|
|
|
Intel P4 vs AMD
|
|
Senior Member
|
16. May 2006 @ 13:21 |
Link to this message
|
Brobear-Sammoris-aabbccdd
I took your advice and changed ram to the PC3500. You asked about other parts, for cooling, I have one of these already
ZALMAN CNPS7000B-Cu LED 2 Ball Blue LED-http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16835118119 and also Arctic Silver High Density Silver thermal compound. I realised I would not be able to use my old power supply (only a 450 and no pci-e) so since I always wanted modular
XCLIO 500W ATX 500W Power Supply-http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16817189012
I know its not a brand name PS, but I googled and yahoo'd XCLIO and found a few modders and tweakers have benched different models in a setup that was power hungry and checked it during stress tests and everything was always stable. Had good reviews by people not affiliated with the company.
Thanks for all the help everyone and no more toys!!! I already doubled what I thought I'd spend on this. :)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. May 2006 @ 13:22
|
|
Advertisement
|
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
16. May 2006 @ 13:30 |
Link to this message
|
|
That's interesting, though I'd like to see how the Freezer64 Pro compares in the same test.
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
16. May 2006 @ 16:01 |
Link to this message
|
Deadrum33
Quote:
I already doubled what I thought I'd spend on this. :)
Occasionally a person can find some great buys and use a CPU that takes little tweaking to get respectable performance. For others, we find the cost not to be quite as low as initially expected. All the extras just keep adding up. However, the end product we get with a custom build is better than what we could buy the same for retail. Also, building it oneself allows the choice of the components. I've noticed retail PCs are often built with less expensive components to increase the profit margin. Less expensive sometimes means less quality and/or fewer functions.
As for your CPU cooling needs, how high are you wanting to OC and what do you anticipate your cooling needs to be? If your 7000 meets the needs and you don't feel the need for a higher performance cooler, then you have a good one. The 7000 is easily better than stock cooling. The 9500 is more top of the line. The 7700 is also a good choice for the higher capacity needs. I've got a 7700 in my current system. Overkill, but I like knowing my CPU is getting all the air it needs, doesn't hurt to divert a bit more air to the board chips as well.
Theonejrs
Are you being a fanboy again? LOL I noticed the Zalman 9500 came out as the favorite in the cooler testing... again.
|
AfterDawn Addict
|
16. May 2006 @ 17:42 |
Link to this message
|
|
Brobear,
I must confess, Sophocles led me astray! Seriously, the 9500 finished first in every catagory except weight. That honor, (by a wide margin) went to the EKL V8 at pretty close to 200 grams heavier. You got to take a look at this thing. It's massive with a fan cover that makes it look like some sort of hot rod engine. It's also very noisey when you run the fan at full speed, which it needs to do to keep things cool. The Gigabyte Rocket Pro was the loudest at an incredible 49.1Db. Now that's loud!!!
The most interesting cooler is the Vapochill Micro. It pretty much finished in second place behind the 9500. At $45, it's worth looking into. It's quiet and very effective.
Yea, I'm a bit of a fanboy when it comes to Zalman. The zalman sticker is proudly affixed to the blank little square for a label on the right side cover.. I highly recomend any of their coolers but especially the 9500.
Happy Computering,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
 |
|
crowy
Suspended due to non-functional email address
|
16. May 2006 @ 22:38 |
Link to this message
|
Currently just over 2.5gb:)
Thermaltake big typhoon coming soon!
CPU Temp@43degrees on stock cooling.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. May 2006 @ 22:39
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
16. May 2006 @ 23:40 |
Link to this message
|
Cincyrob
http://support.asus.com/download/download.aspx?SLanguage=en-us
Asus has a lot of downloads for different boards, but I couldn't find anything on the one you listed. I'm not familiar with the board you have. I noticed Compaq used the board in their Presario. What brand and model is your PC? Just wondering if what you have is an OEM board. If so, they're usually locked. As for the CPU, I've not noticed a rush to OC the socket 478 Celerons. Maybe Sophocles or one of the others can enlighten you. I'm still a novice where OC(ing) is concerned. There's also a lot of sites on the net with sections (or entirely) devoted to OC enthusiasts. A little googling might be in order there.
What have you decided on your build so far?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. May 2006 @ 23:49
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 01:41 |
Link to this message
|
|
The vapochill micro looks good, but the noise for some coolers is ridiculous, as is the weight. Absurd, some of them.
|
AfterDawn Addict
|
17. May 2006 @ 01:44 |
Link to this message
|
|
Okay I'm a moderator at Xtreme-Source.com. I talked to a couple staff members who're PC saavy, and they say that the D805 may not be as good as it's cracked up to be, pointing to the temperature at around 4.0GHZ. What do you guys think?
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
17. May 2006 @ 02:43 |
Link to this message
|
|
Nothing really to think about, your associates only pointed out what has already been mentioned. The testing showed that at 4.0GHz the processor starts needing to go on liquid cooling. That leaves a lot of capacity (1.34GHz) between the stock frequency (2.66GHz) and 4GHz where the air cooling starts needing to be upgraded. Not many processors are being OC(ed) over 4GHz on air. So I guess I'll have to disagree with your associates, I don't see that as making the D805 less attractive. Ideally processors wouldn't create heat, to some extent that's a drawback with all processors, some more than others. Everyone should realize the 805 is a warm running CPU up front. Also, with the 805 the FSB is upped, so one is no longer looking at the stock 533MHz FSB. Just being able to get to 4GHz is quite an achievement, it being OC(able) above that makes it the more interesting. A 4GHz dual core processor is nothing to scoff at. That means for the average builder, they can have one of the best OC friendly CPUs for very little and for the hardcore enthusiast, they can have an interesting processor they can push over 4GHz on liquid and experiment with a high performance setup without breaking the bank. The D805 isn't the greatest CPU, but it's definitely interesting and well worth the price.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. May 2006 @ 02:54
|
AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
|
17. May 2006 @ 03:24 |
Link to this message
|
|
Tokijin
The temperature around 4. Ghz is a problem if you don't have effective cooling. The real point is that it can hit 4 Ghz and be stable for about $130, that's less than most single CPU's cost. I figure with a decent air based Heat sink and fan, over clocking the processor to 3.7-3.8 Ghana should be a no brainier, and it would still one heck of a bargain.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
|
17. May 2006 @ 04:28 |
Link to this message
|
|
Good deal, I learn something new every day here. Apparently Intel is known for making chips that're more or less heaters. What's the price comparison between and AMD Opteron and the D805?
|
|
sytyguy
Senior Member
|
17. May 2006 @ 04:42 |
Link to this message
|
|
I just happened to be looking at that on Newegg, and the AMD Opteron 175 Denmark is $540, the D805 is $128.
HTH,
Rich
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
17. May 2006 @ 05:06 |
Link to this message
|
Quote:
Apparently Intel is known for making chips that're more or less heaters.
What you need to realize is that both AMD and Intel have built hot processors as well as cool running ones. Also, these processors wouldn't be released for mass marketing if they couldn't be adequately cooled under normal circumstances. OC(ing) to the max isn't considered normal. Hot Intels just goes for some models. Push an AMD and it's going to heat up as well. Just depends on how far the CPU is pushed. The recent batch of 90nm processors (think Prescott, Smithfield and the lot) ran hotter than most when pushed. Some of the older Intel processors, such as the Gallatin and Northwood run exceptionally cool. Intel is also doing well with the mobile processors and with the newer processors may get some of the heat problems under control. AMD has had some hot processors in the past. So heaters aren't anything new to either company.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. May 2006 @ 05:17
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 05:33 |
Link to this message
|
|
@brobear
my system now is a HP pavillion a1101n
i want this for my build
Intel Pentium D 805 2.66GHz / 2MB Cache / 533 FSB / Socket 775 / Dual-Core / Processor with Fan($149)
MOBO=Asus P5WD2 Intel Socket 775 ATX Motherboard / Audio / PCI Express / Gigabit LAN / USB 2.0 / Serial ATA / RAID($179)
or this one
Asus P5WD2-P Intel 955 Socket 775 ATX Motherboard / Audio / PCI Express / Gigabit LAN / USB 2.0 & Firewire / Serial ATA / RAID($209)
Mem=Corsair TWINX Dual Channel 2048MB PC3200 DDR 400MHz Memory (2 x 1024MB ($139)
Corsair TWINX 1024MB PC5400 667MHz Dual Channel DDR2 Memory (2 x 512MB)
HD=Seagate Barracuda 300GB / 7200 / 16MB / ATA-100 / EIDE / Retail / Hard Drive($159)
and a home for it all
Ultra Blue Aluminus ATX Mid-Tower Case with Clear Side, Front USB, Firewire and Audio Ports With Ultra X2 550-Watt Power Supply($129)
wow $1000 wife gonna kill me
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. May 2006 @ 06:00
|
|
The_OGS
Senior Member
|
17. May 2006 @ 06:24 |
Link to this message
|
|
The multiplier on the D805 is 20x.
Something around 166FSB should then give ~3.33Ghz, a healthy overclock.
~200FSB touches the magic 4GHz (!) and I believe this is the practical maximum. Tom kept going (and recommended liquid cooling) but the D805 did keep going strong, however more than 200FSB (800QDR) is very... what's the word, GREEDY :^)
Most people should probably clock 200FSB, run/post their benchmarks etc, then throttle-back to 3.33GHz for 'everyday use'.
This is D840/D850 territory - not bad for $130 bucks.
The thing should run forever at 3.33GHz, stable cool and reliable.
Just my $.02!
Anyone buy one yet?
Hey, lots of AM2 CPUs at my distributor, but no mobo's so far... anyone find AM2 mobo's yet?
L8R
ABit AB9 Pro
Intel Core 2 Duo E6420 @ 2.4GHz
2GB OCZ PC2-6400 Platinum XTC R2
ATI Radeon X1900XT 512MB
Enermax Liberty 620W
320GB/16MB WD, 150GB/16MB Raptor
Plextor PX-755SA DVD (SATA)
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
17. May 2006 @ 06:37 |
Link to this message
|
|
cincyrob
Well, if you notice the P5WD2 board uses DDR2 800 RAM which is 240 pin. DDR is 184 pin. So, you may as well pick up a matched set of the DDR2 800 2x1GB XMS Corsair. 2x512MB is cheaper, but I prefer having more available reserve RAM. Once XP gets loaded up and you have background apps such as antivirus software running, you'll appreciate having the extra reserve. You can get cheaper, but to get the best out of tweaking you need the performance RAM.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. May 2006 @ 06:38
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 06:41 |
Link to this message
|
|
Of course a 50% overclocked D805 uses about 80W more than an Athlon X2 though, so if the PC is used at high usage for 3 hours a day and normal for 21 hours a day (you know, those people who leave their PCs on all day), that works out at about 3 hours a day where it uses 80W more than an X2, 21 hours where it will probably use about 20W more (since Intel doesn't have CnQ, 4Ghz is a lot to run all day, even at idle). You're looking at 660Wh per day, but since both PSUs and Mobos are only about 80% efficient that gets bumped up to about 1Kwh per day, or 10p where I live I think. 10p a day for 3 years say, before it gets upgraded comes to about £110, or 40% more than the cost of the processor itself. That's a lot of electricity to waste when there's a looming energy crisis.
|
AfterDawn Addict
|
17. May 2006 @ 07:23 |
Link to this message
|
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
17. May 2006 @ 07:36 |
Link to this message
|
|
Cincyrob
You've decided on the Intel D805 as the CPU choice. The PW5D2 boards come in different flavors. Do you want or need the 2 PCI Express x16 slots for the ATI Crossfire graghics setup (PW5D2-E Premium, $226.99). There's other advantages to the E-Premium, you need to look over the extra bells and whistles compared to the other versions. You may need only a single PCI Express x16 slot (PW5D2 Premium, $191.99). Check the other differences as well. Pay attention to the difference in PATA and SATA connections according to your needs (The E-Premium has more SATA than the regular board). If it was me, I'd spend the extra $35 and get the E-Premium. On the drives, you can go SATA on some of those, that's the newer technology. If you really need to save the bucks, the regular PW5D2 can be had for $159.99 ($67 less than the E-Premium). Not really that much difference.
ZipZoomfly has good prices on the boards and free shipping. They're also about $15 cheaper on the Zalman 9500. They have the best price on the CPU as well. Besides the good pricing, the free shipping saves a lot. I'd get all these from ZipZoomfly unless you can find better.
Sammorris
At 4GHz, the CPU idling isn't going to pull very much power. If worried about energy savings turn it off when not in use. Don't watch the telly, walk everywhere you go, eat raw food, only bathe in cold water or don't bathe because energy had to be used somewhere to get the water to you, and make candles for your lights (they waste too much energy making them commercially). Live in a cave, saves all kinds of energy over building structures. ;)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 17. May 2006 @ 07:58
|
|
sytyguy
Senior Member
|
17. May 2006 @ 08:12 |
Link to this message
|
|
theonejrs,
You are correct, I transposed the numbers, sorry.
Rich
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 08:28 |
Link to this message
|
|
Lol I'm no environmentalist, I just thought I'd put into perspective how much power each intel chip wastes. Surely there's a saving from Cool and Quiet or else they wouldn't do it. With a 4Ghz core, I know it's at idle, but considering AMD drop from 1.8/2/2.2/2.4Ghz to just 1.0, there must be some gain in that. However, a long games session using 300W mains draw rather than 170 with the X2 (This assumes even power draw increase with CPU speed up, I know it's not quite true, but it's near enough with the extra heat from everything else), then for a 4 hour gaming session, that's 520Wh, enough energy wasted to light a standard room for nearly 9 hours, twice the length of the aforementioned games session. If these happen regularly, that's a lot of energy wasted considering quite a few people have these CPUs. Even if people don't game, few have Dual cores for nothing, so they'll be media encoding and such on a regular basis. I'm not bothered about it because I've no interest in obtaining one, just making a point!
|
AfterDawn Addict
|
17. May 2006 @ 09:18 |
Link to this message
|
|
Sophocles & Brobear,
I've been looking for a decent Asus MB for an Intel D940 3.2GHz. I want something that will use my present memory (DDR400) with either an AGP slot or onboard video. I've found a couple but you guys seem to know more about motherboards than I do.
I looked at the P5P800-VM. This appears to be a socket 775 version of my present P4P800SE MB. I also looked at the PSRD1-VM, which has on board video and a PCIe x16 slot. It doesn't support Dual-channel for the memory. The memory seems to be the problem as there are very few Mbs for the Pentium D that support DDR400. I'm leaning towards the P5P800-VM as a way to get myself a decent performing Dual-Core using the D940 CPU. $325.98 for the CPU & MB gets me just that. I know, I can get the D805 and the MB for $181.98 but after reading about the 900 series at Tom's Hardware I don't think I can do better than the D940 3.2GHz for the price. The D950 is nice too, but it costs about $100 more! Down the road I can get a better MB, DDR2 memory and PCIe video. For now this should do just fine.
I know, I wanted to build an Opteron 175 but that would run me about twice as much money, and I can't really afford to do it right now. Hey, a 3.2 Dual Core & MB for $325.98 seems to be pretty good bang for the buck! It's not an AMD but I do have the cooler (and socket 775 mounts) to tame it! Let me know what your thoughts are.
Sincerely,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 09:38 |
Link to this message
|
|
There used to be an Intel board that supported both AGP and PCI express simultaneously, but newegg seem to have stopped selling it, only the 754 and 939 versions are available now. Failing that, maybe the Asus P5P800 SE, but that has some dodgy reviews...
|
|
brobear
Suspended permanently
|
17. May 2006 @ 10:10 |
Link to this message
|
Cincyrob
Here's some items to think about. This is more or less my wish list for a D805 build, with the exception of the blue midtower case. My preference is black.
Intel Pentium® D Processor 805 2.66GHz, 533MHz FSB, Socket 775, 2MB Cache, Dual Core Retail ***Free Shipping*** (The important Core Stepping is listed as BO.)
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=80849...
$125.90
Asus P5WD2-E Premium 975X P4/Celeron 1066FSB LGA775 DDR2 ATX Motherboard w/Audio, Dual Gigabit LAN, RAID/Serial ATA Retail ***Free Shipping***
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=24705...
$226.99
Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835100007
$5.99 + $4.99 S&H ($10.98)
CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit System Memory
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145590
$260.00
Zalman CNPS9500 LED CPU Cooler Retail ***Free Shipping***
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=37350...
$54.99
Ultra Blue Aluminus ATX Mid-Tower Case with Clear Side, Front USB, Firewire and Audio Ports With Ultra X2 550-Watt Power Supply
http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details....
$129.99 + $13.85 S&H ($143.84)
Another blue case, but with enough fans to help cool things down. I prefer my full tower but the mid tower is a preferable size for some.
Thermaltake V7000D Blue XaserV WinGo Computer Case
http://www.clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=A1311803&cmp=OTC-...
$75.99 +$5.00 S&H (80.99)
Check Newegg for pictures and specs, with S&H Newegg is $10 higher.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811133131&AT...
Sunbeam NUUO SUNNU550-US-SV ATX12V/ EPS12V 550W Power Supply 100-120V CE, UL (CUL), TUV, CB, FCC, FIMKO, SEMKO, DEMKO, NEMKO -
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817709003&AT...
$83.50 + $6.99 S&H ($90.49)
That's $27.64 more for the Thermaltake case and Sunbeam PSU. That is a small price I'd gladly add for the extra ventilation, something to think about when OC(ing).
My selections come to $850.34. That leaves the video card, optical drive(s), and hard drive(s)
|
|
Advertisement
|
|
|
AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
|
17. May 2006 @ 11:09 |
Link to this message
|
|
Hmm, quite funny that the mobo costs twice as much as the CPU! That'd be around £550 worth in the UK, which is the price of the average 'intermediate' PC system. Since that's minus a GPU and HDDs, the total could be quite a chunk.
|
|
