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IMPORTANT NOTICE - BAD MEDIA - UK
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jase
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27. September 2004 @ 16:54 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 28. September 2004 @ 06:32
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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27. September 2004 @ 16:56 |
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jase
I was never involved in the outsourcing argument I wouldn't know unless I looked into it a bit.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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jase
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27. September 2004 @ 16:59 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 28. September 2004 @ 06:32
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brobear
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27. September 2004 @ 17:05 |
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Nobody was disagreeing on the out sourcing. Sony, MCC, TY and others who are supposed to be among the best do it. It's the old profit margin versus quality situation. They want the bucks. Also, I never said the Japanese weren't considered superior to the other countries producing media. I realize they are. However my point was only that they are not infallible and they can have poor manufacturers as well as any country. They just have fewer. I haven't seen any statistics on how wide the variation is. Word has it though that the difference between Japanese and Taiwanese products overall is drastic with the latter being the loser.
Just before anyone jumps on this, there are exceptions to this as well. Ritek appears to be doing a good job and so are some of the outsourced MCC. I'm sure there are probably others.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. September 2004 @ 17:10
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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27. September 2004 @ 17:06 |
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jase
While I did say that RICOHJPN were made in Japan I made no mention of outsourcing at all! Period!
How can there be a clear inference where none was made?
Why you want to continue to beat this pointless issue into the ground is beyond me but if you want to quote me then read what I've written as it was written and nothing more.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. September 2004 @ 17:07
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brobear
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27. September 2004 @ 17:12 |
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Sophocles
You stepped onto his turf and he is protecting his arena of expertise.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 27. September 2004 @ 17:18
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jase
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27. September 2004 @ 17:12 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 28. September 2004 @ 06:33
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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27. September 2004 @ 17:16 |
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There are no arena's of expertise without experts, all others are just generalists. BTW generalists are more useful than experts.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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27. September 2004 @ 17:33 |
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Sophocles
For once I'll be short. I had a long harangue prepared but decided it would be driving a useless point into the ground. Time to move on...
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 01:42 |
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All Ricoh media is made by Ritek in Taiwan according to Ricoh's specifications, hence the unique media ID.
If you look at Arita media bought from distributors who buy from Conr*xx, the media ID for that is Ricohjpn as well.
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 02:12 |
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StinHambo
As a sales person involved with the Conrexx/Ritek connection, hopefully, you can give us some documentation on this situation. It has been a source of confusion for many of us. Most media information sites list Ricoh as the maker of some Ritek media and not the reverse (+R and RW). I'm getting tired of the confusion and would like for someone to show some documentation on the situation that isn't just forum fodder.
Ricoh is known to make a lot of media for various brands which adds to the confusion. Why have Ritek make Ricoh when Ricoh is making media for a lot of others. Guess you can see where one can get confused. Since you are on the inside, maybe you will let the rest of us in on these workings. Please though, I am a trusting sort and will take your word for it. However without some concrete documentation and some proof other than forum chatter, I fear the confusion over the situation will remain.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 02:16 |
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I understand Brobear.
Ricoh have an office inside of the Ritek factory in Taiwan as well as several of the Ritek lines which Ricoh use to their specifications.
When DVD media was in it's infancy, part of the reason for such little Ritek media was due to Ricoh using 80% of their capacity!
By the way as well as a Conr*xx/Ritek connection I have a direct Ricoh connection so I hope this gives you alittle more confidence.
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 02:54 |
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Here is a listing that I found that further confuses me. It shows Ricoh as a Japanese company. Not a Taiwanese subsidiary of Ritek. It is part of the core RW Alliance of which Ritek is just a member company.
DVD+RW Alliance Member Companies
DVD+RW Alliance consists of 73 companies of world's leading hardware and software manufactures, along with eight core companies:
Ricoh(Japan),Dell(USA), Hewlett-Packard(USA),Mitsubishi Chemical(Japan)
Philips(Netherlands),Sony(Japan),Thomson(France),Yamaha(Japan)
321 Studios
4COS Technologies
Accesstek Inc.
Ahead Software
Almedio Inc.
AMC Co. Ltd.
AOpen
ArcSoft, Inc.
ARGUS Electronics Co., LTD.
Atmel Corporation
B.H.A. Corporation
BENQ Corporation
CMC Magnetics
Cyberlink
Daewoo Electronics Co.,Ltd.
DiscFarm Corporation
Easy Systems
ECOM Inc.
Epson Direct Corporation
EXPERTMAGNETICS Corp.
FUJI PHOTO FILM CO., LTD.
FUNAI ELECTRIC CO., LTD.
GEAR Software, Inc.
Hilevel Consumer Italia SpA
Hitachi Maxell, Ltd.
Humax Co., Ltd.
Infodisc Technology Co., Ltd.
Intervideo
Kano Technologies Corporation
Lead Data Inc
LGI(HLDS)
Lite-On
LSI Logic Mediatek
Mediostream
Memorex
MET Technology Co., Ltd.
MiCO Electric (Hong Kong) Ltd
Mitsui Chemicals Inc.
Moser Baer India Limited
NEC Corporation
NewSoft Technology Corporation
NTI (New Tech Infosystems Inc.)
Olympus Corporation
Optiwest
Optodisc Technology Corp.
PENGO TECHNOLOGIES, INC
Pinnacle Systems
Prodisc Technology Inc.
Radius Co., Ltd.
Ritek Co.
Roxio Inc.
Sanyo Electric Co. Ltd.
Sentinel
Shinano Kenshi
Sky Media Manufacturing SA
Sonic Solutions
SW Architects
Taiyo Yuden Co.,Ltd.
TDK
TEAC AMERICA, Inc.
TEAC Corporation
Ulead Systems, Inc.
Ultima Electronics Corp.
Zoran Corp.
(as of September 2003)
That was from Ricoh's Global site.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:01 |
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Ricoh is not a subsiduary of Ritek.
It is like Mazda using Ford cars and rebadging them.
Ricoh is such a big OEM for Ritek that they have their own QA and sales office in the Ritek factory!
Also Verbatim have the same setup at CMC.
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:18 |
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Further complicating matters is that neither Ritek or Ricoh, disclose brands they manufacture for on the web. They don't respond to emails from strangers either. Ritek mentions having manufacturing facilities on several continents and an alliance with Phillips in Germany. Other than that they keep media production quiet. Ricoh doesn't mention much about their media manufacture on the web. (They do give the info that accelerated tests show the media will last for 100 yrs.) So, neither of these companies give enough publicly to clear up the confusion.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:19 |
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Well I am a distributor for Ricoh as well so I should know!
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:29 |
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StinHambo
You personally tell us what is happening with these companies. Why aren't they more open to the public and why won't they let the general public know what is going on with the manufacture of the media? So far, all the companies seem to be keeping a lot of information secret. What are they afraid of, that we the consumers might not buy the product if we know where it comes from? Ritek and Ricoh are both brands and manufacturers with a good record. Why don't they make it common knowledge about the alliance as Ritek did with Phillips in Germany?
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:35 |
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Maybe it just doesn't occur to them? The other reason is probably because it would take too much to explain what I have on the packaging and most people would just buy the cheaper Ritek knowing it was 'made at the same place'...
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:35 |
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StinHambo
Thanks for your personal input. It does little to clarify the situation though. You tell us these companies are allied and are conducting business in a certain manner. However, they seem to persist in being secretive and there is little proof they allow to be shown on the web or in the news. They sure don't present it themselves. So, it seems the confusion continues. Thanks again for your time.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:40 |
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No problem Brobear.
Unfortunately they have every right to not disclose their trading styles and suppliers info. They are building brands and they add value to their company.
It's like the laptop market. 80% of the worlds laptops are made by 4 maufacturers. Dell is one of the biggest OEMs and has probably one of the best brands yet it is no different to what you might find by a small independant.
Why ruin their brand value by saying where it is made?
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:42 |
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Ricoh manufactured by Ritek in Taiwan would not be too much to add to the print on packaging and would tell the consumer quite a bit. As far as purchasing goes, it appears the Ricoh are mostly +R, +RW and Ritek does the -R products. So the consumer would still be buying the same products irregardless. I like the +R which is one of the reasons I stick with Ricoh. If I wanted a good -R product at a decent price, I'd go with Ritek. The companies are allied according to you, so it wouldn't be a matter of competition. Thanks again for your personal input on the subject. I just wish the big guys in the home office would wise up to the desires of their consumers.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:50 |
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But my point is that if they put manufacturered by Ritek in Taiwan then a direct comparison would be drawn and the cheaper product would be bought, thus affecting Ricoh sales.
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:50 |
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As far as the Dell analogy, that isn't the same. In fact when one gets a Dell they know they are getting various companies components assembled by Dell. Bulk purchase and quality controls assure a decent product at a highly competitive price. They don't hide where the components come from. Also, it is no secret about Dell's corporate structure or their manufacturing processes. That is diametrically opposed to the secretive DVD media industry.
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brobear
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28. September 2004 @ 03:52 |
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StinHambo
Are you saying Ritek is cheaper than Ricoh? I've found them to be fairly competitive on the North American market.
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StinHambo
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28. September 2004 @ 03:56 |
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Well here in the UK there is a price differential!
I see your point if there isn't in the N.American market...
This conversation is becoming the Brobear and StinHambo show!
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