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Intel P4 vs AMD
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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4. May 2006 @ 03:30 |
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Theonejrs
I chose the A8N-SLI premium over the A8N32-SLI for a number of reasons.
1. I would never see any benefits of 2X16 PCIe over 2X8PCIe and I will probably stick with just one card but if not two will be more than enough on the premium.
2. The two PCIe express blocks two of the PCI slots leaving only one open (I'm already filling two PCI slots on my premium).
3. No need to spend the extra money.
As far as chipset over heating is concerened the two are about the same, they both rely on your CPU fan for part of their cooling.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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64026402
Senior Member
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4. May 2006 @ 03:57 |
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The DFI is a decent board for those without the setup skill necessary to make a higher end board work. But personal experience has shown me that years after the DFI has worn out and died the Asus will still run fine. Even with the same chipset. Been there done that many times.
Donald
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4. May 2006 @ 07:17 |
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As far as RAM goes, do you guys recommend 1GB's or 2GB's. I have a 1GB of PC2700 in my current POS. I've been told that DDR can outperform DDR2 under most circumstances, is that true? For my next rig, it'll 1GB or 2GB. Also is there say a huge difference in performance between mid level quality RAM like crucial.com and high level RAM like OCZ? I currently have 2X512MB's, one PNY Tech, the other crucial.com, so no cheap stuff there. What do you guys think? Thanks for the info.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 4. May 2006 @ 07:18
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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4. May 2006 @ 08:58 |
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Though both the A8N-SLi Premium and the A8N32-SLi deluxe are out of my reach, I'd go for the Premium as it only needs one chipset, rather than two. With two passively cooled chipsets, you need a good airflow round them to stop things getting pretty warm. I can add an Akasa 23dB LED chipset cooler to my build for £3, and I think installed with Arctic Silver V. In addition, the standard KN8 one is probably noiser than 23dB, so there's another benefit. I don't need SLi, External S-ATA, 8-drive RAID or any of those features, and whilst UV reactivity would be nice, I don't need that either. A UV reactive PSU braid will do just fine.
I had this longstanding impression that DFI boards were good quality, partly due to their expense and their UV reactivity, but you're right, I rarely see people using them. How odd.
vspede: LOL! Glad you don't work in a repair shop on show!
Tokijin: There's no quality issue about Crucial, but you're best bet is Corsair Value Select. Cheap, reliable, high performance and fantastically overclockable. 1GB is fine for now, but you'll need 2GB eventually as games get bigger and Vista rears its ugly head.
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boxwrench
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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4. May 2006 @ 10:19 |
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Main System- Amd/64 3800x2 currently@ 2.5ghz. Asus A8N-E,win.xp-pro.4x1gb.Ocz platnium ddr 400,Maxtor 40gb.& 250gb.ide & 2x W.D.250 sata,Benq 1650V dvd Reader & Benq DW-1655 Writer,EVGA Geforce 7600gs,Creative Audigy-LS,Antec 750w psu. Vizio 37"hdtv monitor 1360x768@75hz.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 4. May 2006 @ 10:20
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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4. May 2006 @ 12:33 |
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You're very welcome, they're fabulous Processors. You've pretty much got a 38 running like a 48 with that little overclock, and I bet it wasn't hard. Tom's Hardware got an FX-60, essentially a very similar design to reach 3.0Ghz. Astonishing speed, truly. Beats the Pentium 4 D965 overclocked to 4233mhz!
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4. May 2006 @ 15:44 |
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Thanks for the info. I'm avoiding VISTA like the black plague, at least until the DRM crap is hacked, I'll happily go with a Linux Box until then. Crucial.com is good memory, and there customer service is fantastic. I thought Corsair was rather pricy, that's not the case?
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brobear
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4. May 2006 @ 19:22 |
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Tokijin
If you're going to OC the system, go with the better RAM. Though budget RAM will work, the performance RAM works better. As a personal preference I use XMS Corsair, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145574 . You may want to check out the DDR 433 as well. OCZ is another favorite as far as performance RAM goes. There's a good 2X1GB set at newegg for about the same price as the XMS. With RAM, you usually get what you pay for.
As for amount of RAM, if a person can afford it, go ahead and get 2GB. The system I'm using has 2. It's a loaded up XP with apps running in the background. Sometimes I'm using about 1GB of RAM. If I had only 1GB, I'd be slowing the system down at times. With my older system with 1GB, I'd sometimes try to open a new window and have to wait till the system allocated resources. Now there's no such problems.
You keep saying so and so said this or that. "So and so" has led you down the garden path on some things. Who are these people that have been telling you all these things?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 4. May 2006 @ 19:25
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AfterDawn Addict
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4. May 2006 @ 20:29 |
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@brobear
Quote:
Who are these people that have been telling you all these things?
while i can not answer that question FOR tokijin, i believe that some BASIC information has been obtained from me as well as other people contributing in my Taiyo Yuden thread...
http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/296925
we've since gone off topic and after my most recent AMD build that Sophocles helped me with the settings on (thank you again btw Soph), people are asking about memory, drives, processors, etc... i mentioned both you and Sophocles by name as being 2 guys with a WEALTH of knowledge and i let people know i PERSONALLY trust both your advice/suggestions; i'm not downplaying anyone else here in this thread as many know MUCH MUCH more than me regarding computers, but i have posted MY OWN SUGGESTIONS as to what i have used in the past or currently use on my various systems (whether it be my Intel Extreme Edition- Northwood/Gallatin core as well as my new AMD 4400+ x2 dual core) :)
as your thread has seen, there are many posts that "prefer" one company over others and have valid reasons to back up their claims (through various articles however biased they may or may not be), something similar is happening at this point in my thread too, people have their own "favorites" or whatnot and PREFER this over that, while some posts MAY or MAY NOT be completely accurate, most people that ask in my thread are concerned about the "basics" of components, not the details which have been discussed here... :)
please feel free to contribute or CORRECT ME if i am wrong about something that i say, i always welcome knowledgeable experience and recommendations; as i mentioned before here in your thread, i am completely new to the OC aspect of things, but thanks to Sophocles, i have gotten my feet wet and am still learning more with each passing day. :)
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 00:05 |
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Quote:
I thought Corsair was rather pricy, that's not the case?
See for yourself,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145579
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145568
Much though I hate to disagree with brobear, I don't think you necessarily get what you pay for with RAM. Good value RAM at £60/GB in the UK may do almost as well as £100/GB extreme performance stuff, yet other £60/GB RAM can be absolutely terrible. Elixir stuff used to be cheap to justify its poorness, but now its no cheaper than Crucial or Corsair stuff. What the deuce??
Quote:
but thanks to Sophocles, i have gotten my feet wet and am still learning more with each passing day. :)
Teach and learn!
© ddp 2004ish.
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 11:38 |
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Thanks for all the info. No one person is telling me this and that, it's a figure of speech. I've talked to several people on the subject of RAM, mobos, etc of late. A lot of this stuff is still Greek to me for now. I'm learning, slowly, but I suppose there's no other way to go. I am tired of being handicapped in the area of PC hardware, so I want to expand my knowledge base. I'm somewhat familiar with optical drives and RAM, that's about it. I'm filling in the blanks, so I can build my own rig from scratch when the time comes.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 13:52 |
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Sure, this thread's actually one of the best places to be for that, we talk about everything.
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brobear
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5. May 2006 @ 14:05 |
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Sammorriss
Quote:
Much though I hate to disagree with brobear, I don't think you necessarily get what you pay for with RAM.
LOL Someone's always making me qualify my statements. LOL To be exact, if one buys budget RAM, they get budget RAM. If one buys performance RAM, they get performance RAM. On the last part of that, I should have said if the customer shops wisely and does his research. There's always a ripoff out there.
I'm often accused of being overly verbose. Seems when I'm not, I get to explain what I meant. The better timing of the performance RAM allows better system performance than can be attained with the slower budget RAM. That's all I was saying there. As for shopping, I purchased the XMS Corsiar 2x1GB set for about $150 US, I got a rebate on it. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145574 So good shopping is part of the equation when doing a build if one is interested in saving a few bucks. Any time I can upgrade to a better product, I'll do so as long as the price isn't too high. That "too high" has to be figured out by the individual. I'll just let it be known I'm not buying any $1000 processors till I win the lottery.
Quote:
Sure, this thread's actually one of the best places to be for that, we talk about everything.
LOL, there I have to agree. Luckily we seem to get back on track and even our wanderings are on the subject of PCs. So we're usually not too far off course.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. May 2006 @ 14:07
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 14:11 |
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Lol better. I hate to do things like that to people, especially you, but I couldn't pass up the opportunity!
I agree about the topicism, the only debate I can remember off topic was a three page discussion about Car ECUs, remember that? Seems ages ago.
That's fantastic RAM for the price, the US really do have it off what with their no VAT and generally lower costs (plus you get newegg, basically the god of computer hardware shops). I'd love for XMS to be that cheap. I can't get two gigs of Value Select CAS3 for that!
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5. May 2006 @ 14:24 |
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So $188 is a good deal on 2GB's of Corsair DDR3200 RAM? It seems like it, if you divide by two, then $94 is a great price for 1GB of PC3200. I've heard Mushkin is good RAM (from DocTY and others) what do you guys think?
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brobear
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5. May 2006 @ 14:40 |
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@Kivory666
I think the overall point that most of us try to make on this thread is that components in a system should work together to the best degree possible. It might be nice to toy with a radical build, but most of us are discussing sane methods of building stable systems, yet enjoy the best performance possible. Your work with Sophocles should have given you a better insight into what's possible.
Granted we have members who prefer one brand over another. Sometimes that is merely due to more experience with the one brand and comes as a personal preference. When it comes to good products that are sold competitively, many of us will switch camps. One thing most of us will do though is point out a "stinker" product when/if we see one.
In today's market different companies jockey back and forth as leader. On graphics cards, both ATI and nVidia make good cards. Though I have a preference for ATI, I have nothing against someone else building with nVidia. These 2 companies often move back and forth as to who has the current best. As for me, I usually play on the frugal side and buy the older tech. I'm not into super gaming and don't need those last few fps. Same goes for processors, there's Intel users that switched to AMD. The earlier Intels had the AMDs of the time beat. Your Gallatin/Northwood core for instance was "the choice" for custom builds a few years back. Now for the custom enthusiast, the AMD is tops. If Intel comes up with something better, then the custom build customers will flock back. So, most of us on this thread will try to suggest what's best and often if it's just a personal preference we'll say so. I realize a thread sometimes has their political zealots, this one is no different. ;) The main focus is helping as we can without putting "too much" favoritism into the mix. (But sometimes it's just fun to mess around for comparison's sake, as we did with theonejrs' mobo selection.)
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brobear
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5. May 2006 @ 14:45 |
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Tokijin
Mushkin, Corsair, OCZ... The market isn't controlled by any one company. Also, some companies make RAM in varied performance levels. Just do your homework if something catches your eye. I like the Corsiar, but that's just a personal favorite. If someone handed me a couple of sticks of comparable OCZ, I'd definitely use it. ;)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. May 2006 @ 14:48
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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5. May 2006 @ 15:20 |
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OCZ, Corsair, Mushkin they're all safe bets but none are leaps and bounds over the other, if you don't have a personal allegiance, then bargain hunt, we're here to advise not necessarily to choose for you.
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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5. May 2006 @ 15:31 |
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Tokijin
If you want to know which RAM is currently on top just go to any tech test site where they are doing CPU tests (not RAM) and review their setup. You'll find that most if not all are currently using Corsair or OCZ. Gskill has proved to be quite good for over clocking but it's not consistent with different boards. It works well with DFI boards but has a problem with some of the Asus A8N boards. If you're going to be building with the A8N32-SLI the I would recommend the Corsair 3500LLPro, hell I'd recommend it with any board.
M
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 5. May 2006 @ 15:32
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 18:41 |
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Quote:
I realize a thread sometimes has their political zealots, this one is no different. ;) The main focus is helping as we can without putting "too much" favoritism into the mix. (But sometimes it's just fun to mess around for comparison's sake,
hehe, point taken~ :) i know this feeling ALL TOO WELL LOL
Quote:
Your Gallatin/Northwood core for instance was "the choice" for custom builds a few years back. Now for the custom enthusiast, the AMD is tops.
i'm trying my best to "keep up with advancing technology" as well, hence my own jumping ship to AMD; i personally have used many diff. kinds of chips (intel or amd), many diff. mobos (mainly ASUS and Gigabyte..even had what I consider a really crappy mobo, an "ECS" board back in the day) :) but you nailed my perspective on things right on the dot~ i am neither FOR or AGAINST any company in particular ;P differing from you, i CURRENTLY use Nvidia graphics cards, as it's MY personal preference at this time...ATI makes some great cards too, i have at least 1/2 dozen older RADEONS in all diff. flavors/speeds, they worked well for me on my older builds~ :)
i've learned a lot from this thread, i wasn't trying to get anyone riled up, just stating my OWN opinions much like everyone else has stated theirs~ :) have a good one all~
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 22:13 |
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vspede,
I missed your post a couple of pages back. I was looking for something and just saw it.
Yes, I can afford it. I could just go to the bank and take out the money. It's just more fun to plan everything with some sort of a schedule to keep. It also keeps me away from impulse buying. what I would have bought 6 months ago compared to what I will actually be getting is very different. Had I just spent the money back then, I would have wound up with a system not as good as the one I'll build this June.
At this point the only thing I'm not sure of yet is the video card. I was leaning towards an ATi X850 based card but nVidia has come out with the 7900GT which according to everything I've read has the potential to be faster than the 7800GT as it was expressly designed with overclocking in mind. Stock, the core clock is 450 and the memory clock is 1320. Use the nVidia overclocking tool and it will detect 570/1560 as the optimal speed. This is considerably faster than a 7800GT which supposedly can't be overclocked (stability issues) to these speeds. It's a little more expensive than the curent X-850 prices but it has some serious potential. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814150149
Since it has 8 more pixel/pipelines (24) than the X-850 (16) and even though I would have to give up the "free" TV tuner, I think I've sold myself and found my PCI-e video card for the new build.
Happy computering,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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AfterDawn Addict
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5. May 2006 @ 22:25 |
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GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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brobear
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5. May 2006 @ 22:35 |
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theonejrs
Prices and the state of technology are what it's all about. The X850 is good, but not the cutting edge ATI card. Better can be had with ATI if one is willing to pay the price, just as the new nVidia offers more. Nothing wrong with your choice as long as you've done the homework and it's what you need, both aesthetically and functionally. Part of what we end up with is closely related to what we're willing to invest. Sometimes the "I want" outweighs the "I need". Nothing wrong with that, we've all got to have our quota of toys. ;)
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6. May 2006 @ 00:38 |
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Brobear,
Quote:
Nothing wrong with that, we've all got to have our quota of toys. ;)
Amen to that! I also get this nagging feeling that if I don't build my one and only front line computer now, I won't ever get the chance again. I laid down some basic rules when I started giving serious consideration to this project.
#1 was I didn't have to have the latest, greatest or baddest as I've seen some times where the sum of the parts is not always equal to what you put in. That's also true in terms of spending too much money for things I don't really need.
#2 was to research potential choices for all of the componants. Ask questions in this and other forums. Check out owner reviews and places like Tom's Hardware or cnet.
I thought that I had made a good choice in a motherboard and was gratified to see so many members agreed. They were also quick to point out the shortcomings of a good but inferior Asus non SLI MB that I was looking at as well. It's very rewarding to ask questions and not get smoke blown up your butt with the answers. You guys are definately not the "Me Too" type.
I did my first PC build in Feb. of 89. I'de been fooling around with computers since the Z80 was king and my latest (and still fairly modern by todays standards) was an Atari ST. I bought my first CD-Rom drive for it around 85 or 86. It came with a Crowell & Collier Encyclopedia as the only software. That year I built 27 computers (can't remember whether they were 386-40 or 486 x4/100) between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Fortunatly 17 of these were for one customer and were all identical. Jumper settings in those days put a lot of jumpers in a very small space. You had to set everything. Nothing was detected except the hard drive. There, the BIOS had a detect hard drive setting. You had to write and rewrite config.sys and autoexec.bat to make all the hardware work. Sound card, video card, modem and an Ethernet card. Until Windows 95, there was no plug and play! Even then the plug and play support in Win 95 was minimal. UGH!!! God, I don't miss those days.
According to my calculations as best as I can figure from going back through all my old invoices, this will be my 600th or so build. Along the way I learned a few new curse words, my favorite being a "take off", Mother-Frogger! I still to this day use that one in place of the obvious! Back in the day when you could sell an AMD "586" 100 25x4 on a double speed board and run the CPU at 100 but at 50x2 with 16Mb 70ns Ram. Made for a much faster computer with the same chip, what with doubling the FSB. You could sell this with Keyboard, Mouse and 14" .28 monitor. A Trident 4 meg vga card, Sound Blaster and a 340Mb IDE hard drive w/High speed controller, and make about $1500 appiece.
I was quite lucky as I had a partner, a Chinese Gentleman who kept me supplied with the very latest in computer technology. Most of the stuff I had already and was selling weeks before the computer fairs and shows had them. If we had had an Internet in those days I would have become rich beyond words! One of the things he discovered in his travels was that a great many large corporations changed their existing memory for new every 6 months, most of which was locked away in a safe for fear someone could steal their company secrets from the memory. That's how little people knew about computers in those days. Anyway he signed contracts with a fair number of those corporations guaranting that all memory would be erased and would certify it! He would then send all these chips to to Tiwan where they would remove the chips and test them under load and build new simms with them. He also landed a lot of new memory customers when the price of memory jumped sky high! He made a fortune and retired back in 98, a multi-millionaire.
Anyway, excuse the nostalgia!
Happy Computering,
theonejrs
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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6. May 2006 @ 02:58 |
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No, by all means, its fascinating, learning about a past I wasn't part of. You built your first PC when I was but 9 months old and had just moved to my present house. If you're willing to pay the lots extra for a 7900GT go for it, it's a very fast and efficient GPU, and doesn't suffer the heat stability problems of the 7800 version when overclocking, as you rightly said. Then again, this ain't a bad GPU either, more RAM at least. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814102629
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