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brobear
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3. December 2004 @ 15:51 |
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HiRezHead
Rather amazing you mention Germany. All the info I provided actually came from a German database. http://www.mediamatch.de/medien.php
It's hosted by a large German media group. One can cross check the credits on the website if they desire. A lot of English speaking people don't like dealing with this database because they don't understand the navigation commands.
These manufacturers do not change their production lines to make separate quality media with the same production codes for various brands. Think about it. They just change the labeling. The discs with the same production codes are the same. The variations are the varying quality one sees on a production line. Also, like most businesses, the media has to meet quality controls. A Ricohjpn RO2 is the same for any brand; same with the Ritek GO5. You may see a variation between different media made by the same companies, such as a Ritek G05 and a G04. However one is an 8X and the other is a 4X respectively. However, I hear Ritek produces a good product across the board. Granted some poor media gets to the market. It isn't a planned conspiracy where they have people sitting and grading the media or selecting faulty runs.
Here is the HiRezHead list of best in his order; a somewhat troubled presentation unless once again he doesn't mind comparing 4X and 8X media and again ignoring brands that carry the same media. As I said, it is confusing and one can't just throw together a list and say this is the best. I've seen so called experts at a site or 2 do these comparisons and make the same mistakes.
1. Verbatim +R -R (MCC 003 & MCC 02RG20)
2. TDK +R -R (TTG01) note: with -R Problems with Plextor burners!
3. Ricoh, SONY (RICOHJPN R01)
4. Maxell -R (RITEK G04)
5. FUJI +R (RICOHJPN R01)
Benq -R (SONY08D1)
6. Platinum -R (RITEK G05)
For Comparison sake, I'll use the above list and add some speed data and more brands and illuminating info.
1. Verbatim +R MCC 003 DataLifePlus DVD+R 8X; (HP sells MCC 003 DVD+R media)
-R MCC 02RG20 DataLifePlus DVD-R 8X (General Use); MCC 01RG20 Digital Movie (also General Use) DVD-R 4X; (Maxell; EMTEC; TDK sell MCC 02RG20 DVD-R 8X media)
2. TDK +R TDK 002 DVD+R 1-8X
-R (TTG01) note: with -R Problems with Plextor burners!; TTG02 DVD-R 1-8X
3. Ricoh, SONY (RICOHJPN R01) DVD+R 1-4X (TDK; Maxell; Fuji; Speer; Imation; Traxdata; The brand list for the Richohjpn R01 DVD+R 4X media goes on and reads like a whose who in the media world; all the same production media.) The Richohjpn R02 DVD+R 8X media has a similar following. Ricoh is very good media. In fact, most rate it higher than the TDK Corporation media.
4. Maxell +R Ritek R02, RICOHJPN R01 DVD+R (Ritek has the RITEK R03 which is DVD+R 8X, not sold by Maxell)
-R (RITEK G04) DVD-R 4X (I was unaware that Maxell sold a -R Ritek in 4X. I know they sell the Maxell and Mitsubishi manufactured items. The database I am looking at doesn't list a Ritek G04 Maxell nor have I ever heard anyone else mention this item. The database isn't complete. Is the Go4 Maxell something new? Where did this piece of info come from?
5. FUJI +R (RICOHJPN R01) DVD+R 4X; (RICOHJPN R02 DVD+R is the 8X media) Note:TY manufactures the Fuji 8X +R.
Benq -R (SONY08D1) DVD-R 8X
6. Platinum -R (RITEK G05) DVD-R 8X ;Arita; PrimeDisc; TraxData
HiRezHead
You need to do a bit more work on your lists. You still have the bad habit of listing different media data together. I only used your chart before as an example of the others. Seems you want particular attention here. So, I will point out your mistakes. You are swiftly becoming one of those people I mentioned who tells stories and try to pass them off as truth. I added manufacturer codes earlier only to show the variety in a brand. These codes are also significant in showing speeds if one pays attention to cross references. You are listing different speed media in a chart you're using for comparison. You neglected to tell the good members that. A lot of people don't know where to find this material. Now that I told you where the database is you can use it and become a better self professed expert. Me, I don't claim to be one, but I try to stay well enough informed that I don't buy the Brooklyn Bridge.
So far, I believe MCC is the only manufacturer of the DatalifePlus DVD+/- 8X media for Verbatim. Mitsubishi produces the same media for several other companies as well. You place TDK at #2 behind Verbatim when the corresponding media for the two companies is the same in DVD-R; both sell the MCC 02RG20 for the 8X +R offering. You didn't mention Hewlett Packard, I know, they don't have a high market share. Guess what, that brand sells the DVD+R MC 003 8X media. If you're comparing 8X media, the TDK TTG02 is the current offering. Wasn't the TTG01 a 4X media? Here again you put in the Maxell RITEKG04 and don't put in the Generic Ritek brand. They're equal quality as they are the same media and both branded. You are among the few who prefer TDK Corporation media over the other premium media sold under the same brand. Personal preference I guess. Most of this media is good to excellent and it is often a matter of preference and what one finds comfortable working with. It's just a majority of people find certain premium brands and manufacturers preferable.
1. Mitsubishi
MCC 003 DVD+R 8X media: Maxell; EMTEC; TDK; and Verbatim
MCC 02RG20 DVD-R 8X media: Maxell; EMTEC; TDK; and Verbatim.
2. TDK Corporation
TT G01 DVD-R 4X media: TDK (As far as Plextor problems, I could see a higher incidence of write errors if one uses this media to write at higher speeds, The TT G02 appears to have replaced this.)
3. Ricoh
RICOHJPN R01 DVD+R 4X media: Ricoh; Sony (And the list goes on and on as mentioned.)
4. Ritek
Ritek G04 DVD-R 4X media: Maxell? ; (Long list of top brands including the Generic Ritek brand.)
5. Ricoh
RICOHJPN R01 DVD+R 4X media: Fuji (Also many more, as a manufacturer item, this appears as the #3 and #5 items in HiRezHead's list)
Sony
SONY 08D1 DVD-R 8X media: Benq
6. Ritek
RITEK G05 DVD-r 8X media: Platinum (And a good list of others) Ritek appears as the #4 and #6 preference due to the different Ritek media chosen. Sort of shows the fallacy of selecting by brand names instead of manufacturer and the particular item and format. One could compare a Cadillac DeVille and a Corvette; both GM but different type cars and one is a lot faster. Just an analogy, possibly not the best, don't anyone take it to heart.
The list shown as a manufacturers list shows this to be just a list of favorites. One doesn't do many comparisons using different category items across the brands. To be fair you compare the 8X to the 8X and the like. You can't compare brands when the brands use the same manufactured item; unless you're just trying to find if the manufacturer messed up on a run of media. If people are going to talk about favorites, I don't mind a bit. We all have them. When it comes to saying something is best; let us get down to honest comparisons and some heavy data showing the proof. I haven't proven a thing here nor did I intend to try. As I said, I'm no expert. I'm just trying to point out that some common sense should be used and that what we present here on the forum as our favorites only reflects just that, favorites - not necessarily the best. Also, when one looks at the media mess, they need to look at the manufacture source of the brand as well as the brand itself. The brand remains the same and the manufacturer can easily change.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. December 2004 @ 16:17
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brobear
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3. December 2004 @ 15:59 |
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I forgot, the obvious omission of Taiyou Yuden (TY) left me wondering. It is normally listed as one of the 2 top premium manufacturers of media on the market.
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HiRezHead
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3. December 2004 @ 17:44 |
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O.K. ! I accept your critics (espicially with mixing 4x and 8x media). I'm working on much more detailed lists. I will post it soon.
Taiyo Yuden is very good but much to much overrated, TY take beatings every time compared to TT, MCC or RICOHJPN. I think you are mistaken only in one point: It seems so that there are different qualities from the same manufactorer, espicially Taiyo Yuden and Ritek. The differences in some reviews are quiet shocking, again this example: I can burn every Taiyo Yuden media in my NEC2510A except Plextor! They are one of the worst media around, not only for compatibility reasons.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. December 2004 @ 17:46
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. December 2004 @ 18:42 |
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BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH :-)
Just find a Disk that works well for you and stick with it. I don't care if it?s made by fisher price or Howdy Doody. If it burns good with no errors and plays in all my DVD players then that is all that matters. I have burned on just about every make and brand name media out there. Because I like to see for myself I don't much trust these sources you see on the internet because I don't know them from Jack! Could be Ritek or whoever is the one's posting these so called tests. So believe what you want, I believe in what is real and works I don't care what all the web sights say especially when it comes to this because they are all different one has Taiyo Yuden at the top, the next one has MCC, the next one Ritek, and so on. The only media I ever had a problem with is Memorex, and that was only for backing up my movies they just didn?t play very good, but they worked fine for Data. I think people should debate what the best burners are not the media because my burners seem to be able to burn any media I throw in them. Just for anyone?s info at the moment I use Prodisc x8 white inkjet printable disks and so far out of 30 burns 100%. They aren?t supposed to be that good by the way. HA! They work flawless :-) I didn?t want to write this long of a post really I just don't understand how everyone can get so set on one brand try them all they really aren?t that expensive anymore.
Good Luck All,
Burners Nec 2500A
Pioneer DVR 105
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. December 2004 @ 18:45
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brobear
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3. December 2004 @ 19:03 |
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HiRezHead
Glad you agree with me on all this. You appear to misunderstand part of what was said and are still falling into the brand comparison frame of mind. I've heard people saying Ritek G04 is better than G05 and ther new dye in the G04 is inferior and that makes the G05s better now. That is the type cross brand comparison you see. If one reads the disclaimers on the media, they will see the companies don't claim the media will play well in all circumstances. An 8X may cause read write errors in a 4X player and vice versa. But as far as a G04 being compared to another G04, they came off the same line with the same materials. The labels are changed for various brands. The same is true of TY, MCC and all the others. So I would suspect test and/or author bias or faulty methodology as opposed to a conspiracy theory of different media with the same production codes. There are some ripoffs out there with fake codes, I'm not talking about those. In fact TY is having a problem on that front now. There's a lot of bias and a lot of influence being exerted in the media sales market. So, I'll remain leery of many of these tests and comparisons.
You're also talking about compatibility features of particular media with a particular player, plus the example given was of an older offering. The TY 8X +R media I'm using functions just as well as the RICOHJPN R01 +R 4X media I use. My other acquaintances also report similar results. I have to agree with you on the Ricoh. I find it good media across the board, irregardless of the particular brand. I often suspect a lot of these media tests and often find they aren't as technical as most people would believe. A few simple tests you or I could perform and a sampling of consumer input, which we know can vary and most people have no idea which manufacturer made the disk they were dissatisfied with. A lot of these tests include the bias of the author.
In the end you will have your biases and favorites as we all will. As I said the forums are a place for favorites and we find few technical proofs of few of these tests. Plus one scientist or tech can scew the results of another to mean what he desires. I'd say we'd best take all this media madness with a grain of salt and forum members stop trying to be experts. I've already spent too much time involved with this thread pointing out the Manufacturer connection to media brand and quality as opposed to just looking for a brand. As people have noticed, you can get a CMC in the same brand with a MCC.
I just hope people pay attention to what is a direct chain of information and what is being contrived; sometimes for monetary gain and sometimes to try and influence others on their acquired knowledge. The one thing I've noticed more than anything; things change so often, a person could work full time and would still have trouble being a media expert. I'll just stay dumb on this one and let someone else tackle that impossible seeming task.
Good luck all and watch those experts and manufacturers.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. December 2004 @ 19:37
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brobear
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3. December 2004 @ 19:27 |
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I forgot, most of the media has compatibility charts for speeds and drives. They can be found at the websites for the hardware and media. Though most will play in everything, there are the exceptions. I've been lucky, I have a drive that has only met one media it didn't like. That's luck with the drive and the media as well. But then the drive is a name brand and the majority of the media has been Ricohjpn with a touch of Ritek and a couple others. The brand lines have been more a list of the major brands. I even bought Memorex when they were selling Ricoh.
bbmayo
Nice of you to support what I was saying, even if your manner is a bit facetious. Fisher Price? The turn of what you said rings true. Try some of the different brands and be suspicious of tests and experts. One thing about the forum though, you can spot good and bad trends and shop accordingly. It can save trouble and money. When people say branded that just means not to buy a knockoff. So be real. Being rude and silly will get you nowhere except ignored.
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. December 2004 @ 20:10 |
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I didnt think I was being rude.. hmmm
I was mearly stating my opinion. Is it rude because you personally didnt like to hear what I wrote? If so I am sorry that wasen't my intent, and I just used Fisher Price and Howdy Doody to get my point across that the name brand dosent mean all that much to me, but that was just my opinion. I don't think I was being rude. Silly now I could go with that :-)
Again sorry if I offended you :-)
Burners Nec 2500A
Pioneer DVR 105
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brobear
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3. December 2004 @ 20:50 |
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bbmayo
I'm not that thin skinned and how could I take much offense as you were pretty much stating what I said. However, sometimes the way one phrases things can defeat their purpose. It wasn't offense that prompted me. I was just offering a bit of friendly advice that might serve you well in the future. I firmly believe that a person be allowed to show their character as they wish, as long as they don't hurt anyone else in the process. After all, it is their image and the way people relate to it. Your phraseology is child's play compared to some of the things I've seen going on around these forums.
You may not be into the branded scene, but Prodisc in itself is a branded item. Prodisc is the Generic brand for the manufacturer as Ritek is for Ritek and Ricoh for Ricoh. Prodisc manufactures for Speer, Memorex, Fuji, Medianca, and Prodisc brands. The azo dye they use is decent. So those branded Prodisc's of yours are decent media and compatible with most drives. Guess you may want to get something else to get away from those branded items.
As I said before, branded is only a good way to know you're not buying a ripoff. A lot of people start thinking branded means brand. It does, but only in that it is the logo showing this is a known product made by a known manufacturer for a known brand; thus branded. I've bought branded so I could rely on getting the same manufactured item I wanted. I like consistent results. Though I bought branded discs from several different brands, I consistently purchased the same media I wanted. The advantage of knowing the manufacturer and relying on the branded items allowed me a moderate amount of insurance on my purchases. A plus to buying the same product from the different brands is being able to shop for the best price as well as getting quality. I normally get these purchases as low or lower than the "bargain" merchandise and always a considerable savings below regular retail. Though no great deal, the branded Fuji I just purchased was about half of regular retail for the product. After all payments, taxes, and shipping, I got these Ricohjpn and TY for 40 cents each from BestBuy.com. The sale is over now and I beleve the merchandise is about double or more.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. December 2004 @ 21:00
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AfterDawn Addict
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4. December 2004 @ 01:03 |
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Hmmm.....
bbmayo, you started out by saying,
BLAH BLAH BLAH Just find a Disk that works well for you and stick with it.
Then you finished by sayng,
I just don't understand how everyone can get so set on one brand try them all they really aren?t that expensive anymore.
After contradictory statements like that I can certainly understand brobear's confusion.
But your statement in the middle is the one that I really don't understand,
I think people should debate what the best burners are not the media because my burners seem to be able to burn any media I throw in them
If you think media doesn't make a difference, but only what burner you use does, that's way off base. Media is one of the most IMPORTANT aspects of DVD backup. I have solved countless problems with people simply by changing their media. Crappy media will cause freezing, jumping, and burns not playing at all, no matter what burner you use. Not to mention it might work now but a year or two down the road be completely unplayable. You yourself stated that you had problems with Memorex, but with that logic it shouldn't matter since your burner will work with "any media you throw at it".
I don't dismiss the fact that a good burner is preferable, but I don't care what you have, if the media sucks, no burner is going to correct the problem.
That's just my humble opinion, and as the saying goes, that and a quarter won't buy a cup of coffee :>)
 GO VOLS ! |
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brobear
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4. December 2004 @ 01:33 |
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Good input there Bigorange. I guess I should have been concise. I realize I covered a lot of ground and a person could get lost in all the charts. They were just to point out the members should pay attention to manufacturers in order to compare media they've used.
To put it concisely. It's a good idea to buy branded media so you know you're getting good quality. Watch the manufacturer, get a tool like DVDInfoPro so you know what you're using. Then try to use good equipment. Good media and equipment are the keys to recording. You were right in saying there's a lot more failures due to bad media than bad burners.
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brobear
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4. December 2004 @ 01:39 |
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... Wanted to leave that last post short and readable.
Last of all, learn the steps involved and apply that to doing a good job with what you do.
Wasting one's time trying to become an expert ends up in people not paying attention to you anyway. Watch out for the so called experts and good luck. It's so easy to get lead astray on these media matters, we don't need new stories to help us along or misleading info. Bigorange said it best, get good branded media and when you find it, stick with it.
As I keep saying, I'm no expert and I was just passing along an opinion. Hope there was some good common sense in there. Good luck.
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ibuyinkny
Newbie
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4. December 2004 @ 08:43 |
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ridata g04 is excellent i use them all the time. i tried everything else...but ridata g04 is the best...i usually go to www.compuside.com to buy them...try that site...
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Member
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4. December 2004 @ 09:13 |
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try www.allmediaoutlet.com, they're offering free fedex shipping
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AfterDawn Addict
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4. December 2004 @ 15:14 |
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cuteperv, in case they don't offer free shipping(You didn't say if it was a special or standard procedure) With Meritline, all their standard media is with free shipping at all times. I believe Newegg also offers the same deal.
brobear, I agree, ALWAYS buy branded media and avoid the crap shoot. Even the fake TY's going around that read Taiyo Yuden with infopro or identifier are not branded. The branded ones aren't fake :>)
GO VOLS !
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 4. December 2004 @ 15:16
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brobear
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4. December 2004 @ 17:53 |
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I agree Bigorange.
I was in Sam's today and noticed they have a decent price on their DVD media. They had branded Verbatim for about $18 for 50. 36 cents a disc for Verbatim isn't too bad. Thought I'd toss that in for Verbatim fans that have a Sam's membership. A person would have to take a disc and run through DVDInfopro or the like to see which manufacturer it is though.
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fuzzyfish
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8. December 2004 @ 07:43 |
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AfterDawn Addict
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8. December 2004 @ 08:23 |
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Those are not branded. That doesn't mean they aren't what they say they are, but they "might" not be. Branded insures you get what you order. Only 1-2 cents more.
Here's a good place to shop w/free shipping.
The branded ones are listed.
http://www.meritline.com/ritek-dvd-blank-media.html
GO VOLS !
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