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Dual Layer DVDs
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jhtomes
Newbie
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22. March 2006 @ 03:17 |
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Does anyone know if there will be DVD-R DL? All of the dual layered disks I seem to find are DVD+R, never found DVD-R?
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jhtomes
Newbie
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22. March 2006 @ 03:22 |
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Nevermind, I found some by looking at some of the links on this site. Everything I have seen locally have been DVD+R DL.
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Member
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22. March 2006 @ 05:01 |
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Yep they make them but they can't be booktyped just like DVD-R so their compatibility is compromised also from what I have read here more coasters are incurred. Stay with the + and life will be easier.
New build with goodies
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24. March 2006 @ 10:57 |
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thread teleported to relevant forum :)
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riley577
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24. March 2006 @ 16:09 |
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Dont know why you want to use duel layer discs , they are overpriced and you can get as good a picture on a single layer disc , if you cut the crap out.
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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24. March 2006 @ 16:12 |
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Some crap is not crap.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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riley577
Suspended permanently
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24. March 2006 @ 16:21 |
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Well if you like watching adverts and having subtitles and directors comment go for the dual lair , it will save all. Me i just want to watch the film without the crap and save money by getting it on a single layer disc without compromising quality.
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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24. March 2006 @ 16:31 |
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Like King Kong?
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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riley577
Suspended permanently
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24. March 2006 @ 16:49 |
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I dont like having to watch endless adverts for other films before i watch the main movie. Neither do i watch the Directors cut and commentary, you can get what you want on a single disc cutting this out. I think you are throwing your money away buying duel layer , but thats my opinion on this.
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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24. March 2006 @ 17:01 |
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You can not get just the movie King Kong and other movies longer than about 2 hours on one disc without compromising the picture quality by using compression.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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AfterDawn Addict
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24. March 2006 @ 17:06 |
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If you are backing up Tv box sets (like the Simpsons) you either have to compress the crapola outta it or ... use a DL disc ... With the Simpsons sets ... compression gives you a low quality picture on any Tv larger than small ...
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mrchub
Member
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25. March 2006 @ 10:27 |
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gjrhine, you're completely right. Anyone who thinks that any film can be copied as movie-only to a single-layer disc has either a very crappy TV or poor eyesight. I can't imagine copying King Kong, LOTR, etc., onto a single-layer disc. Previously I'd just copy the movie to two discs. Now I just wait for a sale on Verb DLs and off we go.
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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25. March 2006 @ 10:45 |
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Neweggs got them for about $2.50 shipped in 10 packs right now.
One time viewing stuff I'll compress. Keepers go to DL.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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riley577
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25. March 2006 @ 16:55 |
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I disagree, Ive backed up loads of films onto one disc and even the ones that need compressing still look as good as the original film. Perhaps you need to sort out your viewing equipment.I use an Lg 4163b burner with Taiyo Yuden 8x DVD-R media. My TV is a 36" Panny widescreen connected by component leads from the Dvd, perhaps my eyesight is failing due to a misspent youth but the picture i see is always brill
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AfterDawn Addict
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25. March 2006 @ 17:11 |
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I think that it all depends on what you expect out of a backup copy ... I want it to be an exact clone of the original and ... regardless of what you use for viewing ... you cannot get an exact copy using a single layer disc ... I use a BenQ DW1640, DW1655, a LiteOn, a Plextor and four others ... it doesn't matter ... and for viewing ... a HD Sony widescreen ...
and, despite my advanced age ... since my cataract surgery I have perfect vision ... 20/20 in both eyes
DISCLAIMER: If you find a posting or message from me
offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it.
If you dont know how to ignore a posting, complain to
me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate . . .
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mrchub
Member
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25. March 2006 @ 20:37 |
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riley577, you should pass along your comments to the studios. If they knew that they could get the same video quality using only 4.37GB for entire films they could save themselves a lot of money by not using higher bitrates (and thus double layer discs)!
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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26. March 2006 @ 02:03 |
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I did the 3 hours and 15 minutes of King Kong on both single and double layer for comparison. riley577 describes the picture he sees as always brill (sic) and perhaps it is but a more revealing A/V setup will always show the difference. I would describe the picture from the single layer as being "softer". Not bad at all but a nice Chevy is still not a Cadillac.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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Member
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26. March 2006 @ 03:25 |
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Sometimes too, if the compression isn't that great, the difference in single and dual layer is not noticeable; especially using TY or Verbatim. The quality of media will make a difference. There have been times where I will just get the movie itself - no titles or menus. With a compression rate of about 80%, I couldn't tell the difference in the original. Now the original was not eye-popping at all. It was pretty good, not digitally remastered or anything, but again, pretty good.
Anyway, FWIW, BB has a sale on DVD+R DL (Verbs) - 20 pack for $39.99, and Office Max has the 10 pack for $19.99.
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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26. March 2006 @ 03:56 |
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Quote:
The quality of media will make a difference
Someone explain why the quality of the media will make a difference in picture quality. The bits are either there or they are not. It seems to me that better quality media only means no pixelation, blocking, stops, etc. In the unlikely event that you should get a good burn on, say, a Memorex the picture should look the same as a good burn on a TY.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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Member
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26. March 2006 @ 05:00 |
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mrchub
Member
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26. March 2006 @ 09:22 |
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gjrhine, you're right. Even crappy media (assuming they play at all, don't freeze up, pixelate, etc.) will display the same video that a Verb or TY does. Whether or not it'll play to the end of the disc or play six months after you've burned it is another story.
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riley577
Suspended permanently
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26. March 2006 @ 14:43 |
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Anybody wanting an exact copy of their DVD including adverts , directors cut etc will have to use DL media if they want the same quality as the original. If you just want the film like i do SL media is fine. You can get into a paranoid frenzy like Hi-Fi buffs do about music and how much they have to spend to get perfection, its the same with DVD ,whos picture is perfect.
Lots of things can affect the end result you see, DVD player, scart lead, make of TV, media used etc. Im happy with my set up and wont pay for DL discs till the price comes down, im a cheapskate , but i hate people wasting money .
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gjrhine
Junior Member
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26. March 2006 @ 14:52 |
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Quote:
Anybody wanting an exact copy of their DVD including adverts , directors cut etc will have to use DL media if they want the same quality as the original.
Well you're getting there. But adverts, etc. need not be included in DL exact copy either.
Gary
Sony DRX-810UL cross flashed to a BenQ 164B (BEGB firmware)
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Bruce999
Member
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26. March 2006 @ 15:24 |
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riley577:
Quote:
(from Riley 577) Dont know why you want to use duel layer discs , they are overpriced and you can get as good a picture on a single layer disc , if you cut the crap out.
Allow me to explain why he might be interested in using one of the dual layer formats.
He may be viewing on a much larger display than you. Keep in mind that some of us are viewing a 96 inch front projection system, or a 108 inch front projection system, and that such environments tend to be very unforgiving of any additional compression at all. You may not see the difference on a 35 inch display, or a 27 inch analog TV, but a high quality true HDTV display in a larger size will be able to show you exactly how awful that compression really looks.
He may be "pickier" than you. He may be a videophile. He may be spoiled. Those of us who have been viewing true HDTV for two and three and even four years on an ISF calibrated display can become very demanding in picture quality. Some people have become frustrated even with the lesser DVD transfers ("Capote," for example, or "True Lies" or the first release of "Cliffhanger.") Some people refrain from going to the movie theaters anymore because of the poorly maintained visual presentation (dimming bulbs in projectors, poorly focused equipment, etc.)
He might be viewing on much better equipment than you.
He also might have better eyesight than you. This is not at all intended as an insult, it is mere reality.
I could go on, but the question is a legitimate one, and deserves a legitimate response (as opposed to "don't know why you would want to, they are overpriced.")
Also, your claim that "you can get just as good a picture on a single layer disc, if you cut the crap out" [SIC] is, in the majority of cases, a falsehood. It is the exception to the rule where one can cut all of the extras on a DVD-9 and end up with absolutely no need for compression whatsoever. It still happens, but it is now very rare, indeed.
You also wrote:
"I disagree, Ive backed up loads of films onto one disc and even the ones that need compressing still look as good as the original film."
Not if they have used any compression. Sorry. You may not be able to see the difference. Your equipment might be so flawed that it cannnot even make the difference noticable to your eyes. However, there is a difference, the instant you compress.
You also, curiously, wrote this:
"Perhaps you need to sort out your viewing equipment."
The fact is that the highest quality viewing equipment is also the same equipment that will allow you to see all of the flaws in a poor source. Thus, your implied meaning above is precisely the opposite of reality. A finely calibrated television display will make the best images look incredible. However, the curse is that it will also let you see exactly how "awful" an "awful" picture is. It will show every bit of edge enhancement in horrible pristine glory. It will show you any compression artifacting in fine detail, so you can actually SEE what is truly THERE. It will show you any red push, or any green pull, it will show you any noise which has been added, it will show you any grain, intentional or unintentional.
Lousy equipment will tend to make all of the sources look much more alike -- lousy.
If you cannot see your compression flaws, you may need an upgrade, and a good ISF calibration. Just a suggestion, to solve your immediate problem.
Now, to concentrate on the original poster's question:
To jhtomes:
DVD-R discs are now available. However, they are not near as "tested" as the DVD+R dual layer media, so using these may make you more of a "pioneer." They are almost eleven months "newer." The risk factor may increase, a bit. I have had 46 successful burns now with DVD+R Verbatim. I have not yet been willing to undergo the risks assopciated with a very new medium, though, so I have yet to try my first DVD-R D/L burn.
-Bruce
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. March 2006 @ 15:17
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riley577
Suspended permanently
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26. March 2006 @ 15:47 |
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All i can say is if you have HDTV and a massive screen , i think you ought to wait for HDTV DVD disc players and media. Most people on here have ordinary Tvs and non HDTV playing equipment ,so they will be ok with burning to one disc without seeing a bad picture.I think you have jumped the gun and bought HDTV stuff before the media has taken off , silly moo.
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