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Intel P4 vs AMD
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 08:37 |
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Most of us have already come to the conclusion that the Prescott isn't the best of Intel. It runs hot and is definitely not a good choice for an OC enthusiast. I'm not going to spend the bucks to find out, but I wonder what an OCed 3.4GHz Northwood would do; especially one of the better Northwoods. Here is one that should be superior to the one I purchased at StarMicro. http://www.starmicro.net/detail.aspx?ID=556 That's the Northwood P4 Extreme. I got the "el cheapo" version, #1032, you see the benches on here.
http://www.starmicro.net/detail.aspx?ID=543
Just for the sake of doing it, I ran a bench comparing my stock 3.4GHz Northwood system against the newer top end AMD and Pentium dual cores and the high end single core FX 57. The old CPU held it's own. Wonder if an up to date chipset would have improved the performance. I knew the high end AMD and P4 dual cores would eclipse the Northwood, but then they "smoked" the 3800+ X2 and the FX 57. Still, the Northwood was in the ballpark with the latter 2 mentioned (very close to the $1,000 single core FX 57 which benefits from on-die memory and a larger cache).
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 08:53
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 09:02 |
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Lol my computer's the second one down on your last graph, theonejrs, so you're still doing well. I, like brobear disregard comparisons against Dual cores though, they're not really relevant, only in the sense that they're better.
I notice that the intel chips achieve far better Whetstone results, are these mostly down to core speed? Because that's the trend I see with them, whereas Dhrystone seems to represent the specs as a whole.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 09:04
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 09:09 |
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One on one the Prescott always loses to a Northwood if all things are equal.
Since everyone is including the multimedia benchmark, there is mine.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 09:12 |
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:D :D Pure pwnage, of the highest order. That system is insane.
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 09:17 |
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Sophocles is ahead this week. LOL I can almost hear the gears moving in The Donald's head... Gotta have more PC... LOL I'm not going to try to buy into this battle. Looks like you have one fine PC there Sophocles. Now for a shot of liquid nitrogen to see what it can really do, or just a little down to earth liquid cooling so it can run faster on an everyday basis.
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64026402
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15. January 2006 @ 09:22 |
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Actually the the point I made with my benchmark was that for 300 dollars you can have nearly double your score. The Northwood was 269.
Also the encode times on a Venice core comes in substantially quicker. Sophocles is usually in the 80 minute range.
The only benchmarks where P4s did well is SSE2. Athlon 64s are optimized for SSE. Their SSE scores are normally as good as or better than their own SSE2 scores.
Donald
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15. January 2006 @ 09:22 |
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I dread to think. It would seem sophocles has himself sorted on the processor front for a fair while. If it's outperforming the top CPU now, think of how well it will do when all the benefits of having all those cores and 64-bit will really take off.
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64026402
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15. January 2006 @ 09:25 |
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Right now I would get very little improvement from a more expensive AMD. Intel doesn't have any dual cores even near my capability except the overpriced Extreme editions.
Donald
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15. January 2006 @ 09:25 |
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overpriced is putting it lightly!
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64026402
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15. January 2006 @ 09:50 |
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Brobear,
I noticed that the FPU scores were missing from your Arithmetic bench marks. Did you turn them off?
Donald
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64026402
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15. January 2006 @ 10:10 |
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Me too.
Donald
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15. January 2006 @ 10:10 |
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6402 has a strong point.
What wasn't said is that over clocking dual cores requires a lot of shuffling between memory settings, HTT settings, and if you spend a bit more between clock multiplier settings. I was fortunate to have started with a very fast Venice core which really shook things up for me. I'm encoding most movies within the 1 hour mark. My slowest so far is 64 minutes and my fastest is 52 minutes.
If anyone is looking to purchase a dual core Opteron then my advice is go for the 165. There's a reasonable ceiling over clocking dual cores because the need for better cooling comes into play. The temperature fluctuation on dual cores are really interesting. On idle they can run into the low thirties but when called for dual threads at once they climb quickly to 49 to 54 degrees Celsius. I recommend the 165 because it costs about the same as the X2 3800, and it has 1 meg of cache per core and it will solidly over clock to around 2.65 on air cooling.
AMD just released its fastest commercial dual core for performance freaks, the FX60. The FX60 is a dual core toledo with a clock speed of 2.6 GHz and it comes at a whopping $1399. The Toledo core and the Denmark core are in my view, the same animal. So if you clock one of them up to the FX60 speeds, then it's an FX60. LOL
Make sure you have good quality memory.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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15. January 2006 @ 10:17 |
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64026402
"Me too"
The difference is that I'm running mine stable at that speed and with memory settings of 2.3.2.7 1T.
Your earlier post showed that your system was clocked to 2.61 Mhz which I believe is where you use it all of the time. Sisoft multimedia benchmarks can be benched at unstable speeds, just enough to get a screen shot:)
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 10:22
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 10:34 |
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Donald
Quote:
Actually the the point I made with my benchmark was that for 300 dollars you can have nearly double your score. The Northwood was 269.
Also the encode times on a Venice core comes in substantially quicker. Sophocles is usually in the 80 minute range.
The only benchmarks where P4s did well is SSE2. Athlon 64s are optimized for SSE. Their SSE scores are normally as good as or better than their own SSE2 scores.
An additional $53 dollars for the processor and a bundle for the necessary components to build the PC. The point of the upgrade was to do it on the cheap, without being out the cost of a build. If I had neither, the AMD 3800 X2 would be a no brainer as the preferred system. As for the FPU setting, I didn't pay attention to it. Too many Bloody Caesars I guess. I was celebrating. LOL
As for the PCs exhibited by you and sophocles here, there is no comparing them to stock settings and definitely not single core processors, not even the best AMD has to offer.
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64026402
Senior Member
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15. January 2006 @ 10:46 |
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I play with the settings regularly. I usually encode at 2.7 but drop to 2.6 for boot up and normal use. I suppose it doesn't make much difference. No doubt I'm running mine further out of spec than yours but it seems to take it like a man.
The 11x multiplier would be nice. I have to go asynchronous on the memory to keep the settings reasonable. But it doesn't slow the encode times.
When I get another x2 I will retire the 3800+ to sever duties at a more normal speed.
If I had a 175 I would probably go 2.9 for encodes. Other than movies I really don't need the extra speed. It's just fun.
Donald
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64026402
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15. January 2006 @ 10:53 |
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Brobear,
I actually thought you did the right thing with the upgrade. The old mule has quite a bit of life left. When you pay the Harley off and build an extra machine you can pick from all the neatest technology thats coming out this year. Should be fun.
Donald
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 11:09 |
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Donald
Quote:
I actually thought you did the right thing with the upgrade.
I remember your commenting on that. I appreciated the input.
As for encode times with RB/CCE I could probably do them quicker if I wasn't being so fussy. I could back off from 3 passes to 2 or even One Pass VBR (w/analysis). That would probably get the RB times in the 2 hour or less time frame. I think I'll run one just to see what happens.
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 11:14 |
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Quote:
I'm running mine further out of spec than yours
Not really, they've both the same core design. I could easily increase my core and test to 2.8 and do a quick benchmark. That's not quite a burn in but it works for a moment. If I ignore my memory performance I could hit really high marks on my CPU and if I ignore CPU performance I can hit really high memory bandwidth marks. But the marks that I'm looking for are the ones that can be replicated in everyday use, stable, the modality.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 11:16
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15. January 2006 @ 12:55 |
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To Sophocles,
I bow down to the shrine. At least until around summertime. He He!
Awsome numbers! 6402 ain't doing too bad either!
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
 This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 12:57
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 13:01 |
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Quote:
Awsome numbers! 6402 ain't doing too bad either!
He never does and he always makes sure that I know. LOL
In the end it's all about your stuff.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 14:53 |
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Doing things as many people do, encoding with RB at 2 passes trimmed the same movie, "Skeleton Key" down to 134 minutes and that was while surfing and doing other small jobs on the PC. I had about 5 or 6 windows open most of the time. Does jdobbs say the 3rd pass isn't really that helpful? How about one pass VBR? I know, it's slightly off topic, but it pertains to the real world processing ability of an Intel. By the way, how many passes are being done when Sophocles does an 80 minute encode?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 14:53
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 15:32 |
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Quote:
By the way, how many passes are being done when Sophocles does an 80 minute encode?
It's been a while since an encode has taken 80 minutes (even 70 minutes)but I will clear this mystery up. The number of passes depends on the size of the movie. If it is a small file sized movie then I use only two pass, but if it's a large movie then I'll use three passes. But if I were to use several passes with CCE I would average about 5.8 to 6.2 encoding speeds.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 15:34
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 18:12 |
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Next Post!!
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 19:19
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brobear
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15. January 2006 @ 18:32 |
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Sophocles,
You've really bought and built some bragging rights. Enjoy the moment. How long before the advent of the new mobos with improved memory handling, and improved chipsets and processors? There's an army at work in R&D trying to make your system obsolete as soon as possible. Unfair, but they're hard at work and you're outnumbered. ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. January 2006 @ 19:17 |
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Did I forget to mention that I have my memory settings at 2-3-2-7 1T.!
And I have somehow lost my manners along the way?
Hmm! Well maybe, just a little bit.
I grabbed the first new Venice core when it hit the market and then I shot my mouth 0ff about it. Donald immediately jumped aboard and grabbed the cheapest version of the Venice series and then later grabbed it's dual core equivalent, the X2 3800 for $400. I've been tagged to that thought for some time while watching the prices shift If you don't have the money to spend on dual core, then 6402's the right guide.
The Opteron dual cores were too expensive when they came out and so were the less expensive X2 "Toledo" cores.
Rumors have hit the net, that the socket 939 Opteron's are being discontinued. Dual 939 core Opteron's were beginning to become the fan chip of choice because of their over-clock-ability. Now they're being dumped. The latest major socket 939 release is going to be the FX60. It's a Toledo core clocked at 2.6 GHz and it sells for $1399. I have an Opteron that has easily clocked beyond that same chip for less than $500. No wonder they're removing them from the market. If you want an Opteron, then buy one now for early high speed dual cores results, or pay more when it's re tagged.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. January 2006 @ 19:17
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