Originally posted by windsong:

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Well I guess I now know how I'm acquiring this game. Pity, Ubisoft. A real pity.

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Quote:

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* You have five activations on three separate PCs.
* Uninstalling the game "refunds" an activation. This process is called "revoke", so as long as you complete proper uninstall you will be able to install the game an unlimited number of times on 3 systems.
* You can upgrade your computer as many times as you want (using our revoke system)
* Ubisoft is committed to the support of our games, and additional activations can be provided.
* Ubisoft is committed to the long-term support of our games: you'll always be able to play Far Cry 2.

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Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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Now if they would forget the silly install limits ad focus on flood control to suspend or black list the key (5 installs in a day,10 in a week,25 in a month) that would move things forward with activation issues.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by ZippyDSM:

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Now if they would forget the silly install limits ad focus on flood control to suspend or black list the key (5 installs in a day,10 in a week,25 in a month) that would move things forward with activation issues.

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I think that this is a really good point. It is a large number of installs that happens frequently that should be stopped. This is where they really lose the money. One copy getting leaked and shared 100's of times. Not so much one copy getting installed every 2 months because of computer upgrades or changing machines.

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Originally posted by sciafb:

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The idea they used is seriously retarded.. why can't they just give you all the files for the games and just require an account online with their servers to play it? They already require the internet for most of these games. And make it a deal with the customers to send out a patch for that specific game to unlock it to not require their servers to play it when they stop supporting it?

There's so many more ways to "get around" pirating, at least for their eyes. But we all know there will never be a game that can't be pirated! ;)

What about offline only games? Well...they could use the same old activation keys? Like any other retailing programs... whats the difference, its enough to say your trying to stop pirating, but it will never be stopped. So leave it at that!

If they continue with this rootkit style bullshit someone needs to step up and say the 2nd hand market is getting shafted and they need to change their tone about this securRom BS.

Side from that, I hate most of these games anyways, so I wouldn't be caught dead pirating them anyway.

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Originally posted by sblade .. a real hacker:

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I´m Sblade, and my posts stickied at many publishers forums speaks about my ellaborated work for helping gamers.

http://www.ataricommunity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=605340

http://forums.2kgames.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17665

I have one more at Bioware the first of the Securom TECH FAQ´s.

http://nwn2forums.bioware.com/forums/vie...30835&forum=116

I have 2 years+ experience in dealing with Securom, I´ve helped hundreds or maybe thousand of gamers to run their bought game.

It is fair when:

a) You don´t compromise end-users computers while trying to protect your work.

b) You don´t break many international laws, OpenSSL and GPL license by agreeing into the use of Securom.

Those two above facts make anyone who uses Securom no better than the pirates.

Now, I´ll entend my points.

a) 1) All DRM´s by definition, run in RING0

RINGS graphical explanation

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,1156611,00.asp

Here you will find a graphic of the rings:

RING0 Operating system Kernel (highest privilege)
RING 1-2 Operating System Services (Device Drivers.etc)
RING3: Applications (lowest Privilege)

One fact proof of those DRM´s running in RING0 is that almost all detect emulation and prevent the game from running.

If they have not the same authority as emulation, P:E: Daemon Tools, it will be impossible for these DRM´s to detect it

Securom hooks to the kernel only when doing his checks, which was a step forward from the draconian DRM named above. I have a Process Explorer log as proof of this. I can give it at demand.

Securom uses a virtual Minicom Driver used mainly for authentications

2)Windows DMA stepdown into PIO mode:
Disk I/O will cause windows to stepdown into PIO mode
DMA stepdown into PIO mode (Microsoft)
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/device/storage/IDE-DMA.mspx


Main problem in those new DRM´s checks is, when the data obtained is not within the tolerances that the DRM expected. Windows tries again and again.

It only takes a few Time outs for Windows to step down the DMA access completely (it does this silently) until you reach PIO mode.


There is no avoiding the fact that the use of any DRM that requires multiple disk checks will dramatically reduce the life cycle of your CD/DVD drive.

EA (I think Bioware, EA do not listen until proven innocent ), has learned it, that´s why Mass Effect comes with NO-DVD check.

Basically because these tests require direct firmware access to the drives. Combined with the DMA step down this can result in the drive treating the disk as an over burned one, sending the laser so fast to the outer edge that the fail-safe cut out does not have time to counteract it slamming against its mount, each time it does this it slowly trashes the wormgear and subsequently the laser stops being able to lock onto the track on the disk.


So basically if your modern DVD/CD drive stepsdown into PIO mode and you use for an extended period of time it will go to TRASH.


Proof link of DMA/Stepdown from Securom official page:
http://www.securom.com/message.asp?m=copy&c=1000

Now b)

Securom´s nastier version uses OPENSSL for online authentications.

You can view the readme file if you have Bioshock, Mass Effect or Spore in C:\Documents and Settings\<your Windows username>\Application Data\SecuROM\UserData

I won´t enter in OpenSSL history of unpatched things and holes, just google a bit and you´ll find for yourselves. I´ll give more details, but I have to prioritize my EA lawsuit so no info to the enemy.

I´ll end that this use of OpenSSL violates GNU public license.....

3. Protecting Users' Legal Rights From Anti-Circumvention Law.

No covered work shall be deemed part of an effective technological measure under any applicable law fulfilling obligations under article 11 of the WIPO copyright treaty adopted on 20 December 1996, or similar laws prohibiting or restricting circumvention of such measures.

I´ll end smashing the Rootkit discussion. I´ll use Mark Russinovich´s authority, a VIP engineer and ex head of sysinternals to expose it.

Rootkits are cloaking technologies that hide files, Registry keys, and other system objects from diagnostic and security software, and they are usually employed by malware attempting to keep their implementation hidden

http://spiresecurity.typepad.com/spire_s..._in_a_root.html

Look at the term usually employed by malware. It is NOT a requirement to be malware to be a rootkit. It is a rootkit as long as Securom hide files, has embedded and hidden registry keys without the user info and agreement.

Securom, while it may or may not be malware, it is clear that attempts to keep its implementation hidden. And still does its job. Many users doesn´t have or doesn´t have reallized their troubles are Securom related

You can have a look at this, sadly only for subscribers:

http://windowsitpro.com/article/articlei...-root-kits.html

The fact that Securom didn´t have an uninstaller made this damn DRM enter in Mark´s definition. That´s why they did an uninstaller in version 7.24.

HOWEVER the uninstaller does not remove the registry keys, so it stays as a rootkit again.

So Securom is a rootkit. Unless anyone here wants to deauthorize Mr. Russinovich Smile


So it´s fair to try to protect your work in some way? My answer is YES.

It´s fair to try to protect your work while compromising consumers computers, violating other copyright laws and installing rootkits?

Answer that yourself Raide, I won´t

Solutions: TAGES uninstalls itself completely, nor Starforce or Securom does. By completely I mean registry entries.

Regards
Sblade

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Originally posted by champman:

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As long as I get my activations back through correctly uninstalls as listed here, then Ubisoft should be praised for not having limitation on the amount of uninstalls. Its unlimited unless you suffer a serious system failure or don't uninstall it correctly so I don't see any problems & my pre-order stands.

FarCry 2 has the same DRM as Bioshock so no big deal there - unlike Spore which I detest. If you hate DRM, just buy it off Steam, etc..

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Originally posted by spamual:

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thanks for the personal insults, i have reported you.

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Originally posted by spamual:

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you dont think i could reply to that

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Originally posted by daelin914:

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Years ago, people used to have to put in the original CD in order for the game to play. While you may be able to duplicate a CD to make it happen, they could easily create a dongle for a couple of dollars that would work just as well.

Lauren

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Umm... this is more about the number of installs and the process you must go through to retain the number of installs. It's not so much having the disc to play the game. Another way to do what you were stating would be to make a virtual drive on your machine, so that you didn't need the disc, but that's not really what we were talking about here.

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Originally posted by varnull:

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It's also a real pain when that same DRM totally screws up a computer which you rely on for your business... And you can't completely remove it..

SecuROM will disable burners and any virtual drives or other software it doesn't like.. They don't have that right.. It's MY COMPUTER.. it doesn't belong to EA, Ubi, Sony, Microcrap or any other a$$wipe DRM peddler.... I have the right to install and use anything I damn well please on MY HARDWARE.. I don't need permission from Sony SecuROM for that. Anything which is installed without my permission and cannot be removed by normal means and interferes with my rights to use my hardware in any way I see fit.. legal or otherwise.. is malware.

http://x111.com/blog/littlemog/2008/10/21/oh-hell-no-ea/

still say this DRM is OK??

Ea and Ubi will both lose in court.. it will pretty much finish them off.. because millions of angry customers will not forget.. my friend in the link could quite legally sue them for lost earnings compensation and damages.. and bloody well should IMHO.

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