, I love my console gaming, it's no secret I a huge collector: but I think Sony and MS switch to x86 architecture was a very smart move. Too bad it's not 64-bit, but understandable when the majority of households are still using x86 PCs. Let this trend continue going to consoles forward and it'll be easier to be backward compatible for future generations to come.
The AMD APU being used is a 64bit processor. Not sure if operating systems to be used for those consoles is 64bit or not but the processor is capable of it.
As far as your other points about making it easier to port over games from PC I totally agree but still think if they are going to make this drastic change they should offer some good incentives to people that have a huge game library of the previous console. After all they will be saving all this money and time not having recode games for each console right?
So far the rumors have been $80 games and possibly always-on DRM...sounds like a great set of incentives!
If that is true then it means they are not passing on the cost savings to the customers that come from unifying the chip architecture to X86
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