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Sony expands its case against PS3 hackers
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The following comments relate to this news article:
article published on 7 February, 2011
PSX-Scene has revealed that Sony is expanding its lawsuit against PS3 hackers, moving on from just Geohot and adding well-known hackers Cantero, Peter, Bushing, Segher, hermesEOL, kmeaw, Waninkoko, grafchokolo, kakaroto to its list.
The company will subpoena a number of sites, like PSX-Scene, Twitter, Github, Slashdot and even YouTube, in an attempt to find the location of the defendants.
... [ read the full article ]
Please read the original article before posting your comments.
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xaznboitx
Senior Member
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7. February 2011 @ 21:39 |
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I think Sony doing this is because there will be no PS4 anytime soon... If that wasn't the case, then Sony would of go after the hackers that showing us how to hack the psp as well unless it's the same people that hacking the psp... Also the PS3 is bigger than the psp anyway ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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7. February 2011 @ 21:51 |
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Sony is doing this because they are of the mind that every PS3 ever sold still belongs to them. They are expanding their lawsuit because they realized that geohot is not a pirate, and they hope that at least one of the other hackers might be. They are doing it now because 3.60 will be released soon; and they don't want it getting hacked on 0-day. This is the only explanation for going after grafchokolo; because they already know that there will be blowback for going after someone who is working on OtherOS.
Presumably, they will try to use broken parts of US laws to go after foreign hackers that live under similar laws, but with different loop holes.
All these cases are actually a good thing in the long run...Sony is going to loose most of them, and set legal standards all over the world. With any luck, the blowback will be so severe that a few of the upper management will be forced to resign, and maybe someone with half a brain will take control.
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coorva
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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7. February 2011 @ 21:55 |
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i guess sony like to be at the bottom of console sales
#1 WII 1million sold
#2 DS 900.000 sold
#3 XBOX 800.000 sold
#4 APPLE IPOD 700.000 sold
#5 sony ???
microsoft after a ban wave |
Senior Member
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8. February 2011 @ 01:36 |
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Originally posted by coorva:
i guess sony like to be at the bottom of console sales
#1 WII 1million sold
#2 DS 900.000 sold
#3 XBOX 800.000 sold
#4 APPLE IPOD 700.000 sold
#5 sony ???
One of these things is not like the others...
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Member
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8. February 2011 @ 01:49 |
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I still don't understand why people glitch online I wish it was like live and ban them permanently.
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elbald90
Member
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8. February 2011 @ 03:35 |
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good luck going after the spanish guys , the spanish courts normally come down on the side of the hackers or at least they do so far
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xtago
Senior Member
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8. February 2011 @ 08:37 |
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It's because it allows people to pirate PS3 games.
It's the only real reason why all these people have hacked the PS3, you can say home brew all day long but the only stuff coming out allows games to be copied to the HD and then played or allow the signing of these back up programs so people can stay on the newest firmware currently.
You can be sued in any country or place, once the subpoena has been served then you have to turn up at that court, you can pass on turning up but the court case still goes ahead with or without you there.
The end result probably won't go in your favour as your not there to defend yourself.
So these guys in Spain etc will either get sued in Spain or the USA, if they end up with a jail term in the USA.
Then a world wide warrant can be issued and those people can be arrested and then goto court in the country they were arrested in then get hauled over to the USA to do their time.
So yeah living in another country doesn't mean much as the wheels of the legal system will still turn where ever you are.
The only thing is time, it might take a few years before people in other countries get brought to the USA but it'll happen if they have to serve time.
If they only get fined then they have to pay the fine don't pay it and it'll turn into a warrent which turns into jail time so the above will happen anyway as these people are probably kids.
who think it'll all goes away, when you do nothing about it, but it doesn't it stays and you become marked.
Someone who lives in Spin takes a holiday to the UK will get arrested and the same deal in many countries.
That what these people don't understand it never goes away until you deal with it.
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Mysttic
Senior Member
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8. February 2011 @ 08:46 |
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It isn't like the other companies didn't try the same at one point or another; just not to this extent. Yea it will blow up on Sony's face, and no upper management will not change, because fighting piracy is a universal management agreement and Sony has the financial backing to take this fight for a while.
What people should understand is eventually the costs of said legal battles go back to consumers, the money just doesn't leave Sony's pocket for legal fees and they just let it go without claiming it back. They'll incorporate the costs into their TVs, consoles, software, laptops, songs and more.
When is enough, enough? Never. This will always happen every generation and I now lost my train of thought as my daughter is bopping on the couch to the sounds of the TV while sleeping....
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xaznboitx
Senior Member
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8. February 2011 @ 12:20 |
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G4tv Geo says that the hack doesn't allow pirated but only allow homebrew lol
check out PSX-Scene the comment about it... youtube blocked the video though
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lissenup2
Suspended permanently
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8. February 2011 @ 16:26 |
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Originally posted by xaznboitx:
I think Sony doing this is because there will be no PS4 anytime soon... If that wasn't the case, then Sony would of go after the hackers that showing us how to hack the psp as well unless it's the same people that hacking the psp... Also the PS3 is bigger than the psp anyway ;)
Duh. Of course there's going to be no PS4 anytime soon but that's not WHY they're doing this.
As for those not in the U.S.....................HA HA HA. Good F'ing luck Sony. They're pissin' on your name, your intellectual rights, your IP, your copyrights and sometimes your equipment I'm sure. Not a damn thing Sony can do, especially when they're in countries like Taiwan, Thailand, the Middle East, Asia, etc.
The consumer bought the PS3 and can do with it what they want. You're only case is against the dissemination of stolen game code.
I'll be following this.
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brockie
Member
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8. February 2011 @ 19:00 |
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Sony is having great sales at the moment coorva what you talking about? hope they do there best to stop it.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. February 2011 @ 19:01
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xnonsuchx
Senior Member
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8. February 2011 @ 21:57 |
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Originally posted by elbald90:
good luck going after the spanish guys , the spanish courts normally come down on the side of the hackers or at least they do so far
Spanish courts say end-users own their products and can do what they want with them...they haven't really said that hackers can do anything they want.
Originally posted by xaznboitx:
G4tv Geo says that the hack doesn't allow pirated but only allow homebrew lol
However, if hacks themselves contain copyrighted code, distributing it would still violate copyright laws. Hack tools that just modify/patch a few spots in an existing file can be legal, but any full releases of CFW are illegal. Not sure if Geohot's is pure 'patch' or more!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. February 2011 @ 21:57
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16 product reviews
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8. February 2011 @ 21:59 |
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Originally posted by Deadrum33:
Originally posted by coorva:
i guess sony like to be at the bottom of console sales
#1 WII 1million sold
#2 DS 900.000 sold
#3 XBOX 800.000 sold
#4 APPLE IPOD 700.000 sold
#5 sony ???
One of these things is not like the others...
Originally posted by brockie:
Sony is having great sales at the moment coorva what you talking about? hope they do there best to stop it.
While some of the previous comments are off topic and so will mine be in response to oorva's original comment, it has to be said/clarified that the PS3 has outsold the 360 YoY and 2010 was no different (by over 2 Million too, not just a small amount). It is still the most expensive console being sold while the 360 has had it's old stock of original design sold at a discount last year with the introduction of the 360s PLUS the information of it having a $500 Million dollar advertising campaign for Kinect/360s. And yet the PS3 is only about 3 Million behind. So yes you are "right" the PS3 is at the "bottom"; but if you want to be that technical we can break it down to things like PlayStation Products within the household are #1 or Market Share for the 360 & Wii is continually losing ground YoY and etc...
2011 will see the PS3 pass the 360 in total sales easily, with more exclusives, more variety & an almost definite price drop by the next holiday (though I believe it will/would have still outsold the 360 without said price drop) things will be very different quite soon. Additionally if you want to delve deeper then you have to look at attachment rates and the PS3 is neck and neck with the 360 which kind of shows a discrepancy flag as to how many working 360's are actually really out there. Either way at this point it is kind of mute because the difference of 3 Million is nothing like the original 10+ Million it was like when the PS3 launched and it's nothing most people who know the truth don't already know.
On topic blending what I just talked about and the hack in discussion it is a double edged sword in that it may spur additional sales at the cost of losing revenue in different streams (i.e. console profit & game sales profit for devs which is not good for ALL gamers). But will increase overall total sales which is nothing that the 360 or Wii aren't already going through. I guess we'll see as time moves on.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 8. February 2011 @ 22:04
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lissenup2
Suspended permanently
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11. February 2011 @ 00:46 |
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Originally posted by Oner:
Originally posted by Deadrum33:
Originally posted by coorva:
i guess sony like to be at the bottom of console sales
#1 WII 1million sold
#2 DS 900.000 sold
#3 XBOX 800.000 sold
#4 APPLE IPOD 700.000 sold
#5 sony ???
One of these things is not like the others...
Originally posted by brockie:
Sony is having great sales at the moment coorva what you talking about? hope they do there best to stop it.
While some of the previous comments are off topic and so will mine be in response to oorva's original comment, it has to be said/clarified that the PS3 has outsold the 360 YoY and 2010 was no different (by over 2 Million too, not just a small amount). It is still the most expensive console being sold while the 360 has had it's old stock of original design sold at a discount last year with the introduction of the 360s PLUS the information of it having a $500 Million dollar advertising campaign for Kinect/360s. And yet the PS3 is only about 3 Million behind. So yes you are "right" the PS3 is at the "bottom"; but if you want to be that technical we can break it down to things like PlayStation Products within the household are #1 or Market Share for the 360 & Wii is continually losing ground YoY and etc...
2011 will see the PS3 pass the 360 in total sales easily, with more exclusives, more variety & an almost definite price drop by the next holiday (though I believe it will/would have still outsold the 360 without said price drop) things will be very different quite soon. Additionally if you want to delve deeper then you have to look at attachment rates and the PS3 is neck and neck with the 360 which kind of shows a discrepancy flag as to how many working 360's are actually really out there. Either way at this point it is kind of mute because the difference of 3 Million is nothing like the original 10+ Million it was like when the PS3 launched and it's nothing most people who know the truth don't already know.
On topic blending what I just talked about and the hack in discussion it is a double edged sword in that it may spur additional sales at the cost of losing revenue in different streams (i.e. console profit & game sales profit for devs which is not good for ALL gamers). But will increase overall total sales which is nothing that the 360 or Wii aren't already going through. I guess we'll see as time moves on.
I am only commenting on the sales of PS3 vs XBox 360. After much research and looking, I have only found that Xbox 360 still has a noteworthy amount of a lead on PS3 in total sales. Though you mentioned YoY but that's understandable because of the delay they had as opposed to XBox 360.
I haven't seen anything what-so-ever indicating that PS3 has outsold the 360 to date but have found many to the contrary.
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TrinUK
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 07:21 |
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Forget PS3 sales. The machine is over hyped and a failure. I spent a lot of money on it hoping for great things and I wish I hadn't bothered. Blu ray players are so cheap now so it really doesn't justify the price for a PS3.
The Xbox 360 is a better machine only let down by the RROD saga. I think if MS get it right in the next console without any hardware problems, Sony may be in big trouble.
The same happened with Sega when they failed to deliver on the Saturn. I have a feeling the console wars will draw to a close in the not too distant future as game sales have declined(lack of ideas) and the market is very stale.
Trin - Making Digital Waves
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Senior Member
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11. February 2011 @ 09:24 |
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Originally posted by xtago:
It's because it allows people to pirate PS3 games.
It's the only real reason why all these people have hacked the PS3, you can say home brew all day long but the only stuff coming out allows games to be copied to the HD and then played or allow the signing of these back up programs so people can stay on the newest firmware currently.
You can be sued in any country or place, once the subpoena has been served then you have to turn up at that court, you can pass on turning up but the court case still goes ahead with or without you there.
The end result probably won't go in your favour as your not there to defend yourself.
So these guys in Spain etc will either get sued in Spain or the USA, if they end up with a jail term in the USA.
Then a world wide warrant can be issued and those people can be arrested and then goto court in the country they were arrested in then get hauled over to the USA to do their time.
So yeah living in another country doesn't mean much as the wheels of the legal system will still turn where ever you are.
The only thing is time, it might take a few years before people in other countries get brought to the USA but it'll happen if they have to serve time.
If they only get fined then they have to pay the fine don't pay it and it'll turn into a warrent which turns into jail time so the above will happen anyway as these people are probably kids.
who think it'll all goes away, when you do nothing about it, but it doesn't it stays and you become marked.
Someone who lives in Spin takes a holiday to the UK will get arrested and the same deal in many countries.
That what these people don't understand it never goes away until you deal with it.
I'm not sure all that applies to a civil suit... internationally speaking.
Its a lot easier being righteous than right.
DSE VZ300-
Zilog Z80 CPU, 32KB RAM (16K+16K cartridge), video processor 6847, 2KB video RAM, 16 colours (text mode), 5.25" FDD
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Gnawnivek
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 10:16 |
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Originally posted by TrinUK:
Forget PS3 sales. The machine is over hyped and a failure. I spent a lot of money on it hoping for great things and I wish I hadn't bothered. Blu ray players are so cheap now so it really doesn't justify the price for a PS3.
The Xbox 360 is a better machine only let down by the RROD saga. I think if MS get it right in the next console without any hardware problems, Sony may be in big trouble.
The same happened with Sega when they failed to deliver on the Saturn. I have a feeling the console wars will draw to a close in the not too distant future as game sales have declined(lack of ideas) and the market is very stale.
Wow, just because you bought the PS3 at launch price ($600, that's what your comment sounded like), it doesn't mean the console is a hyped failure. Where have you been since the PS3's launch? The BD players are cheaper now, so does the PS3 price :)
The Xbox is the Xbox, saying if MS don't have RRoD problem, it probably kill the PS3 is like saying if Nintendo had gone with Sony's disc idea it would have killed the PS1. It's silly... Let there be competition, it's good for the consumers. Do I want to see MS fail? No! Do I want to see Sony fail? No! I don't want to see PC or Nintendo gaming fail either. I like choices, brand loyalty is just plain stupidity that stretch beyond infinity.
I root for hackers too, but for their intelligence, determination and curiosity, not for their arrogance, immaturity and cowardice.
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TrinUK
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 10:38 |
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Originally posted by Gnawnivek:
Originally posted by TrinUK:
Forget PS3 sales. The machine is over hyped and a failure. I spent a lot of money on it hoping for great things and I wish I hadn't bothered. Blu ray players are so cheap now so it really doesn't justify the price for a PS3.
The Xbox 360 is a better machine only let down by the RROD saga. I think if MS get it right in the next console without any hardware problems, Sony may be in big trouble.
The same happened with Sega when they failed to deliver on the Saturn. I have a feeling the console wars will draw to a close in the not too distant future as game sales have declined(lack of ideas) and the market is very stale.
Wow, just because you bought the PS3 at launch price ($600, that's what your comment sounded like), it doesn't mean the console is a hyped failure. Where have you been since the PS3's launch? The BD players are cheaper now, so does the PS3 price :)
The Xbox is the Xbox, saying if MS don't have RRoD problem, it probably kill the PS3 is like saying if Nintendo had gone with Sony's disc idea it would have killed the PS1. It's silly... Let there be competition, it's good for the consumers. Do I want to see MS fail? No! Do I want to see Sony fail? No! I don't want to see PC or Nintendo gaming fail either. I like choices, brand loyalty is just plain stupidity that stretch beyond infinity.
I root for hackers too, but for their intelligence, determination and curiosity, not for their arrogance, immaturity and cowardice.
I agree on the competition and you used the right word.
Now that is exactly where the problem lies, there is NO competition in the console market because software houses are launching the same games on each machine. So by doing this, they have become lazy and complacent.
I have to say although the PS3 and Xbox360 have advanced hardware and excellent graphics, I am pleased with Nintendo overall. Simply because they came out with an original console and software even though it may be a little primitive. On the plus side, At least i get to experience the positives of all 3 machines :)
Trin - Making Digital Waves
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Gnawnivek
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 10:54 |
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Originally posted by TrinUK:
I agree on the competition and you used the right word.
Now that is exactly where the problem lies, there is NO competition in the console market because software houses are launching the same games on each machine. So by doing this, they have become lazy and complacent.
I disagree... If you look at the exclusive titles for each consoles, there's a lot of competition going on. If you're talking about multi-platform games, then yeah, plenty of laziness...
If Xbox is showing off Gears of War, PS3 counter with Uncharted... The console is also pushed by exclusive titles, this is why Nintendo is popular, not because the Wii is innovative. For those of us really appreciate games, multiple consoles are the key drivers to innovation.
Peace!
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TrinUK
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 10:58 |
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Originally posted by Gnawnivek:
Originally posted by TrinUK:
I agree on the competition and you used the right word.
Now that is exactly where the problem lies, there is NO competition in the console market because software houses are launching the same games on each machine. So by doing this, they have become lazy and complacent.
I disagree... If you look at the exclusive titles for each consoles, there's a lot of competition going on. If you're talking about multi-platform games, then yeah, plenty of laziness...
If Xbox is showing off Gears of War, PS3 counter with Uncharted... The console is also pushed by exclusive titles, this is why Nintendo is popular, not because the Wii is innovative. For those of us really appreciate games, multiple consoles are the key drivers to innovation.
You've got to be joking???? Sega vs Nintendo. That my friend is competition and exclusivity. Enough said.
Trin - Making Digital Waves
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Gnawnivek
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 11:27 |
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Why is that every game discussions always end up with Saga vs. Nintendo, or that's the real competition or that's the real exclusivity? That's the past, stop dwelling on the past... It's like saying, yo man, did you see those caveman's drawings? That's the real stuff, that's exclusivity, there's no other competitions like this. What the hell that even mean?!?! It's like trying to tell today's kids how great the walkman was or those portable CD players... Enough said what? That the floppy disks are awesome? The 486s are totally rad? If you like so much, invent a time machine and stay there then.
I appreciate the past, because w/o it, there's no present. But come on, seriously, what does any of that has to do with the competition of the consoles TODAY?!?! It's like Sony whispering to MS, "Nintendo is gonna be ambushed by Sega, you just watch, the old war is not over" And MS giggles... It's ridiculous.
I hate those people label everything with CLASSIC. It's a classic man, don't you appreciate classics? What the hell does that even mean?!?! Okay, I get it, it's a classic argument, a classic returning/recurring statement. Well, I tell you what's classic is about, it's about things I want to forget, but some old farts always blabbering about them and I just don't want to hurt their feelings.
Peace!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. February 2011 @ 11:28
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TrinUK
Member
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11. February 2011 @ 11:38 |
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Not dwelling on the past but stating a fact. You claimed there is an abundance of exclusive titles for each consoles when clearly this is not the case and it is a fact that gaming sales have dropped for that very reason. People are bored with shooters and war game sequels and kids cannot play those games either!
This is why parents opted for the Wii.
I mentioned Sega vs Nintendo because I collect consoles as a hobby. From personal experience and others will agree that those times were the most exciting for video gaming while on the home computer side it was Commodore vs Atari. The next gens are not in the same class in that aspect. Boring as hell.... Hardware don't mean jack because technically they are pretty close. it's the software that makes the differences. And for 2011.... Another line up of shooters
Trin - Making Digital Waves
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16 product reviews
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11. February 2011 @ 12:57 |
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Originally posted by lissenup2:
I am only commenting on the sales of PS3 vs XBox 360. After much research and looking, I have only found that Xbox 360 still has a noteworthy amount of a lead on PS3 in total sales. Though you mentioned YoY but that's understandable because of the delay they had as opposed to XBox 360.
I haven't seen anything what-so-ever indicating that PS3 has outsold the 360 to date but have found many to the contrary.
3 Million is not "a noteworthy amount of a lead". The Wii is the only console that can actually say that. But I don't see what is so hard to grasp as the PS3 YoY has sold more vs the 360. It's quite simple actually ~ 360 5 years = +/- 10 Million a year vs PS3 4 years = +/- 12 Million year, when you average it out.
Even when you don't average it and go by their exact sold numbers the PS3 still outsold it YoY. The only reasons why the 360 has a higher total amount sold is because of the year head start (up to 1.5 year in the EU for a total of about 10+ Million at the start) & the RROD/E74 + Banning Repurchases throughout the 5 years. Also it was not so much of a "delay" (as you say towards Sony) but more so Microsoft rushing out a poorly designed console to get to market ahead of Sony at an attempt to gain market share (or by also using planned obsolescence possibly).
But these are already known & common things after 5 years already.
Originally posted by Gnawnivek:
Originally posted by TrinUK:
I agree on the competition and you used the right word.
Now that is exactly where the problem lies, there is NO competition in the console market because software houses are launching the same games on each machine. So by doing this, they have become lazy and complacent.
I disagree... If you look at the exclusive titles for each consoles, there's a lot of competition going on. If you're talking about multi-platform games, then yeah, plenty of laziness...
If Xbox is showing off Gears of War, PS3 counter with Uncharted... The console is also pushed by exclusive titles, this is why Nintendo is popular, not because the Wii is innovative. For those of us really appreciate games, multiple consoles are the key drivers to innovation.
This is correct. There is no comparison when it comes to exclusives & dev support on the PS3 & Wii vs the 360. Sony (20+) & Ninty (I think 10+) have more inhouse & exclusive devs making a variety of games/genres while MS has I believe 3...3 exclusive inhouse devs. They rely on 3rd party multiplatform games which doesn't exactly help with variety and when they do get an exclusive it is usually a timed one.
Originally posted by TrinUK:
You claimed there is an abundance of exclusive titles for each consoles when clearly this is not the case and it is a fact that gaming sales have dropped for that very reason. People are bored with shooters and war game sequels and kids cannot play those games either!....And for 2011.... Another line up of shooters
Gnawnivek's claim about an abundance of exclusives is based on fact. If you don't see them that does not make it true. I can sorta agree there are people who are bored with shooters but it must be from the 360 side more than the PS3/Wii camps because as I just explained above there are WAAAAY more devs making WAAAAY more varied games for the PS3/Wii than the 360. As for game sequels there is no greater than Mario but people don't really tire of that now do they? But that is neither here nor there I guess.
I do agree there is a HUGE amount of shooters this year but I think it just happened to work out that way not purposely planned or designed by Activision, EA, Epic, Crytek, Guerilla Games, Naughty Dog, Insomniac & who ever else. This year looks to be the year of the "3" ~ Killzone 3, Gears 3, Uncharted 3, Resistance 3...and while these are all sequels they are great franchises with enthralling story lines and exciting gameplay that have quite a following so if certain people aren't in to them no big deal right? They can just buy/play something else of interest that is available!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. February 2011 @ 13:33
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ps355528
Senior Member
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11. February 2011 @ 13:46 |
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never mind the rest of the edited for content that violates forum rules.. you bought the edited for content that violates forum rules thing... you paid for it.,.. who the edited for content that violates forum rules does it belong to.. them or you?
take it to court and throw it at the bastards.. minimum there is assault.. they can't prosecute you for taking it outside and hitting it with a hammer (yet) ..
and this is soooooo edited for content that violates forum rules funny.. swallow edited for content that violates forum rules and buy their products.. get screwed over.. edited for content that violates forum rules!!!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. February 2011 @ 14:06
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16 product reviews
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11. February 2011 @ 14:04 |
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Originally posted by ps355528:
never mind the rest of the edited for content that violates forum rules.. you bought the edited for content that violates forum rules thing... you paid for it.,.. who the edited for content that violates forum rules does it belong to.. them or you?
take it to court and throw it at the bastards.. minimum there is assault.. they can't prosecute you for taking it outside and hitting it with a hammer (yet) ..
and this is soooooo edited for content that violates forum rules funny.. swallow edited for content that violates forum rules and buy their products.. get screwed over.. edited for content that violates forum rules!!!
If you can't watch your language your account will be removed.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. February 2011 @ 14:07
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