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DVDrebuilder/CCEsp and 3 or more passes.
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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23. March 2005 @ 16:21 |
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OK let's do it! We'll all spend $2000, or use trial versions. Maybe the author's of CCE will give us all full working copies CCE SP. It does sound like fun. Let's do it anyway.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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23. March 2005 @ 16:32 |
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Here's the fly in the soup. You run into degradation of the transmitted files. About the only way you could honestly run a test of that sort would be to get together for a convention and do the tests live. And then you would have some fun with setting up controls for the test. Same viewing and capture software, preferrably similar PCs. Hopefully, you get the picture. We've run into similar situations with transmitted images. The Shrink beta testing comes to mind. Then there are the numerous tests done on different forums where one sees degraded images being offered. Unless you have a sophisticated setup and transmission system, what one sees is not always what was produced.
Just for fun though, HKT3020 and Sophocles should go ahead and let us see what results they get. Sort of an official-unofficial test.
No short movies allowed though. Go with something huge, like the extended versions of LOTR.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. March 2005 @ 16:50
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HKT3020
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23. March 2005 @ 19:36 |
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Okay first a few things to consider before actually doing the test. 2 other members need either Attack of the Clones or a EE of a LOTR being that I have them all and its not a problem. Next lets keep the menus with DD 5.1 track and no additional tracks with all subtitles. Thats about it and I think we're all good to go. So whenever you guys are ready. ;-)
Oh yeah, I'll be using PowerDVD 6 to take snapshots and we'll have to supply images from the same chapter/time.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. March 2005 @ 19:41
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brobear
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23. March 2005 @ 19:47 |
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Well, so far you only have Sophocles to contend with. Maybe someone else will volunteer. Maybe you can talk BigO or someone into it. They may have other ideas on the capture and viewing ware. You guys can work that out though.
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squizzle
AfterDawn Addict
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24. March 2005 @ 11:34 |
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I have Attack of the Clones and I would love to participate in your project. I just discovered the joys of CCE last night, and I must say it produces excellent movies. I would definitely like to learn some more about this software and DVD Rebuilder, and I think that doing something like this would be a good way to do it. Let me know what you think.
I don't have any of the extended LOTR discs though. Those movies were long enough to begin with.
Convert PAL to NTSC or NTSC to PAL------>http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/167922
ScubaPete's guides------>http://www.dvdplusvideo.com/tutorial007.html
Bbmayo's guides------>http://home.comcast.net/~bbmayo/index.html
My ever-growing movie collection------>http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/squizzle
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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24. March 2005 @ 13:47 |
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squizzle
Make two copies of your movie, one with 2 passes and one with 6 or more passes and then compare them.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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squizzle
AfterDawn Addict
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25. March 2005 @ 06:39 |
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stupid question here:
When you say 2 passes, do you mean actually run the data through rebuilder twice? Because I noticed that when it's doing its thing, everything gets 2 passes. So are you calling that 2 passes or just 1?
Convert PAL to NTSC or NTSC to PAL------>http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/167922
ScubaPete's guides------>http://www.dvdplusvideo.com/tutorial007.html
Bbmayo's guides------>http://home.comcast.net/~bbmayo/index.html
My ever-growing movie collection------>http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/squizzle
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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25. March 2005 @ 07:10 |
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squizzle
If you have CCE Basic then two passes are all you get but if you have a version of SP it can be set to have up to 10 passes through RB. The passes are multiple scans of your DVD movie that helps CCE make a software decision about how bitrate is to be distributed(variable bitrate). It effectively allows CCE to borrow bitrate from slow moving or still scenes so that higher bitrates can be applied to faster moving action scenes. Since there is little or no movement in the slow and still scene the lower bitrate isn't noticeable but a low bitrate in actions scenes leaves video distortion (artifacts). The end result is better movie quality. The argument here is does it really make a difference to use more than two passes. Eventually an unlimited number of passes won't make difference because you have limited space to work with in order to be able to burn your DVD to a single type 5 DVD media.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 25. March 2005 @ 09:04
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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25. March 2005 @ 07:24 |
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HKT3020
I've always been leary of movie snips because part of what's happening during an encode is that CCE is comparing the movie size to that of a DVD type 5. To make it work you'd have to do two complete encodes and then extract your snips from the results. An example would be if I decided to skew the results. All I'd have to do is choose a really fast action scene and then use a constant bitrate to encode just that scene. But if you're doing multiple passes you have no choice but to use a variable bitrate and your results would lose up against the CBR snip.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 25. March 2005 @ 09:07
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HKT3020
Member
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25. March 2005 @ 08:11 |
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I haven't actually been making use of my Spring Break vacation being that I just woke up and the time now is about 1PM. Anywho, you're gonna have to repeat that for me Sophocles. I'm not sure if I heard you right that you want me to run a CBR pass and a VBR 10-pass. Perhaps I'm still on sleep mode and nothing is getting through but I'll have my 10-pass encode ready for everyone by monday. And by the way squizzle, thanks for participating. Good thing I won't have to do this all by myself, but if you follow the settings I mentioned for DVD-RB that would be great. I'll need you to do 4-passes (VBR) and hopefully another member here with CCE Basic will be able to supply the programs max of 2-passes.
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brobear
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25. March 2005 @ 08:24 |
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When you guys get finished, maybe we can have a contest where everyone supplies their crappiest clip from RB/CCE. The winner gets bragging rights. ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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25. March 2005 @ 09:03 |
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HKT3020
I wasn't suggesting that you encode using CBR only that someone could run it on a part of the movie to skew results. What I am suggesting is that you do the entire movie before cutting out scenes.
Spring break does seem to be going by fast, fortunately summer is just around the corner.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
Junior Member
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25. March 2005 @ 09:43 |
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Well I don't have that Movie but in a reply to a PM from HKT3020 my answer is yes... I will host permanently the results of your test... maybe that way we'll end a war... older than the oldest "profession" in the world :D
keep it UP
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HKT3020
Member
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26. March 2005 @ 13:51 |
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Much appreciated rockas, I might be able to get this 10-pass done by tomorrow. So PM me and I'll give you my screen name for either MSN or AIM to transfer the results (images). Any scenes in particular fellow members care to compare between 10-pass and the original?
I don't know if anybody has yet started but the following settings should be as follows, just so we all are on the same page here.
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squizzle
AfterDawn Addict
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26. March 2005 @ 13:56 |
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I tried the 6-pass and got errors, can't even burn it even though it gave me a 4.26 GB Video_TS folder. Keep getting errors right away. Can't even process it through Shrink. Oh well, guess I'll try again.
Convert PAL to NTSC or NTSC to PAL------>http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/167922
ScubaPete's guides------>http://www.dvdplusvideo.com/tutorial007.html
Bbmayo's guides------>http://home.comcast.net/~bbmayo/index.html
My ever-growing movie collection------>http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/squizzle
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HKT3020
Member
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26. March 2005 @ 23:07 |
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Okay I've come across a big problem, I was gonna release the 2-pass & 10-pass images ready for monday morning but it seems I don't know how I'll be able to actually getting around a 10-pass version. It seems my trial has expired for the latest SP version of CCE. I do however have a 2-pass done which I did ASAP on thursday and I prepped the 10-pass last night and woke up to find a message saying my trial has expired. Sorry for the let down everyone, hopefully someone with a good 10 hours+ will be able to do this DVD. -_-
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Staff Member
2 product reviews
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27. March 2005 @ 05:09 |
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What I'd be very interested in is finding out how many frames are actually changed at all between the different passes. If you wanted to find that out you could use AviSynth's SSIM plugin to compare them. It won't tell you which one is better but you would at least be able to find out which frames were changed and which (if any) were the same. If you're interested in trying it out let me know and I can give you instructions (and at least a template for an AviSynth script).
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HKT3020
Member
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27. March 2005 @ 09:38 |
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Sure Vurbal I'd be interested in trying that out. I think a PM will do. ;-)
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squizzle
AfterDawn Addict
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27. March 2005 @ 19:46 |
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I could try the 10-pass if you want, hopefully I don't get any errors this time.
Convert PAL to NTSC or NTSC to PAL------>http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/167922
ScubaPete's guides------>http://www.dvdplusvideo.com/tutorial007.html
Bbmayo's guides------>http://home.comcast.net/~bbmayo/index.html
My ever-growing movie collection------>http://www.intervocative.com/dvdcollection.aspx/squizzle
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HKT3020
Member
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27. March 2005 @ 21:56 |
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That would be great, I'm awaiting rockas to message me so I can send him the images I took of the original source and 2-pass version. Some scenes you could see noticeable compression but I'll leave that for everyone to judge once the images are posted. ;-)
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Daemon404
Member
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28. March 2005 @ 06:48 |
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I am one of those peopel with a big TV and time on my hands. I have doen up to a 12-Pass CCE Encoding (I know, its massivly more than I need). It had the exact 100% same quality as teh original movie. By teh way, this is with a full copy of CCE SP 2.5 and ElCCE.
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sox2k4
Junior Member
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28. March 2005 @ 09:01 |
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CCE Basic does not have a 2 pass limit. i use it every single day with 4 passes. before anyone asks, yes i purchased it from Visible Light for $58. i have used it with a number of different passes, all with no problem.
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 1.79ghz - Compaq notebook
512mb ddr-sdram (pc2700)
100gb Seagate internal (5400rpm)
160gb AcomData external (7200rpm)
Plextor PX-716UF burner
19" Dell Ultra Sharp 1905fp flat panel
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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28. March 2005 @ 12:16 |
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sox2k4
CCE Basic has a two pass limit, you can set it for more but you won't get it. In fact when you set it to 4 it used to default to 1.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
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28. March 2005 @ 14:39 |
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sox2k4,
Sophocles is exactly right. CCE Basic lets you set as many passes as you want, but it will only do a max of 2. If it didn't why would anyone pay 2,000 for an app that you could get the same no. of passes for only 58.00, since the engine is basically the same.
 GO VOLS ! |
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sox2k4
Junior Member
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28. March 2005 @ 17:04 |
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i sincerely thank you Sophocles and big orange. i now know this thanks to their willingness to explain this shortcoming in CCE Basic....i am still suprised that this has not been fixed though.
i will say this though - there was another AfterDawn Prick i mean Addict that accused me of stealing the software recently when i made the same comment in another thread. btw this individual is on this thread. you do the math.......being a jerk is not a great way to get someone to return to this site. i was simply trying to inquire about the content of the thread.
Athlon 64 3000+ @ 1.79ghz - Compaq notebook
512mb ddr-sdram (pc2700)
100gb Seagate internal (5400rpm)
160gb AcomData external (7200rpm)
Plextor PX-716UF burner
19" Dell Ultra Sharp 1905fp flat panel
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