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The Official PC building thread - 4th Edition
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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31. August 2013 @ 16:52 |
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A Core i3 CPU is fine for a relatively low-end machine given its price. On that sort of a budget you aren't likely to do any better. Of course, an i5 would be preferable, but really isn't justifiable on that sort of system as you'd have to compromise too much in other areas.
In this example you can see that the Core i3 2100 series does fairly well alongside lots of other more expensive CPUs, and certainly delivers an acceptable experience.
HP machines aren't too bad in the grand scheme of things prebuild-wise as they are at least partially customisable, whereas Dells really are completely bespoke apart from the disk drives. That said, I would say Dells are perhaps slightly better made. All prebuilt machines come with a load of useless junk out of the box these days, though HP's is particularly bad I'll admit.
That's a norwegian site, but all I did was grab a list of sites from searching for 'pc components norway' and a useful forum thread came up detailing half a dozen or so sites.
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Senior Member
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1. September 2013 @ 00:34 |
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I would go with the i5 or higher and it is justifiable. Even from Sam's benchmarks you can see the i5 is considerably stronger if you judge it from performance levels of each stronger platform.
If you're going to play Skyrim there will be other games like that you'll want to play down the road and you'll find the i3 won't live up to your standards, so go to the middle of the Intel pack. Why do I know this? I've had plenty of friends and foes that where in your exact position and 9 out of 10 times it became a problem and they upgraded to a better processor or with laptops were screwed and had to buy a new system.
I would never put a 16 year old in a weak or bottom of the barrel system, personally speaking, it never works out. Wisdom goes a long way...
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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1. September 2013 @ 02:17 |
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Yet another benchmark where the Phenom II X6's performance is not fairly represented at all. My CPU performs excellently in Splinter Cell blacklist. Certainly nowhere near what is shown there, overclock taken into account. I really don't believe Bulldozer is that much faster in the game, if faster at all.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388 |
Senior Member
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1. September 2013 @ 02:53 |
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That's the problem Jeff with bench marks and even specs for anything, they may not be accurate or tell the whole story. Too often they are misused and misrepresented. But they are a great MARKETING tool if you know what I mean....
I can't speak for new games and Intel vs. AMD and if there is a real noticeable difference, since I'm not doing any heavy gaming for the most part with PC's, but in the business world and and encoding I can.
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skydreamer
Newbie
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1. September 2013 @ 05:00 |
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Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
I would go with the i5 or higher and it is justifiable. Even from Sam's benchmarks you can see the i5 is considerably stronger if you judge it from performance levels of each stronger platform.
If you're going to play Skyrim there will be other games like that you'll want to play down the road and you'll find the i3 won't live up to your standards, so go to the middle of the Intel pack. Why do I know this? I've had plenty of friends and foes that where in your exact position and 9 out of 10 times it became a problem and they upgraded to a better processor or with laptops were screwed and had to buy a new system.
I would never put a 16 year old in a weak or bottom of the barrel system, personally speaking, it never works out. Wisdom goes a long way...
Why does it never work out?
Anyway I'd like to buy an i5, but my budget is really limited and I'm cutting where I can even with an i3.
Too bad I can't overclock it...
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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1. September 2013 @ 07:33 |
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Guys really, the i5 3450 (cheapest contemporary i5) is 1500K - adding almost 15% to his budget.
It's double the CPU, so to you and me it's worth the money, but on a build with this total budget, it doesn't really make sense.
For balance, here are some other graphs of recent titles:
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Senior Member
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1. September 2013 @ 10:45 |
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OK if the budget is so limited then don't even bother with Intel and smart up, go with an AMD solution and get more power for the money. It's simple!
Quote:
Why does it never work out?
Because you'll not be happy with your choice, the computer will run slow and you'll have wished that you got something more powerful for your money.
I've been doing this much longer then most and have more then plenty of experience in these exact situations. Unfortunately you may jump into something weak and think it will be just fine for you but, I guaranty you will probably regret that decision if you do.
Experience, I've built thousands & thousands of PC's, MAC's, and Servers... for commercial use as well as personal.
Stevo
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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2. September 2013 @ 05:44 |
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I'll mention that the AMD boards being used in the benchmarks Sam is showing are very outdated and are severely limiting the Phenom II's. A proper 990X board with DDR3 would make a difference. There are performance advantages on the newer boards. Part of the reason why I've been considering a 990. I'm still on 790 as well, though vastly updated. There are OCing advantages too, including cooler running Thubans that require less voltage.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. September 2013 @ 05:52
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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2. September 2013 @ 05:58 |
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Hmm, I'm sure they had a 990 board, will do some further reading on that one, because you're right, it would make a difference.
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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2. September 2013 @ 06:00 |
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Well they had to have a 990 for the Piledrivers and Bulldozers as anything older doesn't support them, so it might be what they are using for everything. Please do find out because it makes a drastic difference in my experience.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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2. September 2013 @ 06:08 |
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Yeah it turns out they're only using the 990 for FX series CPUs and the 785 for the Phenom IIs which explains the greater performance differences. From a testing standpoint though, a machine built with a P II would have had a board like that in at the time, so I can see why they do it - it makes comparisons between Phenoms and FX series CPUs inaccurate but we already know what the relationship there is anyway.
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skydreamer
Newbie
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2. September 2013 @ 10:53 |
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Would there be any specific amd cpu and motherboard you would recommend me for about the same price?
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Senior Member
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3. September 2013 @ 02:13 |
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Originally posted by skydreamer:
Would there be any specific amd cpu and motherboard you would recommend me for about the same price?
The most popular boards are the Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD3 for entry level plus the Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5 & Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD7 for more featured systems. For you the UD3 would be plenty fine and with a good AMD CPU you shouldn't have any regrets. If you were and intermediate or advanced builder then you might consider the UD5 or UD7, I have the UD7.
There are cheaper boards that you could use as well so if this doesn't fit your budget one of us could steer you in another direction.
If you are possibly going to transcode movies and TV series you should consider a quad core processor or higher as it will speed up you ripping extremely. Again we can help you with that too. For this situation the AMD FX-8350 8-Core AM3+ CPU would be perfect but if you want to save money or stay within your budget any Bulldozer quad core would be fine too.
Other places to save money and expand you system later when you have more money is to buy (1) 8GB RAM module instead of two 4GB RAM sticks. Or with the mainboard above you could buy just (1) 4GB sticks and fill the other (3) memory slots later as well. One issue with doing this is to make sure you get the same sticks when upgrading your RAM memory.
@Jeff
I agree with Sam's conclusion on the bechmark results and different MB's and fore sure motherboards make a difference with performance, it can be subtle or extreme depending.
Hope that helps you skydreamer,
Stevo
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. September 2013 @ 02:23
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 03:34 |
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FX-4300 then? It's within budget I imagine, and you do at least get the benefits of the Piledriver architecture.
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 07:03 |
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Nothing really all that wrong with Piledriver. Solid CPU regardless of my issues with it.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. September 2013 @ 07:03
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 07:04 |
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I wrote that simply because Steve mentioned 'Bulldozer quad' specifically, but obviously there are Piledriver 4-core CPUs as well, as far as I'm aware there's no issue with them other than anything affecting the entire FX-series (TDP etc.)
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 07:09 |
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Though Piledriver's TDP is infinitely more reasonable, being similar to a Phenom II X6. I would imagine a 4 core would be much better than my Thuban :)
I would be really interested to see a 4GHz X6 on a proper board duke it out with a Piledriver. Am quite fond of this CPU. The two extra cores make a noticeable difference in a wide variety of games.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. September 2013 @ 07:16
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 07:26 |
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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3. September 2013 @ 08:34 |
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Those benches are more like it Sam. In a brand neutral environment, most of today's higher-end CPUs are equal in practice. I see lots of people replacing Thubans for gaming, but discovering the lack of benefit or even a loss of performance in certain situations. Granted in a raw performance application, Intel is the king, but in something like gaming I'm just not seeing a practical difference if the CPUs are capable of minimum 60.
A great example, at the risk of putting word in someone's mouth, would be our late friend Russ who compared his Thuban very closely indeed with more than one OC'd FX CPU. IIRC he decided to put the Thuban back in as his OC'd quite well and far outstripped the FX's in many areas.
I will however, admit that in truly multi-threaded applications such as rendering, encoding, etc there is absolutely no choice at all. The 8350 is better. I eagerly await Steamroller. I guess I;m lucky so far in that most games still use 4 cores at max.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. September 2013 @ 08:46
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Senior Member
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3. September 2013 @ 16:27 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
I wrote that simply because Steve mentioned 'Bulldozer quad' specifically, but obviously there are Piledriver 4-core CPUs as well, as far as I'm aware there's no issue with them other than anything affecting the entire FX-series (TDP etc.)
Nope mine work just fine I only said that because he can save money but I would go with the Piledriver as well.
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skydreamer
Newbie
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3. September 2013 @ 17:03 |
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Thank you very much for your help guys, it was extremely appreciated.
In a few days I'll be able to finally buy the parts, at least I hope so haha.
And in case I'll screw up I'll come here for help again :P
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Senior Member
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3. September 2013 @ 22:18 |
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Originally posted by skydreamer:
Thank you very much for your help guys, it was extremely appreciated.
In a few days I'll be able to finally buy the parts, at least I hope so haha.
And in case I'll screw up I'll come here for help again :P
Our pleasure and it was nice of Sam to get you started with a good source to buy from.
Post to us exactly what you purchased with links if possible, should you have issues during build or post build.
When you put your CPU/Heat-sink and Memory sticks onto the motherboard make sure that you do so with the board mounted securely in the case or better yet on a flat ESD safe table e.i., like a kitchen table with a pad or the ESD bag that comes with the MB. With these items you will need to be careful since they are static sensitive so if the motherboard comes with a foam pad use it to sit the MB on while populating it. Try not to build on a carpet floor and before handling the MB/RAM/CPU discharge yourself by grounding yourself to the computer case first, then populate the MB. The issue here is you don't want to flex the board as the internal layers could get damaged and then you'll have real problems.
CPU Insertion
Also CPU's and their sockets have a keying system so make sure that the CPU is placed with the corner marks the same, you have 4 possible combinations that only 1 position will be correct. Don't force the CPU as you may bend pins and they are difficult to straighten if you do.
Do not over grease the CPU before attaching the heat-sink to it. Normally only a dime size amount of grease is needed to the center of the CPU. It shouldn't be a mountain of grease either.
RAM [memory stick(s)] Install
If you are putting one or two sticks in make sure to install them in the last 1 or 2 banks, slots 3 & 4 of the mother board or slots 2 & 4 if the boards bank set two for some board.
If you have questions during the build feel free to ask about anything you might have question(s) on. Since we spread the globe here someone should be able to answer relatively quick should you need help.
Good luck and may the force be with you, :D
Stevo
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Senior Member
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3. September 2013 @ 22:46 |
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Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Originally posted by skydreamer:
Thank you very much for your help guys, it was extremely appreciated.
In a few days I'll be able to finally buy the parts, at least I hope so haha.
And in case I'll screw up I'll come here for help again :P
Our pleasure and it was nice of Sam to get you started with a good source to buy from.
Post to us exactly what you purchased with links if possible, should you have issues during build or post build.
When you put your CPU/Heat-sink and Memory sticks onto the motherboard make sure that you do so with the board mounted securely in the case or better yet on a flat ESD safe table e.i., like a kitchen table with a pad or the ESD bag that comes with the MB. With these items you will need to be careful since they are static sensitive so if the motherboard comes with a foam pad use it to sit the MB on while populating it. Try not to build on a carpet floor and before handling the MB/RAM/CPU discharge yourself by grounding yourself to the computer case first, then populate the MB. The issue here is you don't want to flex the board as the internal layers could get damaged and then you'll have real problems.
CPU Insertion
Also CPU's and their sockets have a keying system so make sure that the CPU is placed with the corner marks the same, you have 4 possible combinations that only 1 position will be correct. Don't force the CPU as you may bend pins and they are difficult to straighten if you do.
Do not over grease the CPU before attaching the heat-sink to it. Normally only a dime size amount of grease is needed to the center of the CPU. It shouldn't be a mountain of grease either.
RAM [memory stick(s)] Install
If you are putting one or two sticks in make sure to install them in the last 1 or 2 banks, slots 3 & 4 of the mother board or slots 2 & 4 if the boards bank set two for some board.
If you have questions during the build feel free to ask about anything you might have question(s) on. Since we spread the globe here someone should be able to answer relatively quick should you need help.
Good luck and may the force be with you, :D
Stevo
LOL, I concur, and that's the name of that tune, you won't get better advise anywhere else.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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5. September 2013 @ 01:28 |
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Well, I'm certainly jealous! I have a building itch!!! The only upgrade I can currently afford, is upgrading my motherboard. Which isn't a bad thing really LOL! Leaves more money for other things. Certainly when considering a 6 Core CPU is nothing to sneer at ;) But is an AM3+ board really the right choice for me(owning a 1090t)? Considering my running it on a 790X(AM3) board, it's quite possible the upgrade could be justified. But what if steamroller releases within a year, and requires an AM4(+) board? Could I wait a year for it? Decisions, decisions LOL!
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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5. September 2013 @ 01:48 |
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There are certainly solid reasons to upgrade to a 990 board, but you make a strong point that Steamroller might require a platform change. However, it could also be backwards compatible much like BD/PD are with some 890X/FX boards.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. September 2013 @ 01:50
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