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LCD vs CRT....PS2 games are one reason to keep your CRT!
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robx46
Newbie
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23. April 2008 @ 05:31 |
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Just wanted to share my knowledge on this and I've really read about and have had good first hand testing done on both CRT's and LCD's. While I may ramble a bit here I make what I feel is a very important point at the end.
4 months back when I never owned an HDTV or LCD, I heard people saying that PS2 games, whether played via PS2 or especially in the PS3, should look better on LCD's or Plasma's or at least just as good due to the "upscaling" that can be done on PS2 games. Now this TV I was getting for HD programming and the PS3, however, the PS2 isn't dead to me yet and won't be for a very long time.
I listened to and believed the above comments about PS2 on HDTV's, or people saying that as long as you have component cable you are good to go. I learned firsthand that is all BS!
I got my first HDTV 4 months back, a midrange Vizio 1080P, then I just recently got a 40" 720p mid-range HDTV to do more tests on, which allowed me to rule out that maybe our 42" just was abnormally bad at playing PS2 games since they looked just as bad on both.
PS2 games had all sorts of problems when played via PS2 or PS3. Mainly, yeah, the picture looked horrible, color problems, blockiness, cropping/sizing issues. And yes, via the PS3 I used HDMI on a 1080P (can't beat that, right?), and I used "official" Sony component cables for the PS2 (can't beat that either), the best hookups you can have.
Despite those good hookups, it was glaringly obvious to me that PS2 games simply were never intented to be on an LCD or HDTV of any sort. Maybe they don't look quite as bad on the uber expensive name brand HDTV's, but surely they still don't look as good as CRT and will suffer from other issues I mentioned.
Also, I should note that I had just bought the 40" 720p HDTV as a secondary TV a few days ago that my PS2 would be always hooked up to since my PS3 is obvioulsy always hooked up to my 1080p.
My hope with the 720p was not only that I might have better luck with the PS2 picture, but also I had heard this theory that at 720p, not as much "upscaling" needs to be done as opposed to 1080p and was hoping for both those reasons that the picture would at least be comparable to a CRT.
But I was wrong, the picture looked just as bad as my 1080p. No better no worse.
Having said that, I think that if PS2 games were meant to be played on an HDTV that they would be made graphically different to compensate for that awful blockiness and bad colors. But that just isn't the case.
PS2 games are optimized for CRT TV's, period, at 480i. And all that Progressive scan means is that it can help some games just not look quite as bad, but I see very little difference if any. CRT at 480i still looks far better to me than an LCD with progressive scan.
Here is where people might think I'm crazy, but I'll explain. I actually returned that new 40" 720p in order to buy a new solid 27" CRT (RCA flat screen)!!! That's right, despite my loving HD programming and that it would have been nice to have HD in my spare room, I actually WANTED to trade in my $900 HDTV for a $250 CRT, and I'm the type of guy always wanting the latest technology.
And I'll explain why I did that. My main TV is 1080p which helped make the decision easier. But still... why pass up a 2nd sweet HDTV in my home?
The reason lies in the PS2 itself. As I said, although we may have used to take it for granted, PS2 games with a CRT can give true color and a natural antialiasing effect.
That effect is something you never realized, always took for granted on CRT's. That is...until you see the PS2 games on an HDTV.
When you compare PS2 and PS3 games on an HDTV, you can see just how huge having HD really is. But comparing a PS2 game on a CRT vs a PS3 game on an HDTV, the difference is not as great with the PS2 getting that nice natural CRT antialias (more like pixel softening) and good color.
Lastly, the reason I find this topic even more important than just saving the look of PS2 games is because of the other things that the PS2 can do. It can play any PS1 games. And needless to say that PS1 games also look much better on a CRT TV. So right there you have like 10 years worth of video game history. And if you no longer own a CRT, you can no longer see those games in all their glory, how they were meant to be viewed and how you remember viewing them.
And let's not forget something else about the PS2. It can emulate most of the great console games before the playstation era, such as the NES and SNES emulators which can play yet another 10 years of historic games, which again also look best on CRT, and proper. So there are the emulators and also the commercially released classics.
That means the PS2, aside from playing PS2 games, can play most of the classic console games of the last 25 years, and play them looking as badass as ever, as they were meant to be seen, just by simply owning a CRT. And they do still sell some nice new flat screen CRT's these days that enhance the CRT experience like the 27" RCA I just got.
And as far as TV programming goes, same applies. While a lot is in HD these days, there are still a lot of non HD channels and there will be for a while. And non-HD programs also look much better on CRT.
So the moral of this story is to hang on to a good CRT you might still have or buy a decent new one, just one, before you don't own any anymore and you can't buy them new anymore. And that day is fast approaching. Very few are still being produced and sold, but the few there are are pretty solid CRT's.
I thought I would write this because it does seem so many gamers are quickly either forgetting the value of having a CRT, or in my case was told that I wouldn't need one anymore since it would look as good or better on an HDTV. It just isn't true, not even with progressive scan.
I love the PS3 and HD as much as anybody, but given that the PS2 can play 25 years worth of CRT classics up to still newly released PS2 games, that is a lot of reason to keep a CRT and PS2. I know a lot of people have sold their PS2's in order to help buy a PS3. Not a good move unless you don't mind hooking up your PS3 to a CRT.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 23. April 2008 @ 05:33
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Senior Member
2 product reviews
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6. May 2008 @ 06:52 |
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GREAT JOB! robx46!!
I really appreciate the effort you put in it.
I only wonder why you brought 27" TV? Why not 29"!!
Also I have 29" CRT FLAT TV braught just last year awesome picture qual. It also have Component-in. I wonder how good will PS2 games look in Component(I am still using Composite suppld with PS2)?
Will there be difference in picture quality(EVEN WITHOUT Progressive Scan)Can you help me on this?
:/
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robx46
Newbie
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6. May 2008 @ 13:02 |
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Honestly, 27" was about all I could find in local stores. Even online CRT's are a dying breed. I think 27" is a good size for a CRT. I think there comes a point where if you have a CRT too large there isn't any benefit. Too big and the standard CRT flaws really start to rear their head. Remember you only only working with a 480i resolution.
But anyhow, I just know I'm happy with my RCA 27". Better picture than my Phillips 27". Both of which are pretty new, the phillips is starting to glitch after just a couple years, which is why I replaced it with the RCA.
From my understanding, component might be best use to make the PS2 on an LCD look as good as possible, and it does give you progressive scan. But as I said before, even with component and even progressive scan enabled games on an LCD, I still don't think it looks that great. Again, these games just weren't designed to look good on LCD's.
As for component on CRT. Yeah, go for it. Just don't pay too much for a component cable. I think I paid $20 a few years back for an official Sony component cable. And that is probably your best bet since its official sony. Don't go paying anything more than that, and you will see some brands that are more expensive than that, much more expensive if you are talking about monster cables, ect.
On CRT what component will do for you, aside from giving you the comfort of knowing you have the best possible hookup, is do a great job of separating colors and because of that it can help the picture quality "pop" a bit. Now will you see a major difference from S-video? Maybe not, maybe a little...either way it can't hurt to have a sony component cable in your possesion. But short answer, component is best for the PS2, next best is S-video, then RCA, then last is that awful straight cable converter thing that everybody used back in the day, and some people still use it on older TV's.
Yeah, you won't get progressive scan on CRT, but you aren't missing out on anything there. Again, progressive scan is an LCD feature that just helps games look slightly less bad than they would without it. I sure didn't notice much difference on LCD between having progressive enabled or disabled. Hated the picture either way.
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Senior Member
2 product reviews
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6. May 2008 @ 14:56 |
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Thanks robx46.
My TV does support P.scan. So I will go for Compo.cables.
I live in India so those Sony ones are hard to come by. nowadays everyone shows PSP to component cables. yeah you are right about the CRT size though, once I was using two TVs side-by-side, OLD 21" NON-FLAT TV and this TV for comparison on small TV all the games looked awesome and clean but on big tv PAL games looked slightly better, while NTSC looked awful(compared) with scanlines.
:/
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