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Intel P4 vs AMD
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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25. January 2006 @ 14:07 |
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If you go to the web site you will note that the core contact to the heat sink was much smaller then. That was because they show pictures of Athlons and thoroughbreds which have very small cores in the center of the die, so a drop would be enough. If you went beyond that small center core then you might accidentally create a circuit between open contact points. The new AMD cores cover the entire die with a metal plate so you can cover it entirely with thermal paste which shold be Arctic Silver 5.
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brobear
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25. January 2006 @ 17:27 |
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You need to contact Arctic Silver and tell them about the flaw in their directions, so they can correct it. I wanted full coverage of the spreader plate for insurance, so the way I did it insured that. I'll continue as in the past. I can afford a bit more thermal compound as compared to a fried CPU. However, the picture of the newer Intel spreader looked identical to the spreader on my CPU which is a P4. The AS5 didn't go to the outer edge. Like I said, I prefer full coverage, so I use extra.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 25. January 2006 @ 17:31
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64026402
Senior Member
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25. January 2006 @ 17:52 |
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Use as much as you need. They'll make more.
I use plenty. Don't want any bare spots on the core.
Donald
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brobear
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25. January 2006 @ 19:31 |
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The guys at AS should give us free samples for that type of promotion. LOL Use it up, they'll make more. ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
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25. January 2006 @ 20:03 |
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Get them while they are hot!!! The Opteron 175 is now going for $514 (USD) at Newegg. This is the box version with cooler and 3 year warranty. Must be a sale as the CPU by itself with a 30 day exchange policy warranty is $514. They are in stock. Check it out at:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103584
I want one but it is going to have to wait. I am moving at the end of the month, closer to the train so what with deposits, etc. I just can't do it for a couple of weeks. Oh well, the Athlon64x2 4400+ is down to $466 so at least the prices are starting to come down. Saw a sale at Newegg yesterday for the XFX 7800GT/256DDR3 for $269 so they are coming down too
Happy Trails
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
 This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 25. January 2006 @ 20:11
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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26. January 2006 @ 02:44 |
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Theonejrs
The 939 opterons are being discontinued.
brobear, this is what they were talking about when they said drop.
Note the little core contact in the center, eveything eles is siliccon.
AMD continued to have that kind of core through to the Athlon Barton Cores and Intel until the end of the PIII (I don't know about the early P4's).
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 02:45
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 05:39 |
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Sophocles
Here's what they meant by a BB sized drop. The picture is the heat spreader on the back of a P4 and they mention the same process for the Athlon 64 with slightly more compound. I still prefer Donald's plan, use it all. LOL I like being sure the entire spreader is covered, same as you mentioned. ;)
___________________
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 05:42
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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26. January 2006 @ 06:08 |
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Oh yeah, don't get me started on applying thermal compound, that really ticked me off. I kept getting a bit out in a slither that proceeded to lean on the side of the CPU die and not stay on the die itself. Very frustrating. I do wonder whether i used enough as I can still push 60C in heavy load uses. But hey, the system reached 77.5 once with the stock heatsink (before I added more case fans and changed the case, but after I added the X800PRO and the RAM) so that's still about a 16C improvement.
939 may be a socket that's soon to be superceded but it'll be around for a long while yet, 754 hasn't gone yet and won't for a while, it's currently the Sempron64 platform. The only thing is that AM2 will be the only socket to support DDR2, which blows unless I get an AM2 system. If they're not out soon enough then I'll just have to settle without.
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 06:32 |
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Quote:
I kept getting a bit out in a slither that proceeded to lean on the side of the CPU die and not stay on the die itself.
What were you using? The AS5 we're talking about hear is tacky and stays where you put it. It's not difficult to spread with a plastic card or flat razor blade. I'm so dangerous with sharp objects, I opted for plastic.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 06:35
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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26. January 2006 @ 10:29 |
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I managed to move it alright, but when it came out it always wanted to stay there. It wasn't Arctic Silver, it was by Arctic cooling but came free with the Copper Silent2l heatsink, I think it's a ceramic compound. I used, like somebody told me, I forget whom, a (well series of) cotton wool bud, like the ones you clean out your ears with (a clean one! :D))
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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26. January 2006 @ 11:43 |
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brobear
I will continue to do it my way, it offers better coverage and a better seal. I've been doing it that way long before Arctic silver 3 or 5 existed and every experienced builder that I know does it the same way I do as well. I think that they're just trying to make the instructions moron proof so that careless users won't use too much and cause it to create a circuit.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 12:31
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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26. January 2006 @ 12:32 |
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A circuit? Another one? I assume you mean a short. Nasty things those.
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AfterDawn Addict
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26. January 2006 @ 12:34 |
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Sammoris
You're right, the 939 will probably be around for a while, it's the 939 Opterons that are disappearing and being replaced by socket 940. Rumor has it that they made the Opteron 939 series too good.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
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26. January 2006 @ 12:41 |
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sammorris
A circuit can be a short, in fact I believe that the word short is short for short circuit. lol
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 14:41 |
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It even has its own spot in the dictionary as short-circuit, it's one of those hyphenated words. ;) Those familiar with electronics take the meaning from context. As Sophocles stated, it could form a circuit (an unwanted one which could become a short-circuit). And a short is a circuit with a name, short-circuit. How's that for semantics? LOL
Sophocles, as I mentioned, I opt for full coverage as well. Part of the application method would depend on what I'm using and where. A smooth, thin layer on a P4 spreader works well with the AS5 and the finished heatsinks that fit flush. Using something like the thinner GEIL copper/silver compound, I'd put a layer on both surfaces to insure good coverage. Guess I'm like some of those custom builders, I trust the AS5 to do the job. I may eventually use the GEIL on something that's low heat and no worries about it getting too hot. I got the big tube of AS5, so I'm not likely to run out any time soon. ;)
Sophocles, heres some interesting info on AS5. It uses 99.9 per cent pure silver, but the silver content would less because of the other conductive filler and the suspension accounts for a percentage of weight as well. I wonder what the actual percentage of silver is by weight in the AS5 compound. That's one piece of info they don't advertise very well. That 99.9 per cent pure silver sounds great though. http://www.arcticsilver.com/as5.htm
High-Density:
Arctic Silver 5 contains over 88% thermally Conductive filler by weight. In addition to micronized silver, Arctic Silver 5 also contains sub-micron zinc oxide, aluminum oxide and boron nitride particles. These thermally-enhanced ceramic particles improve the compound's performance and long-term stability
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 15:01
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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26. January 2006 @ 14:50 |
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Another point that I'm going to make for the benefit of others. Your heatsink is going to come with a little heat pad on it, be sure to scrape it off with an old credit card and then clean it well before applying AS5, a good coating makes for better cooling.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 15:12 |
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I mentioned cleaning both surfaces, but I didn't make a point of informing the novices on using a razor blade or card to remove old material. Makes the cleaning easier. Guess I should have added emphasis. ;) Then using alcohol or acetone to finish cleaning and to prep the surfaces is a good idea. I'd like to emphasize that and the following. One doesn't want oil of any sort on the heat spreader or heatsink surfaces, that includes greasy fingerprints. Never use any oil based cleaners, like WD-40 or citrus oil. Oil gets into the metal pores and lessens the ability to dissipate heat.
I edited the last post, some info on silver content in AS5, not 99.9%, that is the percentage of purity for the silver used, whatever the percentage is by weight. Anybody know where they put those figures? What is the silver content percentage by weight in AS5?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 15:22
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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26. January 2006 @ 16:06 |
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I think that I read an article a while back that has it being about 93%, that's why it's such a stiff grayish muck but I can't say for sure.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 16:26 |
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From the wording of the AS statement it would fall less than 88%. I'm just curious why AS doesn't advertise the silver by weight like the other suppliers do.
Some of the other materials would add to the gray color as well as the silver. AS5 is one of the best thick, plus workable compounds. That's what makes it tops as well as being one of, if not the best at conducting heat. I'm not likely to use anything else on a PC I work on unless someone comes up with something better, which I haven't seen. As I said, I have a good supply laid in as well. LOL
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novicebb
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26. January 2006 @ 16:46 |
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To: Theonejrs-
You can get the x2 4400+ on monarchcomputer.com for 469.74 and free shipping. On Monarchcomputer.com the 3800+ is only 299 and about 3 dollars for the fed ex express saver shipping. Can you say I will go to dual core.
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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26. January 2006 @ 17:07 |
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" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
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26. January 2006 @ 19:30 |
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To: Novicebb,
I suspect that the 64x2 4400+ should continue to go down in price between now and mid summer. Intel and AMD should both have all their new stuff out by then and the prices on the current 64x2 CPUs should go down. I'm hoping for around $300 for it by then. I'de really like to have the Opteron but I'm not going to lose sleep if I don't get it. Still, it would be nice.
To: All
Artic Silver is the best but I don't think that I would get enough improvement in my temps to warrant pulling the cooler and using it. It runs great at 3.60 and the temps are very good for a 20% overclocked prescott. Better than the stock cooler at 3.0. Everything from bootup to running programs and encoding runs much faster! Short of refrigeration or liquid nitrogen, I think I have reached the limit for this CPU. At least with the present memory. I could probably improve it more with quality cas 2 memory or some higher speed PC4400 2.5 installed. With the addition of the fan control for the case fan, it no longer roars! Like I said, I am a happy camper!
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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brobear
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26. January 2006 @ 19:30 |
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Sophocles
You're probably right. Even at that, AS leaves the others in the dust. That's the first time I've seen the silver content listed by weight percentage and I've read comparison tests as well as browsed around the AS site.
Theonejrs
Something to remember for the next time around.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 19:33
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AfterDawn Addict
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26. January 2006 @ 20:58 |
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Brobear,
For sure! For sure! I'm gonna post the temp results of my last test as soon as I figure out why I can't get a large enough pic to see and read.
I have to say I am impressed with the Zalman. Just being able to slow down a very aggressive case fan so it no longer roars was worth the price. Running at 3.60 rock solid with me torturing the crap out of it with no problems, Priceless! I no longer see temps over 60C even while encoding.
I also have learned a lot and will put that knowledge to good use with my next build. My thanks to everyone who helped along the way.
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 26. January 2006 @ 21:14
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26. January 2006 @ 22:43 |
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For what ever reason or way I have got to this forum...I have spent the last 6 hours reading(mostly 2guys) compare AMD TO INTEL. It seemd to me that there is a lot of misinformation. Comparisions are done with different ram, MOBO'S, and most of all OVERCLOCKING OF EACH OTHERS CHIPS(INTEL-AMD). I maybe wrong (and I am sure you will point all of this out) but all of the bull that you so called experts are putting out there is more preference then fact!iT IS LIKE watching the Republicans and the Democrates.. Politicaly!
#1 To keep it simple, maybe you should inform people that one of the most inportant things to the cpu's performance if the selection of the proper MOTHERBOARD! DUH (i know you will kill me here).Because this is a higly debatable area.
#2 Do a a side by side comparison of AMD chips to Intel... NOT OC'D.!! With all the confusing numbers and labels for each chip, maybe you could do a side by side comparison( without all the crap).
So that regular people know about what is in the simailar class.
Because belieave it or not regular people read AFTER DAWN and most of the answers you leave are either rude or non helpful. Because you leave answers that are to hard for reg users to understand. And when they ask for more info... they get f.....
In any case maybe I have gotten this place all wrong. I thought that This Forum was for everyone and to help everyone. Not just this section, but all sections.
Well back to Intel to AMD. All chips run hot... but maybe the info about removing the DIRT AND DUST FROM ALL FANS AND CPU COOLERS WOULD HELP????
Well enough said here..
p.s. 1 of the best game players and is on the circuit uses ABIT MOTHERBOARD AND A INEL CHIP..FATALITY
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