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Sony, Panasonic introduce Blu-ray discs with 33.4GB layers
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The following comments relate to this news article:
article published on 2 January, 2010
Panasonic and Sony have introduced the new i-MLSE (Maximum Likelihood Sequence Estimation) method this week, increasing the per-layer storage capacity of Blu-ray discs from the current 25GB to 33.4GB.
Tech-On! says the new method can use existing Blu-ray equipment, a "blue-violet laser diode with a 405 nm wavelength, and an object lens with a numeric aperture (NA) of 0.85."
i-MLSE ... [ read the full article ]
Please read the original article before posting your comments.
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 16:58 |
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First to Ry, why on earth would you say something like speak for myself and not to the world, who in the hell is speaking for the world, of course my opinion is mine, where do you people come from when somebody comes off with an opinion and your almost told to shut up jeez!
Now there is nothing wrong with my eyes, my Sony 40 inch xbr is a top notch set, I remember the first time I rented a bluray everybody was all excited, and that means my wife, my kids, my friends and some neighbors even came over, I already owned the movie Transformers in DVD but rented it on BR, when I switched without telling anybody everybody said when are you gonna put the BR on, I said this is the BR, everyone said WHAT!, your kidding right, there goes your view right out the window, one of my neighbors does have one of those 56 inch or whatever sets, there I saw a slight difference, but not for the extra bucks, and as far as Tosh saying you can't make that argument anymore how can you say that, sure the prices went down, but what does that matter, you think I'm gonna switch my huge collection to BR because of a slight difference, like you guys say to each his own, but I'm not foolish enough to go out and spend money even if the prices have come down just to say I own the best or the newest, or to justify my new bought equipment and argue even if the facts don't show diddly.
You guys can harp all day long, it will never justify the fact that there is no way in hell one needs to switch to BR even with the lower costs, not for that little difference, I would not switch even if the prices were the same as DVD, just isn't worth it, I do not spend my money foolishly, if others want to than more power to you, and again please do not get on a high horse and tell me to keep my opinion off the world, I have never ever said anything like that to anybody here at AD, everybody is entitled to one.
And last, my neighbor next door, owns a 32 inch Samsung, we both played with his set using DVD & BR, the difference was nothing, Nada, Squat, None, Siltch, in plain words no difference on a 32 inch what so ever, and as far as sound, not everybody is an audio freak, we all have nice quality recievers with good speakers and the sound is just fine with what we have. Like I said before, a switch from VHS to DVD now that was something, DVD to BR is a joke, and no I'm not speaking for the world, but I can speak for at least 25 people that came to the same conclusion that I have first hand, they all thanked me for saving them some bucks also.
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Toshibot
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9. January 2010 @ 17:04 |
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Originally posted by FredBun:
I can speak for at least 25 people that came to the same conclusion that I have first hand, they all thanked me for saving them some bucks also.
Well my Scoreboard trumps your 25 people.
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 17:19 |
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Thats just the kind of answer I expect from all the people that went out and spent huge amounts of money especially in the begining, you want to throw specs at me, those specs mean nothing to me, most are there to get you to spend your hard earned cash.
My specs are real people not what some corporation throws at you, when I go to my local Blockbuster store I always notice how thier BR shelves stay full, there goes your specs, so yes, I'll take my 25 people over your 1000 specs or whatever any day, but last, hey as far as this BR thing goes, and thats your thing, and your lovin it, I think that's great, Enjoy it.
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Toshibot
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9. January 2010 @ 17:31 |
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Originally posted by FredBun:
My specs are real people not what some corporation throws at you, when I go to my local Blockbuster store I always notice how thier BR shelves stay full, there goes your specs, so yes, I'll take my 25 people over your 1000 specs or whatever any day, but last, hey as far as this BR thing goes, and thats your thing, and your lovin it, I think that's great, Enjoy it.
They're not specs.
They're sales figures.
As in real people who bought the product with their money.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 17:41 |
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Originally posted by FredBun:
I go to my local Blockbuster store I always notice how thier BR shelves stay full,
Blockbuster?
Are you kidding? No one rents at Blockbuster any more. That's why they're closing down stores all over the place.
Of the 2 stores nearby - one already had to close down. At the other store even the DVD shelves are always full because no one is renting anymore. LOL!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. January 2010 @ 17:45
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 17:46 |
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Same s%#t different shovel, like I said specs, now go to your figures, and tell me the difference on how much was spent on BR sales and equipment compared to DVD sales and equipment for 09, I don't think you'll be giving me a comeback on that one besides just another opinion.
I talk to sales people and managers also, I do my homework before I shout off at the jibs, and they all tell me a completely different story than what your figures hope to show, again, enjoy your BR set up, I'm happy for you.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 17:53 |
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Blu-ray booms while DVDs keep slumping in fourth quarter
Quote:
Blu-ray continued to blossom over the holidays, but Hollywood didn't get any relief from plunging DVD sales, which still account for most home video revenue.
According to data compiled by the Digital Entertainment Group, a home entertainment trade organization, shipments of high-definition Blu-ray discs grew 35% in the U.S. to 38.6 million in the fourth quarter, the biggest period of the year for the industry as consumers buy gifts for the holidays.
Shipments of standard DVD discs fell 17% from the same three-month period in 2008 to 374.7 million. That's better than the 31% plunge the previous year, when the bottom first fell out of the DVD market as the recession hit and consumers started migrating toward rentals over purchases. However, several home entertainment executives have said they were hoping DVD sales would come closer to stabilizing last quarter compared with the previous year's free fall.
Overall revenue from DVD and Blu-ray sales dropped 14% in the fourth quarter. That combined figure, all that the DEG provided, masks a much bigger drop in the standard DVD category, since Blu-ray sales rose more than 35%.
"We have seen tremendous growth in both Blu-ray hardware and software," Ron Sanders, president of Warner Home Video and leader of the DEG, said in a statement. He added, hopefully, "We are looking forward to seeing some stabilization in the packaged goods sell-through business in the coming year."
Consumers have increasingly turned to rentals, rather than purchases, during the economic downturn, evidenced in a 4% rise in DVD and Blu-ray rental revenue last year to $6.5 billion. As Rentrak Corp., which provided rental data to the DEG, reported on Tuesday, all of that growth was attributable to bargain $1-per-night kiosk company Redbox and mail subscription company Netflix Inc.
Total spending on Blu-ray discs surpassed $1 billion last year for the first time, hitting $1.5 billion. Sales of the high-definition discs grew 70% to more than $500 million, while rentals increased by 48% to about $1 billion.
The higher demand for Blu-ray movies was fueled by a rapid increase in the number of devices that can play them. Consumers bought more than 7 million Blu-ray players in 2009, bringing the total in U.S. homes to about 17 million. More than 4.5 million were bought in the fourth quarter alone, driven by steep price cuts that brought down the cost of the most basic players below $100 at some stores.
Digital downloads via the Internet and cable systems also grew significantly in 2009, with revenue up 32% to $2.1 billion. Video-on-demand rentals were particularly fruitful this fall, rising 63% in the fourth quarter. One of the main reasons for that increase is that studios have been moving up the date at which they offer movies for VOD, in some cases to the same date or even before they are available to buy on DVD.
The growth in digital, Blu-ray and rentals was not enough, however, to make up for the big drop in standard DVD sales and rentals. Though DEG didn't specify how much it fell, standard DVD is the only category that didn't rise, driving down total home entertainment spending by 5% to $20 billion in 2009.
Domestic box-office sales, meanwhile, rose 10% last year to $10.6 billion.
Included in the 2009 report was some surprising news about the past: DEG revised downward its estimates of consumer entertainment spending during the last decade. For every year since 2001, total spending is now down, in some cases significantly, from what was previously reported. In 2008, for instance, DEG now says total home entertainment spending was $21 billion. Last year, the group said the figure was $22.4 billion.
A spokeswoman for DEG attributed the change to revised data from Rentrak.
Bottom line:
Blu-Ray = growth industry
DVD = decline
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. January 2010 @ 17:55
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 17:56 |
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HDNow, god you guys entertain me, when it comes to tuesdays when all the new movies come out the shelves at my store just about clear out, besides my store just got granted another 4 year lease, yes some others closed down around the slower areas, but it seems to me there are still enough people to make my store stay in bussines, and again the BR shelves stay full.
But were not talking about how good BB is doing, thats another subject, I still do just fine with mine and still get pretty good deals, so until something better comes along for me no need to look elswhere.
Now to get back on topic, I hope you guys are not feeling bad about spending all those extra bucks for BR, not my intention, so don't feel bad guys. Enjoy your BR, I really mean it.
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 18:07 |
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HDNow, LOL, there goes those specs again, sure if that article makes you fell justified for spending those extra bucks, sure than I'm glad you beleive it, you see I'm old school, I believe what I see, and hear, not that often what I read, I have read articles like that, but the people in the trenches say otherwise, if I read something that interests me I do my own homework, than I'll go out and survey, so I do not beleive especially by people that mostly get paid or get favors thrown at them just to write atricles like that, so keep reading that article if it makes you feel better. Enjoy your BR.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 19:25 |
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 19:37 |
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I'm not obsessed about anything, I just don't spend money foolishly, you say you haven't spent any extra bucks, maybe your not spending extra on whatever your doing now with you BR, extra or not, but you bought into it didn't you, so you just made my point, you see I didn't spend anything on it, therefor I'm not obsessed, I'm just defending my point, so if I'm not mistaken I think the obession lies elsewhere.
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Toshibot
Member
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9. January 2010 @ 19:46 |
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Senior Member
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9. January 2010 @ 19:58 |
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You guys just aren't getting it are you, I said before, why should I change my anything if this BR does not benifit me at all, why should I spend one red cent on it, I don't care what kind of deal BR is offering, I not foolish enough to buy into it.
This is just gonna go on and on isn't it, so let me end it right now, you guys are absolutely right about the whole deal, I am totally wrong about it all, I do not know what I am talking about, you guys got me, Enjoy your BR.
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Toshibot
Member
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9. January 2010 @ 20:13 |
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Originally posted by Ryu77:
Besides, Blu-ray isn't just about picture quality. The audio has also been much improved. Even in worse case scenario through older AV equipment, the legacy codecs (Dolby/DTS) are of slightly higher bitrate not to mention the superb offerings of HD audio.
As far as cost vs. value, well that is the decision that only the consumer can make. You obviously have yours but please don't speak on behalf of the World. The point you make about VHS to DVD being a bigger jump than DVD to Blu-ray is somwhat true, but please don't omit the fact that people can still enjoy their DVD collection (albeit in better quality) on a Blu-ray player. No need for the old player to still be hanging around. Could you do this with VHS to DVD? So with this negative you mention, there is an equal positive present.
The other feature present on some Blu-ray players (that is not available on DVD players) is connectivity.
I've just been playing with some of the features on an LG BD390 and I'm impressed. There's built in WiFi, plus the ability to play Netflix, YouTube and CinemaNow streams. In addition there's DLNA connectivity lets me stream HD content from my PC.
Blu-ray players are increasingly becoming all-in-one media hubs - something that you won't see on a regular DVD player. PLUS they upconvert your old DVD collection to 1080p.
The news from CES has IPTV coming:
http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/21213.cfm
The day may come when you won't even need a cable or satellite box.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. January 2010 @ 20:15
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Senior Member
5 product reviews
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10. January 2010 @ 09:19 |
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FredBun, I can see that you posted something that signified that you no longer wish to converse here but I felt I should at least reply to your post.
Originally posted by FredBun:
First to Ry, why on earth would you say something like speak for myself and not to the world, who in the hell is speaking for the world, of course my opinion is mine, where do you people come from when somebody comes off with an opinion and your almost told to shut up jeez!
I'm sorry if I offended you but the previous post sounded more like you spoke on behalf of many. You mentioned you can speak on behalf of 25 people you have helped to decide against Blu-ray in a post after this one. Without intending to place my statement above yours, I feel I have helped quite many myself as that is my daily job. I do sell TV's & Home Theatre equipment for a living.
Originally posted by FredBun:
Now there is nothing wrong with my eyes, my Sony 40 inch xbr is a top notch set
Can I ask though, what were your reasons for purchasing a top of the line Sony Bravia TV if not for better picture quality? I agree that they are great as I have a 52" Z Series Bravia. However, I am curious as to why you buy a high level Full HD set but seem to dismiss the benefits of Blu-ray? Wouldn't you have been better off buying a HD (1366 x 768) LCD as you mentioned that Full HD (1920 x 1080) has no benifit at 40" and many times stated that it is just a waste of money?
Originally posted by FredBun:
I remember the first time I rented a bluray everybody was all excited, and that means my wife, my kids, my friends and some neighbors even came over, I already owned the movie Transformers in DVD but rented it on BR, when I switched without telling anybody everybody said when are you gonna put the BR on, I said this is the BR, everyone said WHAT!, your kidding right, there goes your view right out the window
You were using HDMI right? This is a very important factor in determining where your view comes from. It is quite strange that I keep a DVD and Blu-ray copy of that exact movie to demonstrate the benefits of Blu-ray at work, and every single person has been able to see the improvement in quality. Transformers is one of the cleanest looking Blu-ray releases to date. If you can not see it there, then yes you are right, Blu-ray is of no benefit to you.
Originally posted by FredBun:
one of my neighbors does have one of those 56 inch or whatever sets, there I saw a slight difference, but not for the extra bucks, and as far as Tosh saying you can't make that argument anymore how can you say that, sure the prices went down, but what does that matter
A slight difference on a 50" - 58" set... Wow, I guess 5 times the extra pixels can still not be seen at that size. With all due respect Fred, that does suggest to me that your eyes aren't as discerning as some. Now please don't take this as derogatory, as for myself and many others the difference is very noticable.
Originally posted by FredBun:
you think I'm gonna switch my huge collection to BR because of a slight difference, like you guys say to each his own
That was my point earlier, you don't need to do that at all. Your DVD's will still play fine on a Blu-ray player, but with Blu-ray there is the option to go for the Blu-ray release in the future.
Originally posted by FredBun:
but I'm not foolish enough to go out and spend money even if the prices have come down just to say I own the best or the newest, or to justify my new bought equipment and argue even if the facts don't show diddly.
But didn't you do that when you bought your new Bravia TV?
Originally posted by FredBun:
You guys can harp all day long, it will never justify the fact that there is no way in hell one needs to switch to BR even with the lower costs, not for that little difference, I would not switch even if the prices were the same as DVD, just isn't worth it, I do not spend my money foolishly, if others want to than more power to you, and again please do not get on a high horse and tell me to keep my opinion off the world, I have never ever said anything like that to anybody here at AD, everybody is entitled to one.
So even if Blu-ray was the same cost as DVD, you still wouldn't buy it? That does seem kind of odd to me. Is there another reason why you don't like it. If there is, that's completely fine but I honestly can not see any logic at this point. If things were the same cost, why wouldn't you buy the superior product?.. However slight the improvement might be.
Originally posted by FredBun:
And last, my neighbor next door, owns a 32 inch Samsung, we both played with his set using DVD & BR, the difference was nothing, Nada, Squat, None, Siltch, in plain words no difference on a 32 inch what so ever, and as far as sound, not everybody is an audio freak, we all have nice quality recievers with good speakers and the sound is just fine with what we have. Like I said before, a switch from VHS to DVD now that was something, DVD to BR is a joke, and no I'm not speaking for the world, but I can speak for at least 25 people that came to the same conclusion that I have first hand, they all thanked me for saving them some bucks also.
I can gather far more testomonials from happy customers than 25... But, this isn't the arena for a superiority challenge. I am simply astounded of the rare few individuals out there that just seem to have a hatred for Blu-ray but can not provide any real reasons or logic.
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Senior Member
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10. January 2010 @ 10:58 |
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I thought I was done with this thread, but since you politely asked it would not be polite of me not to answer.
I 'll make this as short as I can, yeah right lol, I know how people react in stores especially when salesmen throw their pitch, many people today that are buying LCD's are upgrading from standard TV's, of course it's gonna look great, especially when you show them a huge screen, that's when BR kinda shines, sure it's nice, if a huge screen is your thing, I would have to sit two rooms away to view one of those things, which brings me to my eye sight, my eye sight might be better than yours, I have been cursed so to speak because when I view my TV's I have always been a perfectionist, if I would go over some friends home's and watch ball games on their TV and many times the picture was off it would bother the hell out of me, and I know your gonna reply well if your such a perfectionist than why are you knocking BR, again, watching my 40 inch Sony the picture is great, I view my HD channels, my DVD's and the pictures are crystal clear, if I wanted a 60 inch set if I was rich I would build a home theater, I don't have millions. Besides like I said no way I could watch a huge screen in the same regular sized living room, why cause my eyes are to good, it hurts.
Viewing my 40 inch Sony with my regular DVD's are just fine, like I said before, a 40 or under BR is a waste, I really do wish it was not, I always yearn for better quality, and if it is quality if I can afford it I jump on it.
Your comment on me buying this Sony, ok, when I first saw these LCD TV's some years back, I was salivating for one, but, I could not handle them, especially with fast action movies and sports, I could not handle that blur, it would actually make me dizzy, why cause my eyes are to good, it doesn't bother most people I know, but than again I do have great eye sight, to damn good sometimes.
So when I first read about Sony coming out with the 120hz I think it's called I decided to give it a shot, now don't forget, even with BR with a 60hz set I still saw the blurs, not with this 120 Sony, I was surprised at the difference, finally I could buy an LCD, I also got a great deal on it at the time it was a one day sale, so there is your answer about that, I didn't buy it cause it was a top notch set, I bought it because finally the quality was there without hardly any blur.
And yes I was anxious to finally enjoy BR, unfortunately it didn't happen, my kids already had the PS3 console and man was I disappointed, I really wanted this BR thing to be successful I really did. I don't knock it cause I'm against advancement, I knock it cause it doesn't work, they expected us to spend huge bucks on new equipment, new media, buy new BR movies, were not talking about pennies here, and for what, for that slight deference, I can't fall for that.
Like I said before, remember that deference from VHS to DVD, man that was something, I was elated, it was a great feeling to see that difference, not so with BR, if I ever hit the big lottery, and afford a huge home with a huge theater room with a giant screen with BR of course, nice comfy theatrical type seats in rows lol man that would be my dream, but for how most regular people view, not happening.
You remember I said when I viewed BR on one of my neighbors home with that huge set, he bought it cause his wife wanted one, I was surprised when he said he can't watch it much in his living room cause it hurts his eyes, he can't sit far enough from it, same thing with me, damn things make me dizzy.
As far as my 25 friends, lol, how much more peoples advice do you need to determine an outcome, I also go out and talk to people other than my close 25 friends, most share my opinion, when I go out to local store like bestbuy or such, I talk to people, I watch and listen to their reactions, I remember last year at bestbuys, I saw a couple being manipulated by a salesman, he was trying to sell them one of those huge screens and buy new BR equipment, I love how these stores set up a special room with a huge screen with a great huge sound system, a BR setup, yupers it looks and sounds great, you also do not get the opportunity to view a 32in. 40in. sets, sure they are hooked up to a local HD signal, anyway, I pulled the guy aside, asked him to set up a BR player & a DVD player to the exact same Sony I have, the salesman tried his damnest to talk him out of it, you see those places don't let you view DVD on all the displayed sets, only the one in that special room where they control everything, all those other sets never have a player hooked up, they say it's not cost effective, I had a movie with me, I was there to buy another DVD player and see if it was compatible with my copy of a DVD movie, and lets not go there, I'm not gonna argue about why I copy my store bought movies, my kids have ruined enough of them, so when they want to watch one of my movies they can view my copy, so there and I don't care who likes it or not RIAA or whomever else disagrees, thay can all kiss my you know what.
Well after fighting the salesman he finally agreed, he hooked it up on that 40 inch Sony with a BR player and a DVD player, guess what, the couple walked off with that Sony, no BR player that he also tried to sell them plus the huge set, he shook my hand and thanked me, he too said he saw no difference, not enough to spend all that extra money, and the salesman, man was he pissed at me, but while the DVD player was still set up, I tried my copy and it worked fine, we talked some and actually became a little friendly, I still see him at times when I visit bestbuy and he says oh no not you again, please stay away from my customers jokingly of course but in the end he is a pretty nice guy, when people ask me for advise to buy I send them to him if he's there, I just tell them to ask for George and make sure you say Fred sent you, when I send them he doesn't pull their string so to speak lol, and he always thanks me if he sells or not.
So there you have it, you got my lowdown, and hey if you like this BR thing, if you think it makes a difference than by all means go for it, I just think people should experience it for themselves somewhere before they buy and be disappointed later. So phew! I'm done, there you have it, I won't be explaining anymore, at 61 my hands hurt. And last, really I mean it, if this BR really wets your whistle, I'm glad for ya, I wish I could be.
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Toshibot
Member
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10. January 2010 @ 11:13 |
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Originally posted by Ryu77:
A slight difference on a 50" - 58" set... Wow, I guess 5 times the extra pixels can still not be seen at that size. With all due respect Fred, that does suggest to me that your eyes aren't as discerning as some. Now please don't take this as derogatory, as for myself and many others the difference is very noticable.
Ryu77: I had a feeling that viewing distance had something to do with it.
Now it's confirmed:
Originally posted by FredBun:
he can't sit far enough from it, same thing with me, damn things make me dizzy.
Sit far away enough from something and you really won't see a difference.
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10. January 2010 @ 11:32 |
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lol, sorry tosh, that one doesnt even deserve a reply, even though ry and I might disagree but at least he makes sense and comments I can live it, I can politely disagree with him at least.
Have a good one guys I'm outta here.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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10. January 2010 @ 11:37 |
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Quote:
You mentioned you can speak on behalf of 25 people you have helped to decide against Blu-ray in a post after this one. Without intending to place my statement above yours, I feel I have helped quite many myself as that is my daily job. I do sell TV's & Home Theatre equipment for a living.
25 people
He brushes off industry-wide data as reported by a respected consumer advocate group.
Instead he repeatedly cites anecdotal comments from a small circle of 25 people.
Well, since he opened the door to anecdotal evidence:
On Black Friday weekend my local Walmart sold 48 units of the Magnavox Blu-ray player on sale for $78. They sold an additional 75 units at the same price during the weeks leading to Christmas. (They didn't lower it like other stores did.) Their stock of Panasonic and Vizio players also sold out at sale prices. By the end only a few Sony and Philips players were left.
And I didn't even have to convince any of them.
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Senior Member
5 product reviews
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10. January 2010 @ 11:43 |
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Fred, did you do your Blu-ray and DVD comparison with a HDMI cable? That was one question I was hoping you would answer.
Originally posted by FredBun:
I love how these stores set up a special room with a huge screen with a great huge sound system, a BR setup, yupers it looks and sounds great, you also do not get the opportunity to view a 32in. 40in. sets, sure they are hooked up to a local HD signal, anyway, I pulled the guy aside, asked him to set up a BR player & a DVD player to the exact same Sony I have, the salesman tried his damnest to talk him out of it, you see those places don't let you view DVD on all the displayed sets, only the one in that special room where they control everything, all those other sets never have a player hooked up, they say it's not cost effective
Actually, in my store we are set up with HDMI/HDCP repeaters that link to every, single TV set with a central AV rack to hold all the source devices (PS3, Blu-ray Player, TiVo, HD set top box etc.). So if I change it to a Blu-ray source, every TV set changes to this source. Just to clarify, this is by no means a small store. I would guess we have approx. 150+ TV's on display. Nothing to hide here. As I said earlier, every single customer I have demonstrated Blu-ray to can see an improvement. Some see it more than others. Admittedly, some aren't that keen on it as they hardly even watch discs at all... But to say there is NO difference on TV's 40" or below... Well... Let's just leave it at that as I have had a completely different experience.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. January 2010 @ 11:46
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10. January 2010 @ 12:20 |
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here we go lol, HD, yeah walmart, dont even wanna touch that, not my cup of tea, but anyway sure they will buy it, till they get home and most see no difference, I've seen enough get dissaponted on that subject, and stop harping about my 25 friends, if you haven't gotten my point by now there is no sense to continue with you.
Ry, yes I have tried and do use HDMI, believe me I tried it all thinking maybe there was something we were missing when we first tried BR on my set. but it's not just mine I see the same reaction no matter were I go or who I visit, your store sounds interesting, in my area I live at the suburbs of Philly, I miss the kind of stores yours sounds like, we had high end Video and Audio shops once, they are all gone now, I know they were more expensive but at least you could try things out with no problem, the personel knew what they were talking about, unfortunatly we lost them all thanks to places like Bestbuy, CiruitCity etc. were most salespeople are nitwits when it comes to audio and video, not all but most.
Anyway, I'm done arguing with some here, nobody here is gonna change my mind and I don't want to change anybody's, read peoples experiances and make your own desicion, but Ry what kind of shop is yours, and what area if I am ask.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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10. January 2010 @ 12:30 |
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Originally posted by FredBun:
I've seen enough get dissaponted on that subject, and stop harping about my 25 friends,
Can't help it.
Your stance that 25 people have more weight than industry-wide, nationally reported sales numbers is, quite frankly, astonishing, obsessional and illogical.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. January 2010 @ 12:30
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10. January 2010 @ 12:47 |
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You didnt read everything on my posts did you, I don't go by spec's, I go by people, you relying on them is your downfall not mine.
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HDNow
Junior Member
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10. January 2010 @ 12:58 |
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Originally posted by FredBun:
You didnt read everything on my posts did you, I don't go by spec's, I go by people, you relying on them is your downfall not mine.
So by your logic, the home entertainment industry shouldn't rely on these DEG numbers since it will lead to their downfall.
Right, gotcha.
BTW, can you give me the names and phone numbers of these 25 friends so I can give them to the entertainment industry execs in case they want to consult them?
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Senior Member
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10. January 2010 @ 13:10 |
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HD now your getting childish, spare me please, save your keyboard and type for somebody else, your not gonna get me into some nitwit arguments.
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