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Experiment: Want to test D/L HDDVD's against upconverted SD DVD's how to burn. Definative guide Needed!
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indyjase
Junior Member
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16. December 2007 @ 14:23 |
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Now this is for test purposes only might I say before we begin, although I am sure that it will probably be of help to a fair few of you out there.....
First I have noticed that there are many sites out there that you can download HDDVD's from mainly at 720p, well that res is fine for he purpose of this experient. What I am aiming to do is to d/l a few movies which I already own on SDDVD and compare the quaility against the orginal upconverted and then post the results on here.
2nd I have anydvdHD and clone dvd2 as well as nero 8. I will get any other software if it is required. If anyone has had any luck doing this a definitive guide for everyone would be amazing. I know that most of us on here have already gone and bined our vhs and replaced with laserdisk then dvd ect...so before spending a fortune on more new media I would like to be able to compare sddvd upconverted against HDDVD(720p d/l) and put the findings up here. I know that it is not a direct comparison experiment BUT most HDTV's out there can't do anymore than 720p and the new batch of cheap HDDVD players wont go any higher than that so I thought this might be a good starting point for us to see what we can do with the format in a real world setting.....any thoughts would be helpful here, as the idea is to do this as simply as possible so as many people as possible can try their own experiments and post the results. There are so many posts on here as to how to do this and indeed many different permitations as to what works but what we need here is a standard method or guide so we can get as many people as possible here helping and reviewing.
Like I said, this is indeed an experiment and I do not advocate piracy at all and I think that there are enough of us out there that can work together to get this to work....So the gauntlet is over to you chaps my estemed colleges of the AV world.....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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dblbogey7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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16. December 2007 @ 15:21 |
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Interesting...
First of all - the videos that you d/l'd at 720p are not HD DVD specs. They have been re-encoded to a lower resolution and a smaller file size. HD DVD videos are 1920x1080p. Anything less is no longer considered HD DVD so you're not really comparing the HD disc you buy at the store.
Ideally your experiment should look like this:
HD DVD disc -> Played on an HD DVD player -> HDMI connection to an HDTV
compared to:
SD DVD disc -> Played on an upconverter OR HD DVD player -> HDMI connection to HDTV
The observers must be blinded or must not know which one is playing at any particular time.
Depending on viewing conditions, if you are watching these on anything 40" or less, chances are you may not see a significant improvement. The advantages of HD DVD and BluRay are really evident on displays at least 40 - 42" or even preferably >50".
Still the best way to do this is to buy or rent the HD DVD movie and compare it to the regular DVD. Don't use the 720p downloaded version as this not what you would get from commercially available HD DVD's.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. December 2007 @ 16:46
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indyjase
Junior Member
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16. December 2007 @ 23:48 |
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I agree, throw into the mix a HDDVD of the movie a well and see which is prefered by the blind viewer.The screen size is 90" HD projector so there should be a vast ammount of difference between all three at a distance of 12 ft....This will be an interesting test if I could just get the d/l 720p to work....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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indyjase
Junior Member
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16. December 2007 @ 23:59 |
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The first test will be 300 as I have the original dvd, backup dvd, HDDVD and hopefully a downloaded 720p version. Now the reason I am going to use a few of the backups is that I have a tosh A3, that will only output orginal movies in 480p but backups in 720p-1080i.So backup movies on the whole look better,(belies the argument that orginal movies offer better quaility than backups!) But, I digress as this is an experiment so back to the point.Has anyone any other suggestions for the test or indeed how to put the d/ls onto a disk as everything here is welcome and thanks for the input dblbogey7, nice one....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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david89
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17. December 2007 @ 21:07 |
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this what i was trying to do you can get true high def video on dvd-9 play on hddvd or blu-ray player the problem i can't find good authoring app that uses avc codec not mpeg-2 for us the consumer i want make 720p or 1080p make a disc to play on the hddvd player compare it to sd dvd i am like you i like doing experiments. oh and 720p are HD DVD specs problem is framerate has be 59.94 for 720p files for hddvd.
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Member
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17. December 2007 @ 21:35 |
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Quote:
this what i was trying to do you can get true high def video on dvd-9 play on hddvd or blu-ray player the problem i can't find good authoring app that uses avc codec not mpeg-2 for us the consumer i want make 720p or 1080p make a disc to play on the hddvd player compare it to sd dvd i am like you i like doing experiments. oh and 720p are HD DVD specs problem is framerate has be 59.94 for 720p files for hddvd.
David read dblbogey7's post. Doing your own encode on a dvd-9 will not test HD-DVD vs Blue-ray or up converted dvd. It will only test your softwares compatibility with the chosen format. Also what the hell are
you talking about 720p being HD-DVD specs. All commercial high def optical media is 1080p. Sorry for being so forward. indyjase I think you are on the right track with an actual HD-DVD. Let us know how the test works out.
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david89
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18. December 2007 @ 02:31 |
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i read about it at doom9.org about how put 720p has hddvd that how i foundout and what indyjase want do can't be done hddvd doesn't have anygood authoring apps for consumer yet and yes possible get true high def quality on dvd-9 here alink prove it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD known as 3xdvd right now hddvd kind of crippled on making your own on dvd media
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Member
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18. December 2007 @ 04:42 |
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Quote:
want do can't be done hddvd doesn't have anygood authoring apps for consumer yet
Very true. Quote:
yes possible get true high def quality on dvd-9
Yes thats not the point. Encoding a video ripped from an HD-DVD and compressed would be irrelevant for testing.
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indyjase
Junior Member
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19. December 2007 @ 10:21 |
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It is true that its not a true high def disk as suck but the idea is to see if there is anymore detail than a SD disk and to see if it can be picked out on the test....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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indyjase
Junior Member
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21. December 2007 @ 01:05 |
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Carring out the test tonight with Blade runner SD-DVD, HDDVD, 720p d/l, the version's all final cut might I add, but directors cut on LD and VHS just to cover everybase....The 3 different monitors are as follows samsung 1080p 40" Sony 32" 720p and infocus X1 480p...All at 3 different viewing distances 15,10 and 5 ft (but at different times with different versions not just walk closer per say....6 different people with some av knowledge and some with none!!!! will post results tomorrow.....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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goodswipe
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22. February 2008 @ 17:00 |
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Well, what happened?? How did the test go? I started reading this thread and when I got to the bottom I see nothing, damn! ;)
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indyjase
Junior Member
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25. February 2008 @ 15:48 |
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sorry I will post the findings later today ...been a bit mad at home currrently and to be honest I forgot about it...LOL!!!! I have all of the findings here and will get my bottom up to type them out later as I sorta went a bit mad with all of the options.....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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goodswipe
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25. February 2008 @ 15:54 |
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LOL, fair enough. Like I said, I was getting real interested in the outcome of this and when I got to the bottom of the page, you hadn't posted your results! Get back to us whenever you get a chance. ;)
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Senior Member
5 product reviews
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29. February 2008 @ 08:55 |
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Originally posted by indyjase:
The 3 different monitors are as follows samsung 1080p 40" Sony 32" 720p and infocus X1 480p
Is that the HD (?) projector for the 90" screen you mentioned earlier?
I don't mean to be confronting but don't you think that playing 1080p material on a 480p projector is pretty much useless?
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indyjase
Junior Member
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2. March 2008 @ 13:44 |
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Sorry about taking so long with getting the results out here but I went out and purchased all new equiptment since the first test was done so I want to completely redo the test from scratch!!!!
Ryu77
I only used the X1 just cuz it was there and really it was more outta interest for other x1 owners that had been thinking about getting an HD source as it has the processing to accept 1080i but is really only 800 x 600 res... but like I said it was there, so I thought what the heck....
now the new test will be (insert drum roll!!!) still using blade runner, but with several formats to be used HDDVD Bluray DVD9 copy(new version) original dvd (the first copy of blude runner released on dvd)
the equiptment used will be Samsung 1080p LNT 4671f 120htz
Samsung BD-1400 Blu-ray
Toshiba A3 HDDVD
Samsung 810 upconvert dvd player
Infocus X1 Projector w/7ft screen
Onkyo 601 Receiver
Polk Audio R-series 6.1
This time I want to also look at the audio aspects as well by using the lossless outputs of the Blu-ray to the multi-channel input of the Onkyo as well as the toslink to compare the sound....
Just waiting for the blu to arrive tomorrow and the monoprice HDMI cables to get here by the end of the week....
On the first test the results were I would say a little fuzzy as the test equiptment wasn't mine and I just didn't feel that it was a proper test enviroment so I won't go into to much detail, but in summary the A3 did a significantly better job of upconverting dvd's than the 810 on the LCD and the pict quailty for the HDDVD version of the movie was outstanding the best results for the X1 were also with the A3 set to 1080i as opposed to 720p and all audio was extracted using a toslink. Audio wise the dvd sounded better from the dvd by a hairs whisker than the HDDVD, just a tad crisper, so I can't wait to hear the lossless uncompressed audio from the multi-channel....
I hope to have the new test done in the next couple of weeks as the whole of the downstairs here is in the middle of being remodelled and a new cabinet and position are being built for the LCD to optomize viewing so I have to wait for that to get completed to get the best results although I will tinker with stuff in the mean time and post a few thoughts on here to the differences if you guys would like, but they just wont be under test conditions and more opinion than factual....but I can do that to wet your appettite...
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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indyjase
Junior Member
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11. March 2008 @ 12:25 |
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Just out of interest, I got my BD1400 Bluray esterday and did a few comparisons as an upconverting dvd player albeit only using component cables as my HDMI cables have not yet arrived and I have to say the toshiba A3 HDDVD does a WAY better job of upconverting standard dvd's and just for that matter alone is well worth the money you can get one for!!!!!I sit on the fence in this matter as I have both players , but I cant help but wonder if the consumer really has got shafted with the death of HDDVD....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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goodswipe
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11. March 2008 @ 12:30 |
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Quote:
but I cant help but wonder if the consumer really has got shafted with the death of HDDVD....
Hmm, that's the million dollar question my friend! We all know the answer....
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indyjase
Junior Member
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11. March 2008 @ 15:01 |
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having done a little more testing still seems to not do as good a job as the tosh, no matter how I play with all of the settings...although to be honest there are very few with the samsung....I guess that to be honest I seem, well a bit disapointed with the samsung. I am glad that I have the tosh though for all of my regular dvd's, so on point I am very happy that I brought into what is now a dead technology and will enjoy its capabilities for many years to come, as well as the thought of bargain HD quaility movies. The samsung was 2x the price with no 7 free movies....and already it is dated as no 2.0 in the pipeline upgrade.....hang on why the bloody hell did buy this thing.......oh yeah because corporate U.S gave me no other choice to watch HD quality movies....Sorry for getting off the point a bit I hope that its bluray pic and sound make up for my lack of currrent enthusiasium for the samsung, but it has been an expensive month...changed over to cable because the gov. is shutting down my OTA programming...invested in another HDTV *last one blew up due to a power surge in the house act of god my arse!!!!! and now a bluray...are we just porns in the game of corporation vs consumer wants......
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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goodswipe
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11. March 2008 @ 15:12 |
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What new tv did you go with?
I'm thinking about getting the Samsung HLT6187SAX. Going to check it out tonight.
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eatsushi
Senior Member
3 product reviews
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11. March 2008 @ 15:18 |
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indyjase: To put it bluntly the Samsung is a POS. Even a minimum amount of research would have told you so. The previous model 1200 was a total disaster and is the subject of a class action lawsuit. Their dual format 5000 model is also being criticized by unhappy users. If I were you I'd return it and get a full refund.
If you want 2.0 I'd wait for the upcoming Panasonic DMP-BD50.
Quote:
oh yeah because corporate U.S gave me no other choice to watch HD quality movies
You do have a choice. Don't buy Samsung! Buy a different brand that has a better track record.
Plus I suggest doing more research before you buy. Read what other users and owners think.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=149
http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/630898
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. March 2008 @ 15:24
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indyjase
Junior Member
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12. March 2008 @ 17:54 |
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Hey there Guys....
to eatsushi
The reason that I went with the Samsung was not really a choice, as to basically to cut a long story short HHgregg were doing an offer with the sharp Aquos LT4664 TV with a free bluray player and after numerous screw ups and one incredibly p$$$ed off wife she basically told them enough was enoughgive us a different TV that we would choose as well as a free bluray player, wallmount monster power conditioner, monster coax cable and 100 bucks gift card they said OK....LOL bless my wife!!!! we waited for them for another 2 weeks to have any Bluray players in and all they had was the samsung and the misses used her divine logic that it matches the TV so we got that one...so as it was for free I can't complain y'know samsung LTN 4671F 1080p 120htz, samsung BD1400 bluray, oni wall mount, monster HTS 1000 power conditioner, 6ft monster coax cable for under 1700 bucks...not bad
Goodswipe
good choice of samsung TV... I went for the LTN4671F as it was the best they had in the store after so many different comparisons with other models. Having lived with it in real world conditions for the past month I have to say I still look at it a go whoa that is a great pict, and I am not easily pleased. The HDDVD looks amazing, HDTV looks stunning as do upconverted DVD as well as using the PC on it...PS2 looks, well crappy actually, in comparison with my old sony tube HDTV but then it was only 32". best brick store deal I have seen is frys which was 2200 bucks....and yes the 120htz does make a huge difference. Good deep blacks rich vibrant colours and one happy wife...what more could I want...LOL!!!!!
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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indyjase
Junior Member
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12. March 2008 @ 20:06 |
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have looked at the 2 threads above and er...um...didn't really find any negatives at all about the 1400, if anything quite the opposite pict quality up there with the way more expensive pioneer and great sound quality...LOL now all I need to do is get some more bluray disks to play....lol!!!!!!
One thing I will say though is that I notice a huge difference in the way people buy audio or video stuff here in the states as opposed to the UK....here its what BB or CC or a discount store has in stock whereas in the UK there are loads of smaller specialist stores....Just an observation having lived in both countries. Granted I live in a hick farm town in indy which is not the greatest comparison after living in London...both have their merits....and drawbacks....but the buying ethos is very different here.....
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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Senior Member
5 product reviews
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12. March 2008 @ 20:16 |
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Yes, indyjase you are quite right about that.
I live in Australia and there are a number of stores that are strong competition amongst each other... Bing Lee, JB Hi-Fi, Harvey Norman, Domayne, The Good Guys, Clive Peeters... The list goes on.
When I had been to the USA (I once stayed 3 months for business), it seems that Best Buy and Circuit City (maybe also CompUSA) were the major players in the tech scene.
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indyjase
Junior Member
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12. March 2008 @ 20:30 |
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it is easy to see why HDDVD failed and the impact that it has had on the world market just by what a very few stores decide to do...I noticed on the avs thread that every other person posting on there had an onkyo receiver...Great I have one myself but I would like to have a bit more choice, hard to find anywhere with really high end stuff on offer like arcam, tag, ect....but falling within the price brackets of what is offered at BB and CCbecause being honest most salespeople in those stores have a criteria or objective to sell or push as opposed to being passionate such as you chaps on here about audio and Hi fi.
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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indyjase
Junior Member
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13. March 2008 @ 08:11 |
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getting off the subject a bit there!!! Tested out the BD1400 with star wars dvd last night....stunning pic first time actually happy!!! also tried a backup copy of ratatouille looks great, but for some reason both backups I have tried on the sammy seem to what to skip to the next chapter before the end of the one it is playing so you miss 30 secs every once in a while. Now on the orginal copy of rat... no skiping....will have to keep an eye on this....strange as on orginal dvd's the sammy does a better job and on backups the tosh does, well at least the tosh wont just sit on the rack collecting dust...lol!!!!!
Easy Like Sunday Morning
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