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Intel P4 vs AMD
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tocool4u
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30. March 2006 @ 17:50 |
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Yea i am thinking about..Can you tell by my specs?
They are in my sig
I have this program called AI Booster...Isn't that a program i can use to OC..Or should i do it in the BIOS
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. March 2006 @ 18:10
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Member
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30. March 2006 @ 19:56 |
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I am still waiting to see the specs of the kentsfield intel chip.
Quote:
What do you think would be a good Frequency to OC a 3.2 ghz P4?
3.6 is good place to be. I've had her up to 3.75, and things get a bit weird. But 3.5 or so with good air will keep you solid.
Brobear, Now that i have read a lot of your post, you are not really a grump, but the voice of reason. You do weigh in both sides and give valuable information!!
p-4 3.2 prescott HT curently at 3.6/Abit IC7-G (Abit rule!)/2 Gig Mushkin extream 2.5-2-2-6
LG 20.1 FLATRON WIDESCREEN/BFG 6800 ultra@450 mgz/2 wd raptor 150 raid/Ultra 500 watt Direct connet ps
NZXT GUARDIAN CASE(BLUE)
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aabbccdd
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30. March 2006 @ 20:03 |
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. March 2006 @ 20:42 |
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aabbccdd,
480 watts is more than enough. I have a 480 watt PS as well and it runs my Intel which is less efficient and more power consuming than the current AMDs. I also have 6 fans + the fan on the video card, a DVD Rom, a DVD burner, a CD burner and my hard drive all running off of it with no power problems what so ever! The bonus is that you won't need so many fans with the AMD and it will run a lot cooler. The 175 Denmark will put you right up there with Sophocles.
By the way, I could have put the Core-Duo in the listing as well but I understand that it isn't much of a chip. Sort of slapped together to compete in the Dual-Core arena. Also they are much slower than the AMDs, even at the same clock speed. Also their FSB is only 866 Mhz. I would buy a 3.4 Northwood or a 3.6 Prescott first and be better off in the process. From what I am able to see, the 3.6 is the best of the Prescotts. Intel also makes a 3.8 Prescott but the 3.6 is the better and faster chip, even with the smaller cache (512)! It just has a lot more headroom as the 3.8 is pretty much at it's limits stock. Most OC forums I've visited recomend the 3.6 over the 3.8 for this reason. A reasonable 10% OC will get you pretty close to 4.0 (3.97) with a minimum of fuss if you have a decent CPU cooler and good memory. I have a friend of mine that runs his 3.6 at 4.14, with no problems. Unfortunayly the 3.6 only seems to be available in socket 775!
Happy Computering,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
 This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 30. March 2006 @ 20:55
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vspede
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30. March 2006 @ 20:48 |
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I'm no expert so don't yell at me but I actually heard that you need atleast 500W, especially if you have more than 3 fans and a DVD-R.
This is pertaining to if you have a PCI-Express video card. From what I've read, they tend to draw a lot of power.
Friends will help you move.
Real Friends will help you move the bodies...
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. March 2006 @ 21:12 |
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vspede,
I have 2 120MM, 3 80MM and 1 92MM fans in my case and had no power problems, even with the original 400 watt PS that I started out with! Just to see for myself, I ran all 3 drives at the same time in different windows and watched the voltages in Asusprobe. There was no drop in any of the voltages which is the first hint of not enough wattage. If there was, I would have concluded that I needed a bigger, higher wattage PS. It's been in this configuration for over 8 months, so I think 480 watts is more than enough.
Happy Computering,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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aabbccdd
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30. March 2006 @ 21:43 |
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and its a TruePower480Watt PS which is a very good one so i will go with theonejrs advice BTW guys this is the best thread on aD
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tocool4u
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30. March 2006 @ 22:12 |
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Ok,I got my CPU PC OC'd at 10% so now it is running at 3.6
What kind of things should i watch for while i am testing out my OC.......Besides my CPU temp
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aabbccdd
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30. March 2006 @ 22:22 |
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smoke coming out of your case lol !!!! and a whining noise or a burnt smell
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tocool4u
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30. March 2006 @ 22:30 |
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Dam it's 3:30 in the morning and i have to get up at 6........Uhh.
I do more with it later today thanks for the info..I'll check if my Case is smokin :D
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vspede
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30. March 2006 @ 23:00 |
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Going back to what the guy said in the last 5 posts, Is "AI Booster" Better for OC or Bios Manual?
For that matter I didn't even know you could overclock a video card. I currently have a Chaintech Geforce 6600 GT 128MB PCI-Express x16. I noticed in my BIOS that I could raise the core frequency? its at 100 right now. If I do raise it up, what level should I raise it to and do I need to do anything else to it? Like raise voltage?
Keep in mind that I have an EchoStar 600W Power Supply, I don't know if thats good or not.
Asus A8N-SLI
AMD 64 3700+ Sandiego
600W Echostar PSU
Chaintech Geforce 6600GT PCI-E x16
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Real Friends will help you move the bodies...
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. March 2006 @ 01:02 |
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I'd advise after each bit of a successful (bootable overclock) , go into windows and run a test.
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vspede
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31. March 2006 @ 01:32 |
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Yea, but I'd just like to nkow like what number would be a good core frequency for my graphics card. Would it be 120? 110? etc. I wouldnt want to burn it out.
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Real Friends will help you move the bodies...
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brobear
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31. March 2006 @ 04:49 |
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Usually the manufacturer has specs on voltage that a user shouldn't exceed. The same goes for CPUs and memory. As for the frequency of a GPU, you'll need to find someone with more knowledge on that subject than me. Some of the OC forums have specific info on OCing GPUs. Maybe when Sophocles or one of the other OCing gurus show, they may have something on it for you. Where's the Donald? LOL
One thing about ASUS and the AI series, it will tell you when you've gone too far. I dialed in 20% OC in the auto settings and it came on in a curt female voice and informed me there was no way. The auto settings are there if one doesn't want to exceed what they can do with them. My power supply is still on the road (I had a problem with the one out of the box) and I'm making do with a 170W unit I had in a Dell. My system will easily handle an automatic 5% OC with AI Boost turned on. Any more, even with manual settings, and it starts shutting down due to voltage drop. So, I just use the auto settings for now. The manual settings are there for tweaking the system and a person can get better performance that way. Even the memory settings can be helpful. My clock settings in default are 3-3-3-8, but can be set to 2.5-3-3-6, with lower being better. You can still do settings like those, even when using the auto settings, so you need to go over the BIOS settings in your manual. ASUS has some even larger manuals online than comes with some of the boards. ASUS is still new to me, so I'm still learning some about it myself.
aabbccdd
480W sounds good to me. If you want to crank things up you need power, but look at what I'm making do with. I posted a calculator for doing wattage calculations in respect to system equipment. I don't remember where I put it though. Hmm... someone should keep up with this, I found it again. LOL http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/
Baltekmi
I didn't realize I sounded so grumpy. Thanks for the compliment, I try to be helpful and not get caught up in the politics of either camp, AMD or Intel. Some people look at it almost as a religious experience. Guess I need to learn to tread more lightly. ;)
Tocool4u
10% is usually an easy and stable OC for most systems that have decent memory, chipsets, FHS, and a powersupply that won't drop out on them. After that, move in small increments. Unless one is experienced or has the help of someone with experience on a particular system, resetting voltages can get dangerous. Remember to only be changing those if you're sure, no experimenting there, as that is an easy way to start developing the dreaded smoke. One way to see what your system is doing is to run benches with Sandra to see how you've progressed and how the system is holding up. Then for a real test, do a few hours of encoding after you think you've got it where you want it. Rebuilder in batch mode is an excellent real world test. At 5% OC with AI boost on, my temps only go up to 40-42C. Temps aren't an issue with my system. The power supply is what's holding me back. When I start OCing higher, I'll have to pay more attention to settings that work together as compared to others having to watch their temps while trying to balance the settings for optimum performance. So, I at least have one thing working for me. I'm waiting for the new PSU, but it isn't scheduled to be here till late next week.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 31. March 2006 @ 04:51
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brobear
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31. March 2006 @ 04:59 |
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For the question about AI boost, I forgot to mention, there's a warning in the BIOS on that. It can cause a system to hang. When that happens, turn it back off. There's some other performance settings that give default settings as the fall back if the tweak causes a problem. That ASUS BIOS will almost lead you through setup on it's own, the user does need some idea where he's going though. ;)
When I tried to see if my system would do better than 5% with the weak power supply (using manual settings), the system merely crashed and wouldn't reboot. All I had to do was go back in the BIOS and set the previous working settings back up. It didn't smoke or cause a problem, it just wouldn't work. With auto settings, it rebooted on me and went to the base 3.4GHz CPU speed. So, the really dangerous aspect of OCing with the ASUS boards is tampering with the voltages, not just turning up some frequency settings on the board and CPU (with the AI anyway).
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 31. March 2006 @ 05:06
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tocool4u
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31. March 2006 @ 05:50 |
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hey
What is your PSU Brobear......I have a 450 watt i am pretty new to the Systemm Voltages.....SO i don't no what i am supposed to be looking at on my PC probe they have Vcore and some other things with voltages......What should be a good voltage
Thanks
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. March 2006 @ 05:57 |
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He's currently using a 170W stock Dell Power supply, since an Antec PSU he bought to replace was DOA (effectively).
With voltages, allow a MAXIMUM of 5% either way of what they should be so 11.4-12.6V for 12, 4.7-5.3V for 5 and 3.1-3.6V for I/O.
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tocool4u
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31. March 2006 @ 06:02 |
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Ok thanks for the info....My voltages are ok....Umm but is their another program i can use to check all this stuff because my PC probe gltches alot and freezes..(I don't know why)
Thanks
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. March 2006 @ 06:47 |
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There are various different bits of software out there, Hmonitor is good if it supports your system.
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tocool4u
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31. March 2006 @ 07:12 |
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ok, I have a question.....Hyperthreading technology has been more popular nowadays.....Doesn't it kind of work the same as Dual-core since it does 2 instructions at once?....But i see now that Some Intel Dual-cores have Hyperthreading to ..Which would mean they write 2 instructions on each right?Well i mean Dual-core is better in alot of ways..But as in multitasking Wouldn't a regular non-HT Dual-Core be the same as a P4 with HT
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. March 2006 @ 07:33 |
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Hyper threading makes use of spare processing power when a program isn't using it and gives it to another program. However, If the first said program is using all of the processing power, HT makes no difference. Generally the efect of HT isn't significant at all.
With dual core however, when programs can access dual core facility, they can harness the power of TWO OF THE SAME PROCESSOR. Windows can also allocate processing power to individual programs using both cores. This is beneficial in such instances as program crashes. If a program is using 100% CPU usage, the other core that's idling can step in and run the program to close the crashed application, all in a matter of a couple of seconds.
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tocool4u
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31. March 2006 @ 07:38 |
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Oh so Dual-Core is more of Makeing your system faster and Safer...and Better Performance..While HT Basically "Gets the leftovers".....LOL and gives it to another program...
OK thanks for the info
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. March 2006 @ 07:40 |
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In a way. Dual core is the way forward. You notice AMD never bothered with anything like Hyperthreading.
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brobear
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31. March 2006 @ 07:54 |
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I may not answer the why very well, but the simple answer is no. Dual core is like having 2 separate processors. So two working separately is better than one alone. Dual channel and hyperthreading can give you more paths, like lanes on a highway, but a dual core is like giving you 2 highways with as many lanes each as the single highway. Look at how many vehicles 2 highways can move compared to one. Hope the analogy works. You can ask the Donald or Soph for the technical version. ;)
tocool4u
I was building the system you see in my sig. The Antec power supply wouldn't crank up. Like anything else, they have electronic components that don't always work. Normally the Antec are trouble free. Just one of those things. Since I couldn't use the one I purchased to do the build with, I robbed a Dell for the power supply. I'd rather be using this system underpowered than the Dell. Next week when I get the new Antec, I'll put the Dell PSU back where it belongs and finish the build on this PC with the intended power supply.
Your 450W PSU should be ample for most anything, except maybe for some of the really extreme systems. Probably even then if you didn't try to fire everything up at once. That guide I gave a link to can give a novice builder some insight into the PSU required to properly supply a given system. You should have voltage protection built into your system, so nothing to worry about as long as it's a good PSU. The voltages we were discussing for OCing is a different story from the default readings you monitor. Small voltage changes to memory and the CPU can enhance performance to some degree. The problem is if one jumps it too high, they fry the component. That's why you only mess with voltages in the BIOS if you're certain of what you're doing.
Speedfan is another good monitor software. Strange though that ASUS Probe should be acting up. I have it and it's rock solid on doing the monitoring.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 31. March 2006 @ 08:01
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tocool4u
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31. March 2006 @ 08:42 |
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OK this might sound stupid....But i am learning alot of stuff.....I have ASUS SmartDoctor and it is a memory tool.....There are 2 things you can toggle on it ...Engine, and Memory .....What is Engine?
The default is:
Engine:499
Memory:540
Can someone please explain this...it will be greatly appreciated
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