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The Official Graphics Card and PC gaming Thread
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 12:56 |
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Sam, I don't think it came with a grill. I want to finish it to look more professional, but darn it. Why? I don't show it off very often, I'm not gonna drop anything in there. And it's highly unlikely that I'll sell it. It serves me too well. Pluss the side modification doesn't look very good. I guess I could probably buy a new side panel somewhere, and try again. The top could look a little better. But it's totally agreeable. The cut was rather rough to start out if you look closely. But I learned while using the tin snips how to do a cleaner cut. Difficult to explain though :S
Rich, the HAF is my gaming machine. Though the 8600GT in my secondary served me well as well. It could handle some older games with little trouble. Yah, I figured since heat rises, a top exhaust fan would be a very efficient way of removing heat. Even at low Rpms. I think it runs about 800Rpms. Virtually silent. The case is rather small to support 2 fans on top. So I didn't do that. I don't believe 2 x 120 would work. The PSU and 5.25 bays are too close. Its a mid tower case. I love the HAF. I love ALL large cases LOL!
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. September 2010 @ 13:03 |
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whats the general word on the gts450?
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|. |
Senior Member
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 13:47 |
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Originally posted by shaffaaf:
whats the general word on the gts450?
Whahahhahahahahahaha...HOHOHOHOHOHO....HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEH!!!! okay i'm done.
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ddp
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13. September 2010 @ 13:48 |
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not done enough as still to rare, how about a lightning strike to make you well done?
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. September 2010 @ 13:52 |
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haha, im sure he won't just blurt random unhelpful crap next time.
seems to be priced well to close to a GTX460 768mb IMO
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 13:53 |
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Quote:
In any case, the star of the show today is GTS 450, the newest member of the GeForce family and intended for gaming at resolutions around 1680x1050. It?s clocked at 783MHz for the core, 1566MHz for the shaders, and 902MHz (3.6GHz effective) for its GDDR5 RAM. Currently it?s only being offered in a 1GB configuration; however we wouldn?t be shocked to see a 512MB part further down the line at even more budget-oriented prices. NVIDIA is launching the card at $129 and will be using it to replace the GTS 250, the last and most powerful card based on NVIDIA?s long-lived workhorse, G92. This makes GF106 the de-facto successor to G92, a very tough act to follow.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/3909/nvidi...-the-mainstream
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. September 2010 @ 13:54
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 13:55 |
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GTS450 places nvidia firmly in the bad books once again.
The TDP of it is way higher than the HD5770, yet it only performs the same as an HD5750. The GTX460 is so cheap now, nvidia are competing with themselves, and somehow managing to lose!
I'd recommend the GTX460 over the GTS450 in a heartbeat. If you want something cheaper than the GTX460, buy an HD5750. Job done.
In fact, the GTS450 is basically an HD4850, it uses about that much power, and is pretty much exactly that fast. Would you pay £100 for an HD4850 that could do DX11?
Would you pay £100 for an HD4850 that could do DX11, when you could pay £90 for an HD5750?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. September 2010 @ 13:57
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Senior Member
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 13:56 |
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Originally posted by ddp:
not done enough as still to rare, how about a lightning strike to make you well done?
sure if you feel up to it. just check your ban button before you press it.
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. September 2010 @ 13:57 |
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The article seems to compare it to the 5770...
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Senior Member
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 14:00 |
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Originally posted by omegaman7:
The article seems to compare it to the 5770...
it probably could be compared to it, in some games.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 14:03 |
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It's Anandtech though, and I don't trust Anandtech.
I was looking at the Hexus review. Hexus don't review things very well, but there's no game where the GTS450 even equals an HD5770 in their tests.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 14:04 |
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Ahh. Fair enough :p
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13. September 2010 @ 14:07 |
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i trust anadtech, they seem to be spot on IMO and one ofthe best tech review sites. when they review something, they go in deep. And bittech have basically said the same thing.
umm 4850 speeds? i thought it was 4870 512 speeds?
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|.
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Senior Member
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 14:08 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
It's Anandtech though, and I don't trust Anandtech.
I was looking at the Hexus review. Hexus don't review things very well, but there's no game where the GTS450 even equals an HD5770 in their tests.
i don't really trust any review sites, if you look at any of them its hard to tell who's telling the truth they all seem to point to there biased opinion.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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13. September 2010 @ 14:10 |
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Did you read the Bit-tech review? Seems like it's behind the HD5770 pretty reliably to me.
Can't see the HD5750 because for whatever reason they decided not to include it, yet include GTX470...
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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14. September 2010 @ 04:39 |
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Well time for another review. Mass Effect 2 this time :P No randomness just gonna score it out.
Graphics: 9/10
Easily one of the more polished looking games I've seen and one of the best for textures and shaders. They have heavily improved it from Mass Effect 1 including (thankfully) much better textures and better AA support. Also of note is that the "film grain" effect used in the first game has been removed entirely. Mass Effect 2 includes many new lighting and shading effects not used in the first game and the end result is quite pleasing. My only complaint is that the FMVs are SD quality and quite blocky and ugly. They could have easily made them full HD without affecting the overall data footprint much.
Sound: 9/10
Not much new here from the first game. DirectSound means absolutely no configuration which is a particularly pleasing trend I'm seeing in newer games. Very nice on both 5.1 and headphones. Much like the first game, the music is above average for the genre and the voice work is very well done.
Gameplay: 8/10
One of the few places where I feel the first game had a(very very) slight edge. First off, you can transfer over your old Mass Effect 1 save. You still start at level 1 but choices made in the previous game have an impact on the story of the second one. Namely you meet a few old friends and enemies and news reports reflect your choices to certain degree. Definitely not essential to enjoy the game but it does help the world feel a bit more cohesive and complete. The combat has been improved drastically(now very much like Gears of War) and managing equipment has been made much simpler. Global upgrades means you no longer have to manage every single item in every character's equip screen plus all the mods to every single gun and the armor. Now you just have a global loadout and simply select which weapons each character uses. Upgrades and buffs are now implemented automatically which takes a lot of the chore out of party management. Also each character now only has two weapon specializations which means no longer managing the 4 or 5 weapons for every single of the numerous characters. Conversations have been made a little slicker by allowing more seamless options. Exploration is where I feel the game suffers a bit. The first game let you simply click "Scan" to scan a planet for resources. Now you have to manually run your cursor over the planets surface and send down probes whenever your sensors spike. As well as more hands-on scanning you must move your ship manually including between systems to find Mass Relays and fuel depots to purchase more fuel and probes. This gets a bit monotonous after a while. Also the grand wide open expanses of the first game are gone in favor of more closed-in combat based environments. There is no longer some sort of rover for exploration, you simply land on a planet and it puts you at the mission location. So missions have been made much more entertaining but overall space exploration has lost the slick feel of the first game.
Performance: 10/10
Performance is my favorite part of the game. The first game was a direct console port and did not translate very well. It was not very well optimised and only had partial support for AA. Mass Effect 2 runs better while at the same time looking better with AA. Needless to say it is locked at 60FPS at all times maxed on a single 5850 at 1920 x 1200 with 8xAA. Also manages the same with 4xAA on a single 4870 though it does dip a bit at times. Crossfire support is nearly irrelevant.
Overall: 10/10
Mass Effect 2 is a perfect example of what a sequel should be. Everything from graphics to gunplay to interaction have been improved greatly. As previously noted a few parts of the game could have used some work but overall this is a very polished and well thought out game. The PC translation is much better this time and it feels a lot less like a port and more like it was made for the PC to begin with. Highly recommended.
Just a note: You WILL feel very very lost with the story and characters if you haven't played the first game. Though I whole-heartedly recommend this game, I even more heavily recommend you play through the first one and copy over your save beforehand. It's totally worth it.
Also, Mass Effect 2 is in my current standing for Game of the Year. Play it.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. September 2010 @ 04:42
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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14. September 2010 @ 06:50 |
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You'd be surprised how much using HD FMVs ups the disk space count. True, SD FMVs in this day and age is poor and games like Crysis I believe used HD FMVs, but still, a decent bitrate 720p FMV, let alone 1080, is around 4500kbps. That's 2GB for every hour of video. If you have an FMV-heavy game, that's more than enough to push it onto two DVD9s.
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Also manages the same with 4xAA on a single 4870 though it does dip a bit at times. Crossfire support is nearly irrelevant.
For you maybe :P
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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14. September 2010 @ 07:52 |
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The game has a fair amount of FMVs but over the entire course of the game it's only maybe an hour of video max give or take. The actual game is around 14GB and it comes on two DVDs so I see no reason why HD video is out of the question, even if they had to make one of the disks dual-layer. Every single new game I have seen in the last year or two uses HD FMVs and Mass Effect 2 is as new as they come. Really seems out of place when the game itself is so high fidelity like it is. What really gets me is a large amount of these SD FMVs are video of stuff rendered in-engine. Certainly it was unnecessary to even make those into FMVs, let alone SD. Really it doesn't kill the experience, but it's extremely noticeable when the actual game looks miles better than the FMVs. It's supposed to be the other way around...
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For you maybe :P
I would imagine the game has Crossfire support but I have yet to find a spot where a single one of my video cards can't max it. I would guess my 4870s in Crossfire could manage the same feat at 2560. Basically, even at your res, you should be able to utterly max the game with a minimum of 60FPS. So yeah quit your bitchin' :P
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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harvrdguy
Senior Member
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15. September 2010 @ 19:04 |
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Wow, I posted this before I realized I missed the whole next page, duhh.
Yeah, Kevin, I knew damn well you had a HAF!
Okay, I'm back - so all that stuff about the ceiling 140mm exhaust was for your non-gaming case. Good, I'm finally straightened out.
(That reminds me, helping a guy get his laptop wireless working today at my house - I found his ipconfig putting out some strange addresses and then I checked his TCP/IP properties and noticed - "Ah hah - whoever sold you the laptop had a fixed address - probably his IP guys at his corporation had him set up that way - just press that little button that says get address automatically!" - feeling very proud of myself. When 10 minutes later the damn thing was still not working, I asked him to type ipconfig /all, and saw a crazy DNS address of 10.0.1.0, whereas the gateway had a 1 at the end, then we went back to the same TCP/IP properties, and I neglected to notice the second choice 2 inches lower on the page, that now says "automatically select the DNS address." DUHHHHHHH)
BUT MAINLY I MISSED the duel between DXR and ddp, with shaff on the sidelines saying "Yeah, he'll watch his mouth next time!" Meanwhile, DXR is feeling lucky, 'cause he's all in for the lightning, with a little "sure, if that's what you feel like doin - just check your ban button before you press it"
Now what the hell did DXR mean by that? "You better check yourself before you wregedy wreck yourself." Did he forget he was talking to DDP?
LOL
Originally posted by sam:
The main argument though, is despite having a performance index of about 30-35, versus the 5-6 of COD4: Modern Warfare, it doesn't look anywhere near 5 times as good, it's too demanding for how good it looks.
Crysis performance index of 30-35, versus COD4 at 5-6!! Holy crap! Where do you get that fantastic information? That is the first time I've seen you talk about performance index, and I LOVE IT!
THAT right there puts everything into perspective.
But I thought on your 4870x2 cards, that you DID run crysis - (well it only supports 3 gpus so your second 4870x2 wouldn't be fully utilized.) But maybe you just did some testing and then put it off - so you and I are definitely in the same camp on that one!
Originally posted by sam:
Think about how airflow works Rich. Why is air going to go down towards the graphics card, when it has no way to get out? It'll bumble around in there, colliding with turbulence, which will cause everything to actually get warmer and just be a really terrible way of cooling your PC.
Duhhh, sorry Sam. I neglected to inform you that I have venting on the bottom rear of the case. I would guess that I have roughly 1 1/2 inches X 7 inches high of venting, roughly 10 square inches. That is the only venting I have, other than venting out the bottom front, which will cool the hard drives but which probably won't help the gpu card cooling much if at all.
I totally agree with you - without that bottom rear venting, air would just circle around.
But now that I have filled everybody in with that vital piece of information (I don't know why I neglected to mention that - I guess I was assuming that all cases have some venting in the lower rear - bad assumption on my part, lol) NOW let's restart the discussion.
FIRST - that is my gaming PC. It stays OFF for most of the month - in fact the table is turned around and I can't really sit next to the 30" monitor - there is no place to sit. So when the table gets turned back around, the gaming PC is turned on, for one reason only, and that is to play games. I REALLY don't ever run it in idle, and I will not be adding a fan controller, lol, so I don't care how nasty these high-pressure beasts are in low rpm mode - they will always get full 12 volts and blow the doors off of everything!
I am already making plans to pull the kama bay out of the P4 - so are we back ok on the Ultra Kaze?
Remember, in my opinion, it will push air down past the gpu card, and out past the 10 square inches of venting in the bottom rear of the case, supplying the gpu card with air from the front of the case. Although unfortunately, some of that air of course will be heated air from the cpu, the overall air temperature, in my opinion, of that big rush of 133 cfm pushing past the gpu, assuming the kaze can overcome having to twist the air from the top kama bay, down and out the rear exhaust fan and then bottom venting (probably will be reduced down to 90cfm with all the back pressure) will be substantially lower temp air, than if I do not add any kama bay intake fan at all.
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Also remember Rich, Ultra Kazes are 38mm thick fans. They interfere with big heatsinks etc.
That is thick - 25.4mm is one inch, so we're talking virtually 1.5". But no problem, the ultra kaze will be sitting inside the kama bay - where it can be 3" thick, it doesn't matter. I have the whole depth of the 5.25 optical drive bay to work with - if I can figure out how to mount the kama bay in there since I only have access to one side, and then if I can figure out how to mount the kaze in the kama bay. I'll use my blow torch if I have to, lol.
What do you think?
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Coming up next, my response to Rich's second post! :O
Regarding my second post - which I think was about image quality and using the nvidia control panel to optimize the gamma on individual colors - yes, I REALLY want to know that the Catalyst Control Panel gives me the same level of color adjustment! Again I cannot emphasize enough what a night and day difference it made to how I like my image to look. (Jeff do you care to help out in this subject of image quality and screen color adjustments, since I assume - as you had/have the same card, 8800 - that you ran the same color optimization routine that I did?)
In any event, thanks much as always, and I will be eagerly awaiting that response!
Rich
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. September 2010 @ 19:28
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Red_Maw
Senior Member
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15. September 2010 @ 20:01 |
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Originally posted by Estuansis:
Though I whole-heartedly recommend this game, I even more heavily recommend you play through the first one and copy over your save beforehand. It's totally worth it.
Having played the original ME on my 360 I really missed not being able to use my saves. If I ever get around to modifying the ammo capacity in ME2 I'll grab some one's saves from online and do non-stock playthrough, which might be well worth the time (not that the game is long or anything).
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Senior Member
4 product reviews
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15. September 2010 @ 20:04 |
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DDP is alright. Don't mind given em a little bit a trouble now and again.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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15. September 2010 @ 20:43 |
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I hate to disappoint Rich, but those are specified values based on an individual benchmark that I've calculated. They won't cross reference with other titles, nor is there a big list of them for all to see :P
Indeed, I ran crysis on the X2s, but haven't played it all the way through.
As for airflow, the Kama bay - good idea. Using a fan far more powerful than your rear, silly idea. A bit more powerful - fine. A 2000rpm fan woiuld be OK, but 4000 is just plain nuts, and won't improve your temps at all.
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AfterDawn Addict
15 product reviews
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16. September 2010 @ 00:06 |
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Quote:
Jeff do you care to help out in this subject of image quality and screen color adjustments, since I assume - as you had/have the same card, 8800 - that you ran the same color optimization routine that I did
I generally turn the brightness and contrast up. There is a fine line between the screen being too bright and washed out, and being too dark to see things properly in dark games. I like bright colors, but I like rich contrast as well, so my own screen has a bit of a vivid hue to it. Other than that I can't offer much advice because everyone's personal tastes are different.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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harvrdguy
Senior Member
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16. September 2010 @ 02:05 |
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Originally posted by Jeff:
I generally turn the brightness and contrast up. There is a fine line between the screen being too bright and washed out, and being too dark to see things properly in dark games. I like bright colors, but I like rich contrast as well, so my own screen has a bit of a vivid hue to it. Other than that I can't offer much advice because everyone's personal tastes are different.
We have similar tastes I see - except that, although I turned contrast to 100% in the nvidia control center, something they had said when I went through it the first time, caused me to actually turn the brightness a bit under 50%. The most important part of their color correction seemed to be a gamma adjustment - there was a large band of red, then another of green, and another of blue. You had to look at it out of focus, they recommended, then slide the middle of each band horizontally back and forth, until the part inside a box, seemed to merge with the part also inside the box, above and below the band you were moving. It seemed as though that gamma (gamma are the mid-range tones and shades, right?) of the red, green, and blue bands, were the most helpful in creating vivid colors in the game.
Do any of you guys know what I am talking about, lol?
Rich
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4 product reviews
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16. September 2010 @ 05:03 |
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