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PSJailBreak claims to run PS3 game backups
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The following comments relate to this news article:
article published on 19 August, 2010
PlayStation 3 has given modders and hackers a run for their money. For nearly fours years hackers have tried to create a working mod that would bypass the PS3 software protection and run homebrew applications and backups. However, there has been no real breakthroughs, until now, if you believe what PS3News has to say.
According to the site, a product called PSJailBreak will allow owners ... [ read the full article ]
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. August 2010 @ 17:53 |
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Originally posted by Oner:
Originally posted by rvinkebob:
Originally posted by Oner:
3) Will the external HDD have to be formatted in a special format and will/can it be seen when hooked to a PC
The page to order the flash drive states that the external drive is formatted as FAT32. That would be universally compatible with any OS.
Quote:
The little tiny donlge called PS Jailbreak allows you to dump all of your original PS3 games onto a FAT32 harddrive, and play the game directly from there.
Yep and just found out they are working on NTFS as well.
Originally posted by SDF_GR:
So... either only games thats under 4gb can be stored to the external drive or the game is saved as files and not as 1 big image file.
I was wondering about that as well but they say it is compatible with ALL games....
I bet some games will have to be patched but thats no real trouble.
Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Lets renegotiate them.
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PSWii60
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19. August 2010 @ 18:27 |
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I've really been reading into this so I think I understand what's going on and I think some of you are a bit wrong with your understanding of this, of course I could be wrong too but whatever.
First off, the price isn't $170. Well, it is, but it isn't the $170 you'd be thinking. The price is 170 Australian Dollars at OzModChips which equals about $145-$150 depending how good a day the economy is having. It's still very expensive but at least the Australian Dollar is worth less than the US Dollar and isn't worth more than the US Dollar...
Second off, my understanding is this basically uses a jigkick type thing where it makes the system believe it's running official Sony code (whether it be through hardware or software) and reboots the system as a debug unit. I've read that debug units have had the capability of playing games off the HDD for a while so this isn't a new sort of exploit in the ways of playing backups. What makes this different from the PSP was the battery did have some sort of connection to the CFW hacks and Sony was able to "patch" the exploit by making batteries differently. With this I'm not so sure, since I've read that USB by design runs whatever's on the stick without requiring hardware access/authentication. This hurts Sony even more because it's USB in that it's very easy to write and rewrite what's on the stick to adapt to a possible firmware fix and doesn't require proprietary dongles and whatnot.
The question is whether the dongle has some sort of special chip in there that once inserted the PS3 immediately recognizes it and runs it due to the nature of USB. Or it could be software doing the same thing. Either way it looks like a simple patch could render this useless since Sony could update a code type thing once updating the firmware like updating an Android device with an OTA update can disable root. Either way it sounds like nothing an update can't fix and nothing that would be very difficult to replicate. Unless this is an inside thing where someone who knows the codes gave out the info, Sony may very well be able to continue changing the code and requiring a new code from updated firmware'd systems. Of course I'm not a developer nor do I know much at all about hacking and whatnot and I could be COMPLETELY off in my understanding and knowledge of this.
I'd just wait until the devs give an in depth know-how about this thing and what is actually going on. Hopefully a dev can get one of these quickly and make sure this isn't anything hardware related before people spend $150+ on a simple USB stick. What this apparently does do too is homebrew/unsigned apps so could someone develop a CFW easier using this? Is this the key to CFWs and firmware update workarounds? Even if this does get patched quickly, it is a HUGE step for the PS3 scene and general and it may very well open some doors to new possibilities. Thankfully the system is far from dead and we haven't figured this out in the system's twilight years.
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19. August 2010 @ 18:46 |
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The $170 has been shown to be 1 of 2 things the AUS $ and the fact the store selling them seem to be charging more than others are (in the vicinity of $125). Plus there are rumors of a cloned version being available as early as next week possibly, and free ones right around the corner as well...
If this dongle is able to make retails into debugs then the ability to install debug pkgs may also be possible to run/install homebrew and utilize open ports for PC communications etc?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 19. August 2010 @ 18:51
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. August 2010 @ 18:48 |
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Originally posted by Oner:
The $170 has been shown to be 1 of 2 things the AUS $ and the fact the store selling them seem to be charging more than others are (in the vicinity or $125). Plus there are rumors of a cloned version being available as early as next week possibly, and free ones right around the corner as well...
Well they need money so they can make a profit and dissaper if the mafia shows up. I am not to worried about the price since this seems to be more a USB hack.
Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Lets renegotiate them.
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. August 2010 @ 18:51 |
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Originally posted by PSWii60:
Unless this is an inside thing where someone who knows the codes gave out the info, Sony may very well be able to continue changing the code and requiring a new code from updated firmware'd systems.
Yep, it came from a leaked SDK on Sony's end (which really, makes it very illegal) But like you said, it will be interesting to see how this develops. I personally will not be paying anywhere near the asking price, since it's just homebrew code on a dongle, I'm sure it will be possible to clone or reproduce it, and they are simply selling it at this high a price to get as much money as they can in the first little while.
What I think may happen is, groups and individuals may be able to remove updates from these games (much like the PSP) and it worst comes to worst, we still have games from the last 3 years we can play in the meantime! Backups of course.
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SDF_GR
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1 product review
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19. August 2010 @ 18:57 |
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Originally posted by Oner:
I was wondering about that as well but they say it is compatible with ALL games....
Thats what is worrying me the most to be honest LOL too good to be true.
the average number of hacks that we have seen 4 years now must be more than 1 hack per month.
Lets hope that this is true at least till the next FW update.
But if its true i dont think that the dongle has something special in it.
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SDF_GR
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19. August 2010 @ 19:57 |
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19. August 2010 @ 21:35 |
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Also this stick has full updatability.....This going to take more than a simple patch from Sony.
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. August 2010 @ 23:01 |
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Originally posted by Oner:
Lets say you actually need this USB Dongle for it to work because of some embedded flashable hardware built into it (thus making all USB's thumbdrives incompatible), then the work around to keep it "legal" would be to sell the Dongle without the flash and have the customer just DL the files and flash it themselves. Done. Legal. Because the Dongle is empty...either way I can wait a little bit longer until a free double hacked version hits the net.
Actually, the recent Jailbreaking case applies; that is why they are calling it a jailbreak instead of a hack. Since this returns the features that were sold with the unit (or at least it could in the near future), it should not be illegal. All thanks to the removal of OtherOS.
Originally posted by deak91:
i think everyone is forgetting the makers of the game genie set the outcome of this with nintendo in court. no hardware/software changes are made to the system once the usb device is removed.
That was a long time ago...things have changed. There was a time when it was legal to backup your movies...but those days are over.
Originally posted by Oner:
Originally posted by jookycola:
a week after this comes out Sony will make you update to FW 3.42 and will kill this entire thing. Sounds like a waste to me.
The Dongle disables having to update, plus as I said, if it is anything like the PSP Pandora then there is not much Sony can do just like the PSP.
The Dongle may disable the update for a day or two, but we know sony will pull support for old firmwares soon enough; just like they did when they removed linux and everyone was using workarounds. Unless someone figures out a 3rd party PSN client, we will still need updates to go online.
Originally posted by Oner:
Still don't know a few things yet ~
1) Will a current net DL work or will they be incompatible
2) Does booting off BD-R's work or will they be incompatible
3) Will the external HDD have to be formatted in a special format and will/can it be seen when hooked to a PC
1.) They will probably be compatible; as you don't need a disk, you don't need all the parts of the disk that current downloads are missing.
2.) It sounds like they will work, although I don't see why you would want to.
3.) Unfortunately, it will probably be FAT32-only. Maybe we will see Ext4 or even NTFS support once the community gets legs.
Originally posted by SDF_GR:
So... either only games thats under 4gb can be stored to the external drive or the game is saved as files and not as 1 big image file.
I would imagine they do it the same way that USB Extreme did it on the PS2...A single image split into ~1GB chunks.
I really hope this is real, and I really hope that the USB stick is just a flash drive...or at least it is something that I can make using a flash drive and a few parts from digikey. That said, I can think of at least one method that Sony could use to defeat this stick (or at least, to disable PSN use with the stick)...I don't want to risk giving Sony ideas, so I won't even say it.
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biglo30
Senior Member
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19. August 2010 @ 23:34 |
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Originally posted by KillerBug:
That was a long time ago...things have changed. There was a time when it was legal to backup your movies...but those days are over.
Actually it is now legal again to backup your movies again. Remember it was passed the same time when it became legal to jailbreak an iphone or root your android device.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 19. August 2010 @ 23:35
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Senior Member
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19. August 2010 @ 23:56 |
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Haha, well the genie's out of the bottle whatever way you look at it.
Since it's based around de-bug stuff then my guess is that it will be difficult to stuff it back in.
I can see the sales numbers of PS3's going up, heh.
EurAsia has got so worked up over this they sent me a personal email with this link... and they never do that:
http://www.eurasia.nu/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=2599
If it sticks it should be interesting to see how it will affect Sony's overall PS3 income, will it go down... will it go up... will it remain steady? Perhaps they will be changing their game marketing strategy in future... to what?
If it's a goer the next thing we should be asking ourselves is what plays better... external of internal HDD?
PS: I thought there was a version of FAT out now that allowed for greater than 4gig?
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. August 2010 @ 13:45
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rvinkebob
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20. August 2010 @ 00:18 |
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Originally posted by Jemborg:
PS: I thought there was a version of FAT out now that allowed for greater than 4gig?
I think it's called ExFAT, but don't quote me on it, though I don't think it's quite as universal as FAT32. I agree with KillerBug on using Ext3/4, but it would be best to make at least a couple file systems compatible rather than just one.
I would think loading from an internal drive using SATA would be a lot faster than an external drive through USB.
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Senior Member
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20. August 2010 @ 00:28 |
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Originally posted by rvinkebob:
I would think loading from an internal drive using SATA would be a lot faster than an external drive through USB.
Yeah, probably. But if you store the game to internal HDD will you run the risk of Sony discovering it?
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
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AfterDawn Addict
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20. August 2010 @ 01:15 |
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Originally posted by Jemborg:
Originally posted by rvinkebob:
I would think loading from an internal drive using SATA would be a lot faster than an external drive through USB.
Yeah, probably. But if you store the game to internal HDD will you run the risk of Sony discovering it?
And doing what? Coming to your house? lol You can download those games through direct download on the PS3 Store. If all else fails,disable internet connectivity on it.
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Staff Member
4 product reviews
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20. August 2010 @ 01:20 |
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Is Oner buying us all one to test out? :D
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biglo30
Senior Member
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20. August 2010 @ 03:03 |
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I wish there was a way that it installed on the system and stayed there instead of having to do the dongle thingy everytime you start the system up.
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20. August 2010 @ 04:16 |
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Originally posted by biglo30:
I wish there was a way that it installed on the system and stayed there instead of having to do the dongle thingy everytime you start the system up.
If the biggest problem of a $5 USB key hack is the used up USB port, then I don't think we have any justification to complain.
Originally posted by Jemborg:
Originally posted by rvinkebob:
I would think loading from an internal drive using SATA would be a lot faster than an external drive through USB.
Yeah, probably. But if you store the game to internal HDD will you run the risk of Sony discovering it?
In theory, yes. Remember all those 360 consoles that microsoft bricked? I wouldn't put it past sony. However, I am not sure that it would make any difference if it was external or not; external might even be easier to detect...as actual dev units typically do not do this.
I bet that this will lead to a lot of sales of those esata adapters; I think if it is real, we will see a lot of people using 2TB 7200RPM drives with these adapters...we might even finally get to see if the PS3 works with hardware multiplier arrays over 2TB.
As for general console and game sales, I think both would go way up. Sure, there are always going to be pirates, but those people are not PS3 customers now, so it isn't like they will loose any sales on those people (and they make money selling the systems & accessories). After all is said and done, the user base will be much larger...and piracy is really the last place where the 360 is ahead of the PS3, so Sony's main competitor will take a hard hit as well. Oh, and that is all ignoring people like me who really don't even want to pirate...I just want to be able to play games without needing to get up to change disks...and without the fear of my crummy Sony-made BD drive failing from too much use. And of course, I am also waiting for a distro of Yellow Dog that runs within GameOS like a game.
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Mysttic
Senior Member
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20. August 2010 @ 05:44 |
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I think people are commenting on this way too much, but who am I to talk so whats one more?
Hardware sales will definitely continue to climb for Sony, I doubt it will make much impacted dent to MS tho (or Nintendo for that matter, who still sees strong sales despite having a shitty ass system).
I'll admit I a pirate, so this hack appeals to me once the masses verifies it works. Don't get me wrong, I have a shit ton of retail games, I buy what I like and I have a very strong vast collection dating as far back as 70s and I am very proud of my collection. If game companies didn't over value their half ass made products and spent more time on quality rather than quantity I wouldn't be pirating today.
I don't rent cause most of the crap released isn't even worth renting out, so why should anyone have to pay for crap at all, even if its $5, crap is crap; and unless we can grow veggies with said crap, then no point in renting. Piracy is that gap that unfortunately over bloated to the public masses cause those that could do it, couldn't keep their mouth shut about it and now forced itself onto mainstream public eye causing corporations to panic and gov't bodies to treat us like serial rapists.
My main interest in this, is to see how people can expand on this hack. Okay cool, it can play backups installed to external/internal drives, regardless of speeds which could or may not impact game-play pending on the drive used and the game running. After thinking about it, I still stand by that $170AU is reasonable today, but tomorrow *by that I mean a month down the road* it will not be, as someone will likely mimic and sell a cheaper version that does the same thing or better. Its the or better I want; movie/music access, a menu system superior to XBMC, etc.. I know its wishful thinking, but hey.
Either way, in a month we will know more, and if it does work, than $170AU was worth the selling point to have someone out there find a better way, perhaps even a free way, at the very least a cheaper way.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. August 2010 @ 05:52
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20. August 2010 @ 06:28 |
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Originally posted by biglo30:
I wish there was a way that it installed on the system and stayed there instead of having to do the dongle thingy everytime you start the system up.
all in due time
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. August 2010 @ 06:29
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AfterDawn Addict
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20. August 2010 @ 07:41 |
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I think that if this is real, and if sony does not find a way to kill it right away, then we will see a lot of "homebrew games" that are really just ports of PC apps. So, you might not be able to use the XMB media player to watch a MKV or access a ext4 USB drive, but you put in the virtual gamedisk file called "XBMC", and now you have these features. Sure, it isn't as nice as having the feature built in, but Sony will never include these features on their own (if they were going to, they would have done it years ago).
I was just thinking of something I want almost as much as diskless operation of free games...if games can be played without signatures, then it should be possible to make quick modifications to games in order to enable keyboard and mouse support! Maybe even other PC-style mods; like adding real cars to GTA4, adding custom map packs to FPS games, etc...
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djeazyg
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20. August 2010 @ 08:50 |
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If this is true and starts the piracy movement for the PS3, I don't think as many people will download PS3 games as they do 360 games. Most people aren't willing to download a 25 to 50 gig game just to try it out. To much bandwidth. This is why you don't see a lot of full copy BluRay movies. Yes you can get them but not nearly as many as BluRay rips. I think the Playstation Store games would take the biggest hit.
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pirkster
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20. August 2010 @ 10:20 |
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So, in short... folks should initially avoid this because:
1. A free version should appear shortly, assuming there's nothing special about the USB drive.
2. There's likely going to be a response from Sony shortly (in the form of a firmware update, etc.) that could render it useless until it's reworked.
Regardless, this appears to be a very promising start.
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Mysttic
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20. August 2010 @ 11:07 |
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Quote:
I don't think as many people will download PS3 games as they do 360 games. Most people aren't willing to download a 25 to 50 gig game just to try it out. To much bandwidth.
And as for the downloading comment; no one is talking about upping PS3 games to the scene, like that would be a bit much lol. Even if done, downloading as you said is such an inconvenience that the obvious choice would be to rent the PS3 games and load em to your drive to play them as backups later.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. August 2010 @ 11:07
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Moderator
16 product reviews
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20. August 2010 @ 11:11 |
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Originally posted by KillerBug:
Actually, the recent Jailbreaking case applies; that is why they are calling it a jailbreak instead of a hack. Since this returns the features that were sold with the unit (or at least it could in the near future), it should not be illegal.
Operative word. Either way you know they will ship it blank to make sure they cover their bases.
Originally posted by KillerBug:
The Dongle may disable the update for a day or two, but we know sony will pull support for old firmwares soon enough; just like they did when they removed linux and everyone was using workarounds. Unless someone figures out a 3rd party PSN client, we will still need updates to go online.
If this is anything like the PSP's Jig Kick/Pandora I highly doubt it can be closed. But I am sure it wouldn't take much to switch to XLink Kai (or something similar/new) for those who don't care for PSN.
Originally posted by KillerBug:
Originally posted by Oner:
Still don't know a few things yet ~
1) Will a current net DL work or will they be incompatible
2) Does booting off BD-R's work or will they be incompatible
3) Will the external HDD have to be formatted in a special format and will/can it be seen when hooked to a PC
1.) They will probably be compatible; as you don't need a disk, you don't need all the parts of the disk that current downloads are missing.
2.) It sounds like they will work, although I don't see why you would want to.
3.) Unfortunately, it will probably be FAT32-only. Maybe we will see Ext4 or even NTFS support once the community gets legs.
1) Still remains to be seen or proven though right? (unless something was confirmed while I slept)
2) I actually hope so because I am the type of person to always prefer having a physical backup of my stuff just in case a HDD dies. Even if it doesn't boot a BD-R I am sure I can simply backup a few to a disc as data and be covered. Either way I'm fine with that.
3) It is confirmed to be FAT32 currently (with the caveat they are working on NTFS). The format style is not a big deal one way or the other. I am sure it won't affect how a game boots because PSN DL games that are over 4gb's work (similar to how you describe below about the PS2 probably)
Originally posted by KillerBug:
Originally posted by SDF_GR:
So... either only games thats under 4gb can be stored to the external drive or the game is saved as files and not as 1 big image file.
I would imagine they do it the same way that USB Extreme did it on the PS2...A single image split into ~1GB chunks.
I really hope this is real, and I really hope that the USB stick is just a flash drive...or at least it is something that I can make using a flash drive and a few parts from digikey.
Originally posted by Jemborg:
Originally posted by rvinkebob:
I would think loading from an internal drive using SATA would be a lot faster than an external drive through USB.
Yeah, probably. But if you store the game to internal HDD will you run the risk of Sony discovering it?
Exactly. I would prefer it being on an external for that reason as well as I can take it on the go easily to anywhere (if needed) without bringing any of my PS3's.
Originally posted by DVDBack23:
Is Oner buying us all one to test out? :D
Ha Ha...I don't have "baller status" like that just yet ;P
Originally posted by biglo30:
I wish there was a way that it installed on the system and stayed there instead of having to do the dongle thingy everytime you start the system up.
I read (@ PS3News forum I think it was) there is a team working on that. To basically double bypass the needed USB & files.
Originally posted by KillerBug:
If the biggest problem of a $5 USB key hack is the used up USB port, then I don't think we have any justification to complain.
Agree.
Originally posted by KillerBug:
In theory, yes. Remember all those 360 consoles that microsoft bricked? I wouldn't put it past sony. However, I am not sure that it would make any difference if it was external or not; external might even be easier to detect...as actual dev units typically do not do this.
That is a really good point, and makes some sense.
Edit: Some pics of it opened up
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. August 2010 @ 11:17
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AfterDawn Addict
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20. August 2010 @ 11:14 |
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Seeing as it opens the doors to homebrew, I can see PS3 making a lot of progress (similar to the original XBox days) and I'd imagine it won't be long before BD-R loaders, FTP, emulation, media centre apps etc. appear.
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