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PS3 Emulation
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Member
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11. June 2006 @ 22:22 |
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Tell me if this would work please. This is somewhat hypothetical but in the range of "it could happen". I'll go with AMD because i think they are best gaming processors.
AMD 64 Bit FX Dual Core Processor running at 3.4 each w/Hypertransport
4 GB Ram
1 TB 7200 RPM Harddrive
ATI Radeon® X1900
And if they do get multi-core products out then it would greatly improve the possibility of it soon.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. June 2006 @ 21:21
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lamarmp4
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12. June 2006 @ 00:28 |
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i think if you want to the ps3 game have the best effect, maybe need 4Ghz p4CPU, 2G DDR Ram
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. June 2006 @ 00:30
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. June 2006 @ 09:35 |
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noobs, if u want a processor with power scratch the effing p4 for gods sake, it sucks hairy nutzz. take and amd athlon 64 x2 toledo 2.4 ghz to see some godly power. the convertion between any athlon and any p4 counterpart is 2x the ghz, meaning you would need a dual cored 4.8 ghz p4 to come close to the power of that processor. couple that with 2 7900gtx's in sli on a dfi lanpary and 4 gigs of mushkin xp4000 redline then you could emulate.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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legacypS3
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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12. June 2006 @ 10:00 |
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can someone tell me what those small strip things in my sigantures are called?
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KainX
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12. June 2006 @ 11:11 |
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anubis thats wrong,
ps2 has about 300 mhz with a 32mb equivalent video card, how much power does it take to emulate a ps2, exactky
the cell has a powerpc with 7 spe's how are you going to emulate them with only a dual core 4.5 ghz processor, even if it is an amd
it takes a pc with nearly 3 times as much power as the xbox that has 733 mhz and a 64mb equivalent video card to emulate it
unless there is a breathrough processor made by intel or amd in the next year, don't expect a good non <10 fps emulator
it takes years to develop working (good) emululators, in about 7 months you should repost this with diagrams on the ps3 software and hardware,even though you probably won't be able to obtain them
currently have these consoles
Gamecube
Xbox
Ps2
Dreamcast
Phantom
Gba
psp
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. June 2006 @ 11:13
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Member
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12. June 2006 @ 13:42 |
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correct me if i'm wrong but...
ps3=3x 3.2ghz cpu's
512mbram combined
512mb gpu??? cutom,probably around 512,maybe 1028???lol yeah that be great...
so your pc would have to have theese specs:
cpu: 20ghz cpu minimum...
ram 6-10Gb
gpu like geforce 9 or something like 4gb ram onboard for the gpu
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chasmoor
Newbie
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12. June 2006 @ 17:13 |
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Quote:
ps2 has about 300 mhz with a 32mb equivalent video card, how much power does it take to emulate a ps2, exactky
OK. Back in 1990 or so, I was writing emulators for the Intel 8051 and Zilog Z80, hosted on PC's of the day: 33 MHz 80386's and the like.
Good rule of thumb if you want cycle accuracy and the architectures are similar you need about a 10 to 1 clock rate advantage. If the architectures are different (i.e. MIPS vs Intel), double that.
So minimum to emulate just the EE core (i.e. the Mips 5900 running at 300 MHz) on any Intel / AMD procssor would be about 6 GHz.
However, when the rubber hits the road, that hypothetical 6 GHz processor will keel over and die. There's a ****-load of other stuff in the PS2:
VU0 - 300 MHz 4 wide SIMD copro for the EE core
VIF0 - Data manipulator that feeds VU0
VU1 - Another 300 MHz 4 wide SIMD unit, feeds the GS most of the time
VIF1 - VU1's answer to VIF0
GIF - 3 into 1 data arbitrator that feeds the GS
GS - Strange beast this. Not much memory, ****-poor pixel shading, but it has fill rate that'll make your head spin.
DMA - 9 channel DMA engine with quite a complex scatter-gather equivalent: gif tags / call ret et al.
IOP - that's the PS1 hidden in the PS2 (minus the GTE).
Just to add insult to injury, a well crafted assembler inner loop on the PS2 can get dual issue about 75% of the time (or more), yeilding an effective clock speed just over 500 MHz.
Now, exactly how much CPU horsepower were we going to need to emulate this?
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. June 2006 @ 22:49 |
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i dont know considering my friend emulated his 360 games on his computer with ease. he has a 7600 and a 3ghz p4. he played call of duty 2 at 60 fps.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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dblbogey7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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13. June 2006 @ 04:02 |
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anubis:
He was probably playing the PC version of the game. His specs can easily run the PC version at 60fps.
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 07:57 |
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no, he was running the 360 version. shall i try to get ahold of him for you all?
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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dblbogey7
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13. June 2006 @ 08:51 |
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anubis:
Yep - ask him what 360 emulator he used.
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 11:05 |
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alright, havnt talked to him in months but i just sent him an email. hopefully he'll reply.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 11:21 |
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well that was fast. i found out he got ahold of the emulator used on the powermacs g5's at e3 and he played it on his mac not his pc. ahaha issnt that funny how microsoft used a macintosh to show off the 360 since pc's suck in comparison for many things, plus the 360 has a macintosh processor in it. did you know ms's main headquarters use almost all imacs?
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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dblbogey7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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13. June 2006 @ 11:32 |
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anubis:
Somehow I find everything you claim about this emulator hard to believe.
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 11:35 |
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But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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dblbogey7
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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13. June 2006 @ 11:41 |
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Stiull sounds fishy that your friend has 2 power macs powering the emulator. I just don't trust anything you say in these forums anubis. I don't know but you sound untrustworthy.
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Member
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13. June 2006 @ 11:43 |
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Quote:
the cell has a powerpc with 7 spe's how are you going to emulate them with only a dual core 4.5 ghz processor, even if it is an amd
it takes a pc with nearly 3 times as much power as the xbox that has 733 mhz and a 64mb equivalent video card to emulate it
unless there is a breathrough processor made by intel or amd in the next year, don't expect a good non <10 fps emulator
AMD is coming out with multicore processors in 2007 so we will probably have to wait till at least mid-2007 to see a computer do a decent job of it.
Quote:
cpu: 20ghz cpu minimum...
ram 6-10Gb
gpu like geforce 9 or something like 4gb ram onboard for the gpu
That would be amazing
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 11:47 |
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that breakthru processor you are asking for might just be intels new conroe.
and he has 1 g5 purchased from craigslist.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. June 2006 @ 11:48
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chasmoor
Newbie
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13. June 2006 @ 14:32 |
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i found out he got ahold of the emulator used on the powermacs g5's at e3 and he played it on his mac
Well duh. No wonder it can run Xbox 360 stuff no sweat. Guess what CPU is in the 360. PowerPC. Guess what CPU in the G5. PowerPC.
It's the same damn cpu, so it can run the binary directly, with little to no mods. That simply isn't the case running PS2 stuff on a PC, because guess what. Intel and MIPS are DIFFERENT.
Get that 360 emulator running on anything other than a PowerPC system, and you have something to talk about. Other than that, you're just making a lot of noise.
While you're at it. Put your money where your mouth is, and post some links to stuff. There's quite a flock of PS2 emulators out there that the world knows of:
http://www.emulator-zone.com/doc.php/ps2/
http://www.emuxhaven.net/ps2.shtml
plus whatever Sony are doing for PS3:
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/711/711242p1.html
Surprise surprise, NONE of the "public" ones can play a commercial game yet, and if the rumors flying are anything to go by, even the big 'S' are having trouble.
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boli06
Newbie
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13. June 2006 @ 18:18 |
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The Xbox 360 dev kit were actually PowerMac G5
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Member
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13. June 2006 @ 21:18 |
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Quote:
Other than that, you're just making a lot of noise
Seems like you're doing alot of that. This forum is for speculation purposes so forgive us if we actually do speculate on what an Intel or Amd system would have to be to emulate it.
Anyways, surely i would go with an AMD processor over an Intel if I were going to emulate a Ps3. Just look at benchmarks. Amd is better than Intel in almost every category. Especially gaming.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. June 2006 @ 21:19
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. June 2006 @ 22:17 |
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but sully have you heard of the conroe core 65nm from intell, its supposed to dominate all current amd's and with the overclock potential to rival anything out there, it will take the lead with easy.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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KainX
Suspended permanently
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13. June 2006 @ 23:46 |
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i can't beleive it man a 360 emulator
i want one
come on man, you can't even emulate ps2 at about 35fps (60 is needed)
but architecture wise amd is closeer in its architecture to ps2 unlike intel, who use more business oriented chips but its still imposible to emulate the next gen genereation of consoles consoles so far
the conroes look good but i dought heviliy they will get ahead of amd's best x2's
currently have these consoles
Gamecube
Xbox
Ps2
Dreamcast
Phantom
Gba
psp
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. June 2006 @ 00:01
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chasmoor
Newbie
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14. June 2006 @ 17:19 |
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This forum is for speculation purposes so forgive us if we actually do speculate on what an Intel or Amd system would have to be to emulate it.
Take a look at my post where I give a list of the HW inside the PS2. Or look at these articles:
http://www.technology.scee.net/files/presentations/gdw2003/Introd...
http://arstechnica.com/reviews/hardware/ee.ars/1
http://arstechnica.com/articles/paedia/cpu/ps2vspc.ars/1
Something interesting that comes out of these (that I did not know), is that the VU's are "LIW" (*) meaning they execute two instructions per tick. The "upper" floating point SIMD instruction, and a "lower" integer / load store instruction. So think of them as being clocked at an effective 600 MHz. Good for the PS2, bad for the emulator writers. :)
(*) long instruction word.
An incredibly interesting page for those that want to dig in and find out what the PS2 is all about is this one:
http://playstation2-linux.com/coding-on-playstation2.php
There's hints in there of documentation available about the PS2, something that every emulator writer ought to have.
But the bottom line is that if you just view the PS2 as a 300 MHz MIPS 5900, then emulating it on a PC is fairly trivial. However you also need to emulate all the other hardware in there to get a working solution, which is very likely the reason that all the third party emulators are "not emulating commercial games yet", and Sony are rumored to be looking at a hardware solution for PS3 launch.
Keeping all this in mind, combined with 5 to 10 years emulator writing experience, I'm going to speculate that you'd need about 4 to 6 cores worth of current top end CPU horsepower to get the job done. Two or three high end dual core AMD's might get you there. One won't. Period. And since I somehow doubt that Intel's Conroe will represent a 2 to 3 times speedup, it's not likely to make it on it's own either.
-- Edit --
P.S. NM Conroe. Woodcrest FTW. If I read the tech reviews correctly, you can't build a multi CPU Conroe system. You can, however, stick multiple Woodcrests in the same box. Extending the above:
A dual CPU Woodcrest system MIGHT do it, but it's gonna be stretched to the limit. I think a quad CPU Woodcrest server ought to put you in about the right ball park.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. June 2006 @ 17:59
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AfterDawn Addict
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14. June 2006 @ 17:26 |
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talk about a pwnage pc, geez. ill just get a ps3.
But they all do sort of the same thing, and that is rearrange what you thought was real, and they remind you of the beauty of very simple things. You forget, because youre so busy going from a to z, that theres 24 letters in between... You turn on... tune in... and you drop out...
PS3 Username: Anubis66
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