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The Official PC building thread - 4th Edition
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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15. March 2013 @ 11:49 |
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Thanks LP, I'll have to keep that in mind for the future. I got the Laptop all squared away, and back with the owner. She's quite happy :) I recommended her getting an SSD. She's FARRR from tech savvy though. I told her if it slows down, we'll talk down the road ;) The 2Gb of Ram is also a joke...
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! |
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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15. March 2013 @ 12:20 |
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Originally posted by Ripper:
Think I just bought the last Samsung 830 drive available in the UK online that isn't ridiculously priced. Come at me bro!
By ridiculously priced, isn't that because the 840 series has taken over?
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. March 2013 @ 12:21 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
Originally posted by Ripper:
Think I just bought the last Samsung 830 drive available in the UK online that isn't ridiculously priced. Come at me bro!
By ridiculously priced, isn't that because the 840 series has taken over?
Ridiculously priced due to demand because the 840 has succeeded it, yeah (and I think Samsung have stopped making it). Didn't fancy forking out for an 840 Pro.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. March 2013 @ 12:22
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Senior Member
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15. March 2013 @ 21:12 |
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Originally posted by omegaman7:
Thanks LP, I'll have to keep that in mind for the future. I got the Laptop all squared away, and back with the owner. She's quite happy :) I recommended her getting an SSD. She's FARRR from tech savvy though. I told her if it slows down, we'll talk down the road ;) The 2Gb of Ram is also a joke...
I personally won't put an SSD in a novices system as they can be flakey in operation and there are things a novice might do that would be bad for the SSD. SSD's aren't solid enough for everyone to use, at least I don't see it.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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16. March 2013 @ 00:15 |
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Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I personally won't put an SSD in a novices system as they can be flakey in operation and there are things a novice might do that would be bad for the SSD. SSD's aren't solid enough for everyone to use, at least I don't see it.
You make a valid point. That occurred to me when I built my moms system. But I figured I would teach myself first, before bringing everyone onboard ;)
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! |
Senior Member
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16. March 2013 @ 00:50 |
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Originally posted by omegaman7:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I personally won't put an SSD in a novices system as they can be flakey in operation and there are things a novice might do that would be bad for the SSD. SSD's aren't solid enough for everyone to use, at least I don't see it.
You make a valid point. That occurred to me when I built my moms system. But I figured I would teach myself first, before bringing everyone onboard ;)
On the contrary, a laptop is the best place for a novice to have an SSD. I've replaced quite few drives in laptops and common theme is people carry laptop around while still powered on and thrashing the fast-spinny moving parts. SSD=no moving parts so has a longer lifespan than regular drive. Turn off disk defrag, and then a novice cant hurt it. How many novices actually use defrag or disk cleanup anyway?
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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16. March 2013 @ 00:53 |
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Thank you for mentioning that!!! I grabbed the laptop while it was still shutting down. I accidentally gripped the area where the hard drive is. Oops!!! Needless to say, there was a slight grinding sound. I warned her about doing that. Since that is likely what happened to the last one ;)
SSD's are indeed an ideal technology for laptops. Low watts, and far more invulnerable. Well, perhaps not THAT invincible LOL!
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! |
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16. March 2013 @ 01:43 |
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Originally posted by Deadrum33:
Originally posted by omegaman7:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I personally won't put an SSD in a novices system as they can be flakey in operation and there are things a novice might do that would be bad for the SSD. SSD's aren't solid enough for everyone to use, at least I don't see it.
You make a valid point. That occurred to me when I built my moms system. But I figured I would teach myself first, before bringing everyone onboard ;)
On the contrary, a laptop is the best place for a novice to have an SSD. I've replaced quite few drives in laptops and common theme is people carry laptop around while still powered on and thrashing the fast-spinny moving parts. SSD=no moving parts so has a longer lifespan than regular drive. Turn off disk defrag, and then a novice cant hurt it. How many novices actually use defrag or disk cleanup anyway?
I would disagree, in fact I've had boot issues with laptops and SSD's and still there are things a novice can do to screw things up. Disk defrag isn't the only thing, maybe they run benchmarks or some other tool that does repetitive writes. Maybe they install software that enables auto defrag or even turn it back on after you disable it. There are too many bad scenarios....
I wouldn't do it, if you would so be it but SSD's are fragile, period! And I think it's a bad call, I don't like to gamble myself unless I have too.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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16. March 2013 @ 02:30 |
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Most people I know, browse the web, and only that. The most they could accomplish, is inadvertently contracting a virus LOL! And why not have that super responsiveness, quick boot, etc? My Towers SSD has been going for months and months, without any intervention on my part :p Though I have been curious about the limited speed(66% of what it should be). And it IS plugged into a Sata III port.(That 66% smokes my velociraptor by the way)
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I wouldn't do it, if you would so be it but SSD's are fragile, period! And I think it's a bad call, I don't like to gamble myself unless I have too.
I certainly don't wanna stick with mechanical indefinitely :S
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. March 2013 @ 02:34
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16. March 2013 @ 02:58 |
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I don't have a problem with that but still mechanical is more robust then SSD's are right now. And the argument isn't what you want to stick with down the road or better yet the fact that you know what you are doing. A hard drive will out last an SSD considerably and is less fragile. Some day when SSD's or whatever else they come up with will hold it's own with write cycles then it will be a great deal. They keep getting better but I certainly wouldn't even risk my own data solely on a SSD let alone someone who is computer illiterate. But that is my own slant like I said to Deadrum if you want to gamble that is your choice, it may work out fine, and then again maybe not.
If you think your mom or whoever would be worth the gamble if it was a case of their only use for the computer to browse the web then no biggy and is probably worth doing it.
As to Laptop or Desktop I really don't see the difference in usage, both can be used the same way and often are so if you think it's perfect for a Laptop there is no reason not to argue that the same point for a desktop computer.
At any rate I didn't mean for this to become an argument it was more of a cautionary point, you'll make the right decision for the situation I'm sure. Just make sure to turn off the ceiling fan before working on the notebook.... LOL :D Shame on me....... :P
If you are to go that route I would go with the Intel 840 series as it truly is more reliable and well worth the few bucks more, just my two centavo's.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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16. March 2013 @ 03:35 |
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I'll never hear the end of that blasted ceiling fan :p
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! |
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16. March 2013 @ 03:52 |
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Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I don't have a problem with that but still mechanical is more robust then SSD's are right now. And the argument isn't what you want to stick with down the road or better yet the fact that you know what you are doing. A hard drive will out last an SSD considerably and is less fragile. Some day when SSD's or whatever else they come up with will hold it's own with write cycles then it will be a great deal. They keep getting better but I certainly wouldn't even risk my own data solely on a SSD let alone someone who is computer illiterate. But that is my own slant like I said to Deadrum if you want to gamble that is your choice, it may work out fine, and then again maybe not.
If you think your mom or whoever would be worth the gamble if it was a case of their only use for the computer to browse the web then no biggy and is probably worth doing it.
As to Laptop or Desktop I really don't see the difference in usage, both can be used the same way and often are so if you think it's perfect for a Laptop there is no reason not to argue that the same point for a desktop computer.
At any rate I didn't mean for this to become an argument it was more of a cautionary point, you'll make the right decision for the situation I'm sure. Just make sure to turn off the ceiling fan before working on the notebook.... LOL :D Shame on me....... :P
If you are to go that route I would go with the Intel 840 series as it truly is more reliable and well worth the few bucks more, just my two centavo's.
Difference in usage=i cant recall picking up my desktop and walking around the house using it while powered on. There are physical, and environmental factors to think of not only computational. All things being equal, maybe mechanical drives can outlast an SSD, no denying that. Move the usage from desktop to laptop environment and all things are not equal anymore. "what if a novice does a write-heavy benchmark" most don't, this is why we use the term novice. And really, are we talking about something with an expected lifespan of 10 years reduced to 6 months? 6 weeks? No, nothing that drastic will happen to make you regret turning a laptop into a tablet w/o touchscreen.
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Senior Member
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16. March 2013 @ 14:04 |
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Most people don't move a notebook and use it while they move so no, they are used in the same manner. And as to spilling on them that happens to desktops as well as notebooks, with the same outcome. But even if they did it wouldn't make a difference unless there was a great impact. I build control consoles for the military, stationary devices, that were tested with great impact and needed to continue to keep working. In those units SSD's would have made life easier, However with shock isolation all was fine and the consoles would continue to work after of course a peak hiccup when the explosives ignited.
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ddp
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16. March 2013 @ 22:46 |
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Senior Member
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16. March 2013 @ 23:53 |
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Big boom actually on a lake with the console floating on a barge. The shot is about 30 feet (10 meters) away at its closest, so it is very close. We typically did 3 charges at different distances. The EMP is also impressive. I use to have video footage but I'm not sure where it is now.
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ddp
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17. March 2013 @ 00:15 |
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bummer!!! i like big booms!!!
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Senior Member
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17. March 2013 @ 10:36 |
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Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Most people don't move a notebook and use it while they move so no, they are used in the same manner. And as to spilling on them that happens to desktops as well as notebooks, with the same outcome. But even if they did it wouldn't make a difference unless there was a great impact. I build control consoles for the military, stationary devices, that were tested with great impact and needed to continue to keep working. In those units SSD's would have made life easier, However with shock isolation all was fine and the consoles would continue to work after of course a peak hiccup when the explosives ignited.
I think you give too much credit to the "average" user. 95% of users watch food shows on TV, find the recipe on their laptop, and walk it into the kitchen and try it themselves.
Or, its not inconceivable that someone would take a wireless device into the bathroom with them? How many people are rough with devices after a night of alcohol?
The original argument was, should it be in a novice's laptop. I don't think there is a problem with upgrading someone and telling them don't do anything stupid with the new toy. It might even alleviate some everyday problems. It might cause new, SSD-specific problems, but that falls under the category of telling them don't do anything stupid with the new toy.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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17. March 2013 @ 10:54 |
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There are too many other things to break in a laptop to unequivocally say using an SSD makes them foolproof, but from the situations I've had to deal with, hard disk failure due to dropping small distances is probably only second fiddle to liquid spills. Isolating the most shock-prone device in a laptop is definitely a good idea.
I've done nothing other than 'plug in and install windows' with my two 40GB Intel SSDs, and according to SSDlife they are both likely to last until around 2021-2022. That's arguably a lot longer than the rest of the systems they're stored in.
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AfterDawn Addict
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17. March 2013 @ 12:53 |
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Do any of you have a recommendation for a bootable CPU stress test (from USB)?
So far I've come across UltimateBootCD, stresslinux and Inquisitor but curious to see if anyone has a personal preference.
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Senior Member
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17. March 2013 @ 15:32 |
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I've had people drop there laptops while running and the HDD handled it fine however the flat panel did suffer severe damage. I have a friend that just spilled 100 proof Whiskey on his desktop computer but he got it shut off in time and cleaned up without issue, he is a knowledgeable user. I see the same crap done to desktops that is done to notebooks so I will hold on to the really no difference between the two. In fact laptops just like phones are made to take some impact and spillage. I do have a friend that just spilled coffee on their Dell notebook, sitting at a desk (stationary), and were too dumb to shut it down and clean it up, so they are screwed but their HDD is still good and they didn't lose any data.
SSD's are VERY limited in their write cycles, much, much more than a hard drive is. Plus like I said before you can have boot hiccups and other problems with SSD's and novice type people will encounter problems that a wise user won't. This is true in other areas as well like Anti-virus/Internet Security programs. I use minimal security and typically, all most never, do I have problems, but a novice with hard core security program will still get hit more often and worst then I do. Like I said before if you want to go that path so be it but I won't put an SSD in a computer illiterate persons computer whether it be a Laptop or a Desktop, it's a gamble in my opinion.
So enough on the notebook SSD argument now I would say, no reason to continue to repeat. I'm more than fine just leaving it to indifference.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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17. March 2013 @ 15:44 |
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Dropping a hard drive doesn't bother me so much, but the design of laptops are certainly flawed. I realized that when I gripped the thin plastic encasement, and caused the platter to grind. NOT good. Thankfully, mechanical drives in laptops are becoming more and more rare. If they wish to continue employing them, they should definitely make those areas more robust. But if they keep making laptops and notebooks more thin, I don't see how they could do it. Lest they use materials that are tougher, while also thin. Or at least flip the hard drive upside down from its current position!!! That would probably help at least.
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! |
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17. March 2013 @ 16:01 |
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I've never seen a notebook that was that fragile were handling it caused the HDD to grind. In fact I can squeeze a 2.5" HDD external and it won't grind. But that is my experience. I would also like to get away from mechanical devices too but not for less life and more fragile overall, which is a fact with SSD's
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ddp
Moderator
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17. March 2013 @ 17:11 |
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i think it was the optical drive that did the grinding not the hd as to much space between top\bottom of hd & top\bottom of laptop.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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17. March 2013 @ 17:35 |
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No disc in the optical drive. And I gripped the hard drive area :p
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17. March 2013 @ 21:56 |
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That would be a normal usage situation? LOL Never done that one, Yet! :D
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