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MP3PRO and LAME
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saurabh
Newbie
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23. July 2005 @ 13:14 |
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I ripped a CD using MP3pro at 96CBR and then did the same using Power Pack LAME at 96CBR. I got the same file size in both instances.
Is mp3pro not supposed to give a smaller file size at the same bit rate?
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AfterDawn Addict
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23. July 2005 @ 13:21 |
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mp3pro is crap, don't use it. just stick to regular mp3s using LAME (best encoder) at either 192 or 256kpbs VBR for the best quality
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saurabh
Newbie
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23. July 2005 @ 13:48 |
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Thats okay, mp3pro may be crap.
What I want to know is whether mp3pro is supposed to give a smaller file size for the same bit rate viz 96CBR.
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saurabh
Newbie
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23. July 2005 @ 13:51 |
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My next question: how do i play files which have been encoded with Muse Pack and Monkey's Audio?
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neo83318
Newbie
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23. July 2005 @ 14:11 |
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I was wondering which is better when encodeing joint stero or just stero
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saurabh
Newbie
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23. July 2005 @ 14:15 |
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joint stereo
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AfterDawn Addict
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23. July 2005 @ 14:43 |
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Quote:
My next question: how do i play files which have been encoded with Muse Pack and Monkey's Audio?
WinAmp has a plugin for this.
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jrx10
Junior Member
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23. July 2005 @ 22:10 |
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Quote:
mp3pro is crap, don't use it. just stick to regular mp3s using LAME (best encoder) at either 192 or 256kpbs VBR for the best quality
I've been listening to music from one of the on-line radio sites that broadcast some of their music at 64kb/sec. they also use mp3pro. the music quality at 64 kb/sec really blows (the 32kb/sec stuff is even worse) except the l/r channel separation is pretty good. they say they also broadcast in mp3pro for better quality. I googled mp3pro (because I had never heard of it) and this is what they say. http://www.mp3pro.ws/technology.htm Quote:
About mp3PRO and compatibility:
Using advanced psychoacoustics techniques and music structure analysis, mp3PRO creates files that are more compact than original mp3 files, with equal or better sound quality and complete backwards and forwards compatibility. Your old mp3 files will play completely normally on a new mp3PRO player. New mp3Pro files will play normally on old mp3 players, but without the dramatic mp3Pro improvements. Of course, new mp3PRO files played on a new mp3PRO decoder will provide the optimal listening experience!
How the mp3PRO technology works:
When making an mp3PRO file, the new mp3PRO encoder splits audio recordings into two parts. One part analyzes the low frequency band information and encodes it into a normal mp3 stream. This allows the encoder to concentrate on less information and allows it to do a better job of encoding. This also maintains complete compatibility on old mp3 players. The second part analyzes the high frequency band information and encodes it into a part of the mp3 stream that is normally ignored by old mp3 decoders. New or upgraded mp3PRO decoders will tap into this part of the stream and put the two bands back together, resulting in the full audio bandwidth.
More Music on your media:
Offering 128 kbps (kilo bits per second) performance at a 64 kbps-encoding rate, mp3PRO doubles the digital music capacity of flash memory and of compact discs. For example, traditional audio CDs hold about 15 songs, and an mp3 CD can hold 150 or more songs encoded at 128 kbps. In the near future, when mp3 CD players incorporate the mp3PRO decoder, consumers will be able to store over 300 songs on an mp3PRO encoded Compact Disc.
Sound Quality:
The bottom line is mp3PRO provides superior sound quality at lower bit rates that traditional mp3..You simply have to experience the difference for yourself.Download the free RCA mp3PRO encoder/decoder and create your own mp3PRO files from your own content and you be the judge.
I downloaded a thomason mp3pro player but can't get it to play the stream off the net. now I've heard these kind of 'better for less' claims -----Using advanced psychoacoustics techniques and music structure analysis, mp3PRO creates files that are more compact than original mp3 files, with equal or better sound quality and complete backwards and forwards compatibility.--- since back in the old sq quad days
and most of is just that--blow, but I'm open minded enough to listen. I'm about ready to blow off this music radio site anyway because after a couple of days of listening to it, my computer loses it's broadband connection with the 'net and I have to re-boot in order to get back on (this started while I was listening to this net radio broadcast site and had never happened previously).
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. July 2005 @ 22:22
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Dissone
Junior Member
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23. July 2005 @ 22:37 |
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saurabh,
I've used both the Lame and MP3PRO encoders that are with the Nero Ultra
Suite 6. I converted the same exact file with both codecs as an
experiment. The MP3PRO produced a file size that is about 66% of the
Lame file size. Also note that Nero Digital with HEAAC produces a file
size of about 50% when compared to the Lame file.
Hope this helps
Dissones4u ;) |
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jrx10
Junior Member
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23. July 2005 @ 23:02 |
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Quote:
The MP3PRO produced a file size that is about 66% of the
Lame file size
how was the sound quality of the mp3pro file at 66% of the size of the mp3/lame vs the same file in lame mp3? thx
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Dissone
Junior Member
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23. July 2005 @ 23:50 |
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Understand that I'm not on of those people who has to have the ultra perfect product when it comes to music, videos, etc. With that said I could discern no difference between the 3 different formats. I'm sure that there is some body out there who has nothing better to do then worry about the quality of their rip for hours on end who will say that there is a difference, so I suppose that it depends on your ear?
Dissones4u ;)
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jrx10
Junior Member
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23. July 2005 @ 23:59 |
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Quote:
With that said I could discern no difference between the 3 different formats
so from what you've posted, mp3pro may very well offer better sound quality for net radio maxed at 64kb/sec than just the regular net radio 64kb/sec stream. thx
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saurabh
Newbie
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24. July 2005 @ 06:40 |
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Dissone,
While converting your files please go into the settings and chooses 96 Constant Bit Rate for both the codecs and then report the results. I hope you used Power Pack Lame and not the ordinary Lame.
saurabh
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saurabh
Newbie
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24. July 2005 @ 06:52 |
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And I tried the Nero AAC at the same 96CBR and though the file size was reduced the difference was negligible, that is mp3PRO was 4.34MB and Nero was 4.32MB.
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Dissone
Junior Member
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24. July 2005 @ 07:48 |
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saurabh,
I apologize as I should have thought this through better regarding your original post. I tried the 96 CBR and of course all three codecs produced the same file size! The beauty of each codec is that they perform differnt quality at different CBR, example MP3PRO produces the same quality 80 kbit as Lame does with 96 kbit the resulting file is in fact smaller.
Example with the same file I used all three encoders as you asked at 96 CBR the resulting file was exactly 3.6 MB with all three codecs. Now I do the same thing with all three encoders and the same exact file and the results are different. PowerPack default settings produced a file size of 4.8 MB, MP3PRO size = 3 MB, and HEAAC settings are more generic but I set it to 1 step below midline quality and got a file size of 2.22MB with no audible difference (in my opinion)
Hope this helps
Dissones4u ;)
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diabolos
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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24. July 2005 @ 17:56 |
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You need an Mp3Pro decoder/player to hear the difference with Mp3Pro. The player has to be able to use the "SBR Enhancement" that the Mp3Pro files have. A regular Mp3 player will play Mp3Pro files but play it as an Mp3 file at Mp3 quality (or possibly not at all!). There should be no difference if you listen to a Mp3Pro file and an Mp3 (LAME) file using a regular Mp3 player. Also Mp3Pro only has an advantage over Mp3 when it comes to bit-rates under 128 kbps. Mp3Pro acheives its lower file sizes and (higher quality at lower bit-rates) because it samples at 16, 22.5, 24, and 32 kHz (as well as the normal 44.1 and 48 kHz freq.(s))
---
To listen to files encoded in MPC and APE (Monkeys Audio) you need to install the respective Direct Show (DS) Filters. They are availibale on there web sites for free. They work with all DS filter compadible media players (such as: Win Media 9/10, WinAMP 2/5, foobar2000, ect...).
MPC DS filter (RadLight MPC DirectShow Filter 1.0.0.4):
http://www.musepack.net/index.php?pg=win
APE DS filter:
http://www.monkeysaudio.com/download.html
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 24. July 2005 @ 21:00
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AfterDawn Addict
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24. July 2005 @ 23:27 |
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Ced, what do you encode to?
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diabolos
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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25. July 2005 @ 07:58 |
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Good question,
Since I have an iPod and use iTunes I have come to preffer Mp4 (AAC) over MP3 (LAME). I still listen to alot of my music in the Mp3 format and see no reason to and have no plans to convert my entire collection to Mp4 (I just do it with the new CDs I buy). I also like the sound of Apple-Lossless and how fast it encodes.
With that said, in a better world I would encode all my files to MPC at the "extreme" quality setting and never look back!
Ced
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AfterDawn Addict
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25. July 2005 @ 10:20 |
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What programs encode to MPC? I'm not sure whether or not I want to rip my entire collection to a digital format as there is so many different views on what is the best.
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diabolos
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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25. July 2005 @ 15:47 |
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They all sound just fine if you use good encoders and front ends. You already now the best Mp3 encoder is LAME. The best Mp4 encoder would be one that comes from or that is based on the apple encoder. For everything else I would use dBpowerAMP. Also dMC has a plug-in for MPC, if you didn't know.
Codec central (dMC):
http://www.dbpoweramp.com/codec-central.htm
All the rest of the apps that support MPC can be found here:
http://www.musepack.net/index.php?pg=pro
If your worried about quality and future use (compatibility) you must go with a "Lossless" codec (I like Apple-Lossless because it has a wealthy coorprate sponser...lol). If space is an issue then your not ready to back-up your entire collection! You get what you pay for (and wait for), don't be cheap.
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 25. July 2005 @ 15:53
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AfterDawn Addict
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26. July 2005 @ 08:39 |
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Can I use EAC to rip to MPC?
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diabolos
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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26. July 2005 @ 09:43 |
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Yep (I cant believe I have never told someone that they could do that)!
Path:
EAC >> Compression Options >> Parameter passing scheme [select "MPC encoder"]
Now choose your bit-rate. I recommend standard or extreme.
Heres a help page about MPC encoder command line arguments and EAC:
http://www.musepack.net/index.php?pg=enc
Ced
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AfterDawn Addict
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27. July 2005 @ 10:37 |
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Ced I have a question for you. If I decide to get an iPod should I rip my entire collection to MP4/AAC. And also what does iTunes create MPEG-2 Advanced Audio Coding or MPEG-4 Advanced Audio Coding.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. July 2005 @ 10:44
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diabolos
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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27. July 2005 @ 20:18 |
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As to not contadict myself I will stick to recommending Mp4 (AAC). But I will also say that if you already have ripped your collection to Mp3 you have no reason to do it all over again in Mp4 (As the iPod is fully compatible with LAME-Mp3).
Apples AAC audio format was choosen as the basis for the MPEG-4 audio layer (MPEG-4, Part 3). So, iTunes creates Unprotected-Mp4 (.m4a) files and sells Protected-Mp4 (.m4p) files.
MPEG-4 (Part 3):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M4a
Apple's AAC page:
http://www.apple.com/quicktime/technologies/aac/
Ced
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. July 2005 @ 20:19
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markdvd
Newbie
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11. August 2005 @ 13:26 |
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I do not think any of you have attempted mp3pro at max vbr.
It is outstanding quality! It is about 25% smaller than standard mp3 vbr.
Try it in Nero and be amazed!
I never use mp3pro 64k or whatever as it is crap.
I like mp4 as i can use them on my K750i and file sizes are even smaller - tho i havent tried at max quality like mp3pro as yet. A 24min song off Dream Theaters latest album compressed to 10Mb with mp4 through Nero - though i did select its default.
Do not slag off mp3pro until you have tried max vbr and quality. Trust me - NO standard mp3 recording comes close!!!
If you do not believe it try it!
Metal Rules - as does the Athlon 64!
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