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The Official PC building thread - 4th Edition
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. October 2012 @ 12:25 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
Originally posted by omegaman7:
I'm just saying. I never imagined they'd release processors, disregarding power consumption, in favor of performance. The 8150 borders on a Powerful GPU eh?
That has happened with graphics cards for several years, dating way back to the Geforce FX era!
Sam,
And you are from what planet? LOL!! Most of the world is unfettered capitalism these days. Make a buck at any cost, as long as it's not your cost! LOL!! Your imagination needs upgrading to the 21st Century. You watch though, there will eventually be a public outcry about power consumption from computers, and the Govt will create a special tax, based on power consumption of PCs. Just like always, those well off enough, can afford to abuse the privilege!
I decided to spoil myself a little more, and ordered another Corsair 400R case, a Corsair H60 LCS, and the same fans as the Phenom IIx4 965! It's time to retire the Cooler Master R-534+, in favor of better cooling and the more modern look of the 400R. Classy enough to fit in with fine furniture, and the cooling and cable management systems are very well thought out. It's an extremely quiet case, and needs one less fan to do the same job, MB temperature wise, that I had in the R-534+. It's also a lot roomier inside.
Best Regards,
Russ
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 12:40 |
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Sorry, what?
I was merely stating that what Omega was surprised at, has happened, for some time.
Why does that make me out of touch exactly?
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. October 2012 @ 14:08 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
Sorry, what?
I was merely stating that what Omega was surprised at, has happened, for some time.
Why does that make me out of touch exactly?
Sam,
Actually, I just noticed that I should have sent this to Kevin. Oh well, I was just fooling with you anyway, but the business world today is full of people as crooked as they come, when deciding on how to make a buck! The lawmakers will back anything big business wants. They are one and the same as far as I'm concerned, all are members of the villains, Thieves and Pirates union, so I'm certainly not surprised!
Russ
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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Senior Member
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30. October 2012 @ 14:40 |
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So true Russ!
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 14:46 |
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I understand where Russ is coming from. But I also understand that pushing a product out at regular intervals is also important to a company. Even if it isn't quite ready. They need to receive some return to back their efforts ;) Much like software developers. Push it out, and have the general public test it. Of course when it comes to software, it really DOES need to reach the general public to work out bugs, that won't necessarily be noticed in a testing environment. They can't exactly buy every hardware configuration. Although it might be possible to emulate it. But perhaps not.
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. October 2012 @ 15:28 |
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Originally posted by theonejrs:
Originally posted by sammorris:
Sorry, what?
I was merely stating that what Omega was surprised at, has happened, for some time.
Why does that make me out of touch exactly?
Sam,
Actually, I just noticed that I should have sent this to Kevin. Oh well, I was just fooling with you anyway, but the business world today is full of people as crooked as they come, when deciding on how to make a buck! The lawmakers will back anything big business wants. They are one and the same as far as I'm concerned, all are members of the villains, Thieves and Pirates union, so I'm certainly not surprised!
Russ
Case in point perhaps, I'm excited about the new Nexus 10 Tablet, a first really since apart from the ipad none of the tablets out there have really interested me - I note, however, the device is a really awkward shape, as a result of apple winning the US lawsuit saying they own the rights to manufacture straight edge devices with rounded corners...
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 16:40 |
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Crapple would probably sue me, if I used their logo for an avatar. Pretty sad really.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 19:00 |
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You guys ever see PC speakers like these? What I mean, is they only have one cord. No power... so it seems they are powered much like head phones. But surely not every port is gonna be equipped to deal with these, eh?
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 19:11 |
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How do you think headphones work? Speakers can be powered by 3.5mm jacks but they need a decent sound output powering them. PC onboard audio is better now than it was, but those won't be very loud :P
It is, however, common to see speakers that plug in using phono plugs that are actually amplified - and those do go loud. I don't recall seeing amplified 3.5mm connectors, but they might exist.
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AfterDawn Addict
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30. October 2012 @ 19:16 |
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I'm just concerned, that hooking them to an iphone/or smartphone might destroy one or the other.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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30. October 2012 @ 19:26 |
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I highly doubt that, they'll just be a bit quiet is all, I suspect.
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Senior Member
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30. October 2012 @ 22:08 |
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Originally posted by omegaman7:
I understand where Russ is coming from. But I also understand that pushing a product out at regular intervals is also important to a company. Even if it isn't quite ready.
I would disagree totally, even if that is the mindset today. And it is sad that people think that way as it will not change back anytime soon do to this. Sometime change is NOT good and this is one time.
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ddp
Moderator
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30. October 2012 @ 22:09 |
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those appear to be from an older hp p3 computer. 1 of my customers had 1.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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31. October 2012 @ 00:41 |
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Very likely DDP. I have two HP/Compaq's in my PC clutter area LOL!
Sam, it worked fine connected to my LG Fathom smartphone. It doesn't get very loud, but it does work.
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 31. October 2012 @ 00:42
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harvardguy
Member
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31. October 2012 @ 04:31 |
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Hey guys, this is a topic of general interest I believe, concerning a graphic setting called vertical sync, synchronizing with the normal 60 hz screen refresh rate.
A very strange thing happened yesterday. I wonder if anybody else has had the experience of vertical sync actually interfering with gaming performance, by reducing shooting effectiveness?
I know that some of you like vsync - Blaze has talked about using it for increased fluidity - he's mostly on World of Warcraft I believe. Sam said he does not use it, and Sam referred me to one of my new favorite games, CS:GO Demolition.
Here is what happened:
I had re-enabled crossfire for one particular graphically challenging game, Medal of Honor Warfighter. Crossfire fixed my lag problem, increasing my frame rate to 60 or 70 fps.
When I started to play Demolition again, which is a much lighter game graphically, I didn't want to disable crossfire, however just one 7950 runs that game at 120 fps. I thought that two in crossfire would be a ridiculous overkill, so I turned on vertical sync for a steady 60 fps.
During the gaming session that followed, my shooting accuracy seemed to be way off. It was a bad night - I just couldn't shoot worth sh*t. I thought I had lost my touch.
One incident stuck stuck out: On the Lake map, I was firing full auto with my bizon gun sight right on the back of the bot's head 10 feet away, as I strafed to the left while he was busy exchanging shots with one of my teammates. Nothing happened - it wasn't until I strafed back the other way that I finally killed him. WTF!
I'm not saying I'm Wyatt Earp - but especially against the bots I am used to hearing the little DING bell sound, meaning I just got a kill and I will advance to a different weapon for the next round. So I called it a night.
I had everything shut down. I had gone inside the house and was about ready to hit the sack, when I stopped cold - "Wait a second - was it the vertical sync?" I ultimately didn't get to bed for another 3 hours - by then I was an exhausted but happy camper - I can still make the bell ring!
Without vsync, running 120 fps, the graphics cards throttled back to a 45% load, the gameplay was back to normal. I realize that my experience is anecdotal, certainly not any kind of a scientific study, but I am going to be so bold as to postulate:
VERTICAL SYNC CAUSED A PORTION OF MY BULLETS TO NOT REGISTER WITH THE SERVER!
(Since I started playing Demolition, from time to time I have heard guys mic out, or type out, "I was shooting right at your head and nothing happened!" I attributed it at the time to lag, or to their imagination - but now I wonder if it was vsync.)
What do you guys think?
Rich
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AfterDawn Addict
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31. October 2012 @ 06:13 |
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Originally posted by me:
That's called input lag, and is one of the many reasons I don't use VSync. The next frame is rendered before the first one is displayed - so what you see on the screen is what happened more than a frame ago - this makes aiming more difficult!
In my experience, I have not seen VSync resolve micro-stutter issues with Crossfire. Generally speaking, with an fps above 60, microstutter is very mild I find - but as soon as you drop below 60, it's really noticeable, far moreso than being just below 60fps would normally be.
FYI from other thread.
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harvardguy
Member
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31. October 2012 @ 21:20 |
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Thanks Sam, I was worried it was only my imagination. I am surprised I have never heard this before - you can bet my last dollar that is the absolute end of my ever using vertical sync in this lifetime.
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ddp
Moderator
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31. October 2012 @ 21:27 |
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don't count on that!!!!
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Senior Member
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31. October 2012 @ 22:13 |
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Originally posted by ddp:
don't count on that!!!!
Very true DDP!
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ddp
Moderator
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31. October 2012 @ 22:24 |
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would i lie!!!! yep.
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Xplorer4
Senior Member
4 product reviews
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2. November 2012 @ 12:48 |
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Hey guys, just thought I would get some feedback on the HDD market here.
I need to pick up 2 new HDDs. I see WD has recently announced a 4TB drive, so I am thinking it might be time to jump on the 3TB band wagon as I am hopping they have matured by now. However, I was already eying the WD20EARX 2TB SATA3 or WD20EURS 2TB SATA2 but question how much of the claims are marketing hype? I have a WD20EARX 2TB SATA3 as it is, and that serves me well, but I only have 2xSATA3 header on my mobo. The WD20EARX uses one, and right now my single X25M-G2 is using the other. I was planning to swap the X25M for a Intel 330 SSD right now, but 2 of my HDDs decided to start to die on me instead. So in this case SATA3 would be good future proofing, but I had no immediate plans to upgrade my mobo right now, and if I did, well not much point unless I make the jump to Ivy Bridge or hold out for whatevers coming down the pipe from Intel. Anyways getting off track here, I am trying to stay as close to $100 an HDD as possible but might splurge a bit if it is really worth it.
OS: Kubuntu 12.10/Windows 8 -- CPU: Intel Core i7 2600K -- Motherboard: MSI P67A-G45 -- Memory: 2x4GB Corsair Dominator -- Graphics Card: Sapphire 4890 Vapor-X -- Monitor: Dell 2208WFP -- Mouse: Mionix NAOS 5000 -- PSU: Corsair 520HX -- Case: Thermaltake Mozart TX -- Cooling: Thermalright TRUE Black Ultra-120 eXtreme CPU Heatsink Rev C -- Hard Drives: 1x180 GB Intel 330 SSD/1xWD 1 TB Caviar Black/1xWD 2 TB Caviar Green/2xWD 3 TB Caviar Green
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 2. November 2012 @ 12:50
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AfterDawn Addict
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2. November 2012 @ 12:52 |
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SATA3 for 5400rpm drives is pretty inconsequential - the cache will respond faster but that's about it. The WD20EARX might be a little faster than the WD20EARS before it, but not by a great deal I don't think. They're fairly solid drives either way, but don't worry about not having a SATA3 interface to plug them into, there's no compatibility issue (at least not with internal controllers), and you shouldn't see any issues from doing this.
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Xplorer4
Senior Member
4 product reviews
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2. November 2012 @ 13:59 |
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Thanks for the info Sam. That reminds me I forgot to mention these drives, if it wasn't a bit obvious, are mainly going to be archiving Music on one, and Movies/TV on the other. I do expect I will be doing some encoding jobs from time to time, but mostly minimal stuff like video->DVD or ALAC/APE/OGG-> FLAC.
I am still curious if it is time to upgrade from 2TB to 3TB. I typically stay a bit behind the latest as HDDs are one area I don't want to be a beta tester.
OS: Kubuntu 12.10/Windows 8 -- CPU: Intel Core i7 2600K -- Motherboard: MSI P67A-G45 -- Memory: 2x4GB Corsair Dominator -- Graphics Card: Sapphire 4890 Vapor-X -- Monitor: Dell 2208WFP -- Mouse: Mionix NAOS 5000 -- PSU: Corsair 520HX -- Case: Thermaltake Mozart TX -- Cooling: Thermalright TRUE Black Ultra-120 eXtreme CPU Heatsink Rev C -- Hard Drives: 1x180 GB Intel 330 SSD/1xWD 1 TB Caviar Black/1xWD 2 TB Caviar Green/2xWD 3 TB Caviar Green
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Senior Member
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2. November 2012 @ 16:45 |
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SATA2 vs SATA3 HDD's is no real difference performance wise but you could buy a add-on card if you wanted to add more SATA3 ports as they are cheap and work well. Definitely put your SSD on the SATA3 port though.
3T drives are far from beta drives now and I wouldn't worry about going that route besides you'll get a 3 to 5 year warranty with them typically. If you're going to have a video server as one of your drives and/or audio I would buy a enterprise drive or a drive specific for streaming video. If the drives won't be running full time and used occasionally then you wouldn't probably want to spend the extra dollars for a robust and high performance drive.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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2. November 2012 @ 16:53 |
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Unless you're serving the files to large numbers of people, the only time you need high performance is when copying from one drive to another.
Even with the fastest CPUs out there you can't really encode at more than a few MB/s, certainly single figures, and the highest streaming bandwidth rate of HD video is also only a small number of MB/s, often less than 1 for ripped content.
The general standard of manufacturing of hard disks has dropped considerably over the last couple of years as manufacturers are feeling the pinch so cutting quality and testing regimes, so it can be seen that the large capacity drives are less reliable than smaller 7200rpm drives - in reality it's more just that all hardware is manufactured to a lower standard these days. I haven't seen much evidence to suggest that the 3TB drives are largely less reliable than their smaller counterparts.
For now, the 4TB HGST drives are too expensive, as will always be the case with the largest per-drive capacity product. Still, someone's got to buy them to bring the price down :P
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