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Copy existing back ups to better media ?
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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4. May 2006 @ 22:42 |
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I have many dvd backups (movies) that I have burned over the last couple of years. I have used several brands of media for these backups, unfortunately I didn't learn of this forum before I started this collection. Now, after reading thru considerable parts of the forum(s), I am concerned about the lifespan of the media (movies) that I have backed up. I haven't run across any of the backups previously made that hasn't ran ok........yet! But after reading some of the comments submitted, I am wondering if there is anything to be gained at this point by making new copies of my existing backups? This time I would use media suggested by the experienced contributors to this forum, namely Taiyo Yuden media. Looks like the choice is a "slam dunk". What do you think about the re-copying?
Also, how can one easily read these codings that the manufacturers put on their media? Are there programs out there that are freeware, or does one need something such as a Nero pkg to do this? Like so many others, I too appreciate all the experience and knowledge that is shared on these forums.... Thanks
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4. May 2006 @ 23:58 |
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jacoblee- That could be a good idea depending on the original quality of your burns ! You could start with your oldest backup and see if your having problems with it first! If it has deteriorated to much you may or may not be ablr to back it up from your backup and may have to go back to the original ! Redundancey is a good idea in principal ! but if you not having problems after a few years you might not have to worry ? Also using good Media - Taiyo Yudens , Verbatims ect. in the first place is good insurance ! kinda like when your mechanic says " you can pay me now !" Or you'll be paying me later! Also keep in mind your re-backups onto better quality media although on better media ! will be no better than the disc you copying from ! like I mentioned earlier ! I'm talking the actual playback quality of the movie! If the (Data ) as it were on the disc you want to recopy is getting corrupted you might be better off going back to your original of that movie instead of trying to re-rip from a backup ! Starting ou t we've all probably used a few dosc here and there that were'nt quite up to snuff ! Then we learn and move on to better media ! Don't feel bad ! or consider yourself dumb because I don't ! your learning like the rest of us ! I learn many thing everytime I come here! from people who have just joined to The Old -timers( Meant resprctfully !) so your in the right place ! but in the end the decision as to whether or not to reback up your Collection rest with you my friend jacoblee ! On your 2cnd question if I understand you right if your asking about a program that will read the Mid Codes ( Identifies who actally makes the media Vs. who's name if any is on the label surface Brand name) Then you are looking for a program called ( DVD Idenifier ) which is available on the internet !assuming that's what you were asking of course ! Well sorry to runaway at the keyboard ! Hope I was helpful even of only a little ! good luck jacoblee & happy burning !
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Geroid04
Junior Member
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5. May 2006 @ 10:16 |
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im just now doing that same thing backing up all my non TY media to TY's if only i knew then what i know now. except in my case my oldest is no more than six months old, hopefully i can back all of them up without having to recopy the originals because that would take forever with all the encoding. Hope everything works out for u jacoblee.
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 10:40 |
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 12:34 |
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Not only burning crappy media for movies,look at some of the newer pcs like HP that you have to create your own bootdiscs.
I had 3 options of what I wanted to back them up on,and only 1 shot.My choices:
10 cds
2 DVD-5 blanks
1 DVD-9 dl blank
At that time,dl media was $10 a pop and only 40 cents a pop for quality media. No choice there for me.
Now which of my brands of media to use?
The burner that came with this pc is the HP 640c lightscribe. Way too many crc errors and poor stand alone compatability.So I swapped it for my Benq 1620 and created my boot discs using the best performing media I had: Fuji +8x,Yuden000-T02
My dad bought the same pc,same burner. When I created his bootdiscs,his called for 3 dvds.That was using his HP 640c lightscribe onto 2 Fuji Yuden000-T02 and an odd MCC-002.I took 2 fuji's over to him,but didn't expect it to take 3 discs.
Only time will tell who's bootdiscs will last.
That link from Mort81 will get you the MID codes,as well as firmware version and actual model# in case you don't know what it is.Other programs that you may already have will tell you: Nero-infotool/kprobe/qsuite/plextools/dvd decrypter/and DVD Decrypter are a few.
With poor quality backups,you'll have to get through the crc errors that they may possess. Several options on how to re-back up those first copies,for extra copies:
Safest-most compatable for me: Use dvd shrink/autoburn with Nero just like my original first backups.This way will stop you if you run into a crc error.Or you could use your normal process of what you used on your backups.Since no compression,backup process time should be a lot quicker than ripping the original.
Safe-less stand alone compatable-but higher than on the fly:Dvd decrypter is a more aggressive ripper: DVD Decrypter using Mode ISO read to harddrive/Mode ISO write/locate MDS files and burn away. CRC errors,set for Brute force and ignore all read errors.Less than 5 mins to rip to harddrive and 15 mins to burn at 4x,so about a 20 min backup time. 1 program only!
Riskiest/fastest: On the fly-lower stand alone player compatability for me. You'll need quality equipment-reader and writer drives, and backups copies that are very low on those little errors that they normal accumulate.Then use a disc copy program like nero/sonic/roxio/etc. Encryption is already pulled off,no compression is needed-so on the fly is an option,but I strongly advise against it unless you know your backups and drives are near perfect.Time: You'll get a backup time of 15 mins at 4x.My Nero time is 15 mins,but sonic's disc copy feature takes 20 mins-very odd.
HP a1118x-b/athlon 64-3300+/BenQ 1650 BCDC/LG 8163B/Modded Wii/Epson-R300 and Ty Watershields!!! |
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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5. May 2006 @ 19:34 |
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That's what I'm talk'in about!........ appreciate the words of wisdom. Let me add also that just about all of my dvd backups were burned at 4x, most using a TDK 440N with the latest firmware revs. I have to say that it has performed great for me to this point. I also have a Sony DRX-53OUL (rated 8x on +'s)and a Plextor PX-740UF that is rated at 16x for +/- DVD's (actually I bought it for the DL feature). Both are externals and I have updated firmware for both. It looks like burning at 4x (8x max), produces the best results, according to some of the more experienced users on the forum(s). I recently ordered taiyo-yuden media from Rima. I did order some of the 16x media, but will probably stick with the 4x or the 8x burn speed as mentioned.
Yes, I realize that copying the backup cannot offer any improvement in quality. I started with XCopy, used DVD Decryptor, but have settled on using AnyDVD along with CloneDVD2. With this, I have been very well satisfied with the quality created thus far. With time, what shows up from using the nsg (not so good) media? What should I look for? Will the video hang, audio break up, or what? If I start finding these types of things, I will have to start over I guess. Otherwise, if they appear to still be ok, would just making a disc copy (I use roxio) be the way to go? Would keep things much simpler and faster. All aside, I take it that the hat of experience (you guys) definitely feel that using the taiyo-yuden media will no doubt out last anything backed up using run of the mill media??
Thanks Mort81, will check out the dvdidentifier prog. Is there anything complicated about loading, running, using this jewel?
Thanks again all for the words of wisdom.....
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 20:16 |
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Dvd identifier is very simple to use. Dl and intall it. Load your media in a drive. Give it a few seconds to be recognized. Open dvd identifier. Make sure the drive with the loaded media is selected then click identify.
The most common problems with poor quality media is pausing, freezing, and skipping. These problems usually get worse over time. In some cases the backup will play back fine at 1st but over time detereorate to the point they experience these problems and in some cases won't play back at all.
TY and verbatim are both good media choices.
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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5. May 2006 @ 20:56 |
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Mort81....
Guess I'll have to dig into the archives and watch a couple of my older backups (movies) & see if they are dying.... Is it the same story with CDR's? Like I said, I have used many different brands of media (probably 8-10 different names), in fact I just am just finishing a cake of 100 TDK's that I have had stuck in the closet for some time......... I hate to remember that when I bought them at BB they were 1 toadhide each, only to find out now that I could have used my hard earned $$ for verb.'s or TY's! (I just the other day picked up a spindle of 50 Imations at Office Max, probably ought to take them back for a refund since I have the TY's on the way). Live and learn....
I downloaded dvdidentifier but haven't installed it yet. Will have to play around with it eventually.
I read some threads that there has been some problems with outfits pushing "bogus" TY media. Are you aware of anything recent on this? Just ordered some for the first time & hope that they are the real thing....
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 22:48 |
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jacoblee,
Rather than having to watch the entire back up, you could check for errors using Nero scandisc. After you ID your discs (with dvd identifier) and you run some scans you will know which media codes could be causing playback issues.
If it was me I would probably return the Imations. As long as you buy your TY's from a reputable store (such as supermediastore or rima) you will most likely get the real deal. When you get them post the numbers/letters around the hub and we can verify their authenticity. Should start with gg or similiar.
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6. May 2006 @ 05:14 |
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Imation: Take them back. I just set up a co-worker pc to burn using his rebadged benq 1655. I loaded up dvdidentifier-the older version,and checked out his MID codes and they were cmags in the dash 8x imations. Their plus format may also contain a slew of cmags.
Office Max had the verbatim 16x on sale for $14.99 a 50 pk.
4x media is getting very hard to find. 8x media is disappearing fast. All being replaced by 16x media.
Those TDK's you got: Most likely cmags! Same for memosux/philips/ and HP.
Quote:
I read some threads that there has been some problems with outfits pushing "bogus" TY media
Oh yea, there are fake tys floating around everywhere. Those store mort posted are great sites,and I'll throw in meritline.com and americal.com.
Make sure those sites say genuine taiyo yuden. Beware of other brand names saying their are taiyo yuden.Taiyo Yuden makes some media for Sony/Fuji/and verbatim. Any off brand advertising ty,beware of.
Ebay is a fine example and the seller's name is Silver Tek.
Newegg.com was selling some off brand media claiming they were taiyo yuden. They were advertising those off brands and they were made in taiwan or some bogus country other than japan. The genuine Taiyo yuden media is made in Japan.The MID codes can be faked,but ty puts another code on the bottom of their disc,inside the dye on the inner hub. That code can't be faked so far.That's the code at the end of mort81's last post.
HP a1118x-b/athlon 64-3300+/BenQ 1650 BCDC/LG 8163B/Modded Wii/Epson-R300 and Ty Watershields!!!
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AfterDawn Addict
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6. May 2006 @ 05:54 |
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to put the cincher on what mort81 and saugmon added regarding TYs, here is a recap from my docTY thread for the necessary info to determine AUTHENTICITY of your TYs~
Taiyo Yuden rated speed & format/ media ID coding / inner hub reading
4x DVD-R = TYG01 / GD00xxxx
8x DVD-R = TYG02 / GG00xxxx
16x DVD-R = TYG03 / GH00xxxx
4x DVD+R = YUDEN000T01 / i don't know cuz i don't have any :P
8x DVD+R = YUDEN000T02 / TG00xxxx
16x DVD+R = YUDEN000T03 / TH00xxxx
good luck with your backups~ :)
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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AfterDawn Addict
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6. May 2006 @ 09:16 |
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Lots of good help. Thanks gents.
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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6. May 2006 @ 16:51 |
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Thanks to all for the advice/wisdom on this and the heads - up on the coding. I should be getting my shipment in the next couple of days, when I do, I will post the coding no's to insure that I did in fact get what I was wanting.
Which forum would be most appropriate to post the codings for manufacturers verification?
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AfterDawn Addict
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6. May 2006 @ 19:10 |
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kivory666 showed you what to look for.
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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6. May 2006 @ 22:48 |
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Copy that.......
Just finished watching King Kong. I had burned it on a Verb dl. It had a couple of hang - ups in it, which I do not like! ......... I must say that I really haven't been 100% satisfied with the dl format up to this point. I went back and watched the same scenes on another backup that I did (compressed on dvd5)and it played smoothly. I'm not using a HD tv so I don't really see the degradation in playing a compressed movie like some say they do ......... when comparing it to an un-compressed (dl)backup. So, in my opinion, at this point, the jury on the dl (for movies) is still out. Had any experiences with the dl jobs?
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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6. May 2006 @ 23:17 |
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Quote:
Had any experiences with the dl jobs?
I've only used DL media for some large folders of around 14 gb (combined both sides of a dvd10) and compressed it down to fit on a DVD9 using rb/cce. This was done on a season of law and order and composed of 3 dvd10's which I used 3 DL dvd's to back it up. I also made backups of the lord of the rings trilogy on DL media. I only use verbatim DVD+R DL media and booktype them dvd-rom. I also keep the burn speed for DL media to 2.4x even though the media is rated at 6x. I use imgburn to burn my DL's. They all play back perfectly.
I don't see the need for many DL discs since rb/cce does such an excellent job on compression. I have many backups to dvd5's with more than 60% compression and I can't see much video quality loss if any on my 52" HDTV.
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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7. May 2006 @ 16:44 |
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Mort81....
Well, you are more advanced into this stuff than I am, would you mind telling me what the rb/cce stands for ( you must tolerate my "newbeeness" if you can). Also, you speak of bookmarking them as DVD Ram, you lost me on that one too! I thought that DVD Ram was just another format of DVD, something that I have seen on several of the stand alone DVD recorder/players?
The burns that I have made using the dl format were using the verb DVD+R DL media. I probably used a burn speed of 8x or maybe 4x, I don't remember. I think the media is rated at 6x, but I have seen it advertised that it will go 8x? The couple of times that I have bought any, I ordered them from Newegg. I see where BB has them at a decent price from time to time. They have been running some of the other brand on sale also. SAMS club used to sell the verbatiums, but I haven't see any there for some time. My Plextor burner is rated for 8x on the +R, dl according to the specs. Next time I use it I am going to use the 2.4x speed. I think that the slower burn speeds do give less errors, seems to be the consensus. I use the CloneDVD2 exclusively (thus far) but sure wish that it had a merge function incorporated into it. I would like to be able to take some of these 2 disc sets and combine them into 1 good dl backup.
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AfterDawn Addict
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7. May 2006 @ 19:16 |
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rb/cce stands for dvd rebuilder/cinema craft encoder. This is the elite of the back up software. There is a free installer version available that has a couple free encoders bundled in including hc encoder by hanks that rivals CCE but is not quite as fast. Encoding software (cce, hc encoder, procoder) will produce better results over transcoding software (dvd shrink, CloneDVD, recode2 etc.) especially on high compression projects but does usually require more time. There is a link to the free installer vs in my sig. Here's some good reading explaining the differences between encoders and transcoders and set up for rb http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?t=55302
Quote:
Also, you speak of bookmarking them as DVD Ram,
Let me correct you. I said I booktype (not bookmark) my dvd+r's to dvd-rom (not dvd-ram). Here's a couple good reads http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46559 http://www.cdfreaks.com/article/150 Your plextor should be capable of bitsetting/booktyping depending on which model you have and can probably be set to do so in plextools.
I don't use CloneDVD very often but was thinking it had the capability to merge dvd's and folders. You need to watch the amount of compression with it and I wouldn't go more than 70%. I use dvdremake to combine dvds/folders.
I wouldn't stray from using verbatim DL media. Booktyping the DVD+R DL's to dvd-rom should improve the compatability. Also try slowing the burn to 2.4x and if that works ok then try some 4x burns. BTW I booktype all my DVD+R media dvd-rom (not only the DL media).
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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7. May 2006 @ 20:01 |
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Well, looks like I've got some reading to catch up on....... Well, that's usually the way it goes with me, I'll run across something that sounds better AFTER I have committed to something else. The Plextor that I have is a PX-740UF, an external, USB2 or firewire. I haven't done a whole lot with it, but I think they are a good quality unit. My first burner was a Plextor. With all the time involved in doing this, why not come out with the best quality that one can? Them suckers have gotten the prices down pretty low on a lot of the movies that I have collected over the past few years. Figuring ones time involved & the materials that it takes to do this, in many cases, it's probably as cheap to go out and buy a second original. But hey, look at all the fun we'd be missing!!
I've noticed that a lot of the movies coming out on dvd are now made in Mexico. I can't help but think that this has affected the quality - and I don't mean for the better! I will have to go thru my listings for my backup collection and re-do my favorites first. I also have a lot of family history research materials on dvd & cd, I sure in the heck don't want that to disappear! I made 2 copies originally just to be safe.
Oh, I did take the imations back for a refund today. Also ran across two packs of 50 Memorex's that I had forgotten about. I don't know if Office Max would refund those or not, receipt is dated Jan. 06? It was a buy 2, get 1 free deal. I'll have to check that out tomorrow.
Thanks for the informational tip, I will check those sites out.
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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7. May 2006 @ 20:32 |
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Your plextor is a rebadged phillips/benq (phillips chipset)http://www.videohelp.com/dvdwriters.php?DVDnameid=1282&Search=Sea... and although it is still capable of bitsetting/booktyping I don't think it can be done with plextools on that model. You might be able to use DVD Decrypter to bitset/booktype by selecting benq as the drive make or maybe use dvdinfopro.
I think my buddy arniebear had one of those drives. I'll get him onboard if need be.
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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7. May 2006 @ 22:25 |
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Careful there Mort81.............
You're begining to blow my mind on this stuff, I would be interested in the bitsetting/booktype setting function. You might check with your buddy regarding this drive for me. Also, checking a little further, looks like some software will do it for you too?
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AfterDawn Addict
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8. May 2006 @ 04:58 |
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@jacoblee
I had a Plex740, which as my buddy Mort81 states is a BenQ drive. I had a difficult time bitsetting with the unit at first because of it not being a true Plex and you could not use PlexTools. Even though it was a BenQ it would not use BenQ QSuite either, however it would bitset using individual programs manually, i.e. DVDDecrypter, Nero. But if I wanted to use CloneDVD to record there is not bitsetting capability in that program. What I ended up doing is using DVDInfo Pro to bitset. The program allows you to set it and forget it and will work in all programs as long as you have it set to the drive in the program. You set it and do not need to even open the program it will automatically do it. You can dl the free version that has the advertss in it and it will work fine. I ended up liking it so much I purchased it. The free version does expire so you will end up having to reinstall from time to time.
http://www.dvd-recordable.org/wwwimgs/media/flash/dvdinfopro/index.htm
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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8. May 2006 @ 05:39 |
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Thanks Pete,
You pretty much repeated what I had said naming pretty much the same software as I did to perform the task. I needed someone who had personally experienced bitsetting with a px-740 to comfirm it though. Thanks again my friend.
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435 |
AfterDawn Addict
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8. May 2006 @ 05:44 |
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@Mort
Anything for you my friend :)
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jacoblee
Junior Member
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8. May 2006 @ 15:36 |
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@ arniebear...., Mort81
Fine Business on the info, much appreciated. Using DVDinfo Pro, does this mean that the bitsetting can be done when using ANY dvd writer, or is it relative only to the Px 740 that we have been discussing? Once loaded, does the program run in the backround or does it have to be opened each time? I do like to used Clonedvd2 (along with anydvd) because it is so simple to use. I notice that there are 2 trial (free) versions available to download at the site you mention... I am using an Intel Pent. processor with xp, so am wondering which one to download? Is there a tutorial available for beginners? What is the price for the full blown ver.? Have you noticed any conflicts with other software after you began using this? Again, thank you for being aware of my "newbieness" & bearing with me on this stuff. I am starting to see that there are ways to achieve better results & am finding it very interesting. In fact, after learning about the bitsetting and book typing, I have been wondering which burner is the "tried & proven" one to have? Maybe you & Mort81 have some ideas on that. I wouldn't mind doing some looking into what's available to "get er dun" with ease & good quality results.
I feel like a kid......... learning something every day!!!
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