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Which Transcoding Tools Produce The Best Picture Quality.
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 16:11 |
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To all
I?ve been receiving PM?s lately regarding why some people are reporting problems with CCE 2.69, and reverting back to CCE 2.67. While it?s true that I did go back to CCE 2.67, I did it because CCE 2.69 is not compatible with a different authoring system I?ve been experimenting with, DVD2DVD-R.
I personally have had no provable flaws that have been caused by CCE 2.69 and the ones I did have I was editing with DVDremake. When I look for flaws in software I almost always look at who made it and what is the author?s reputation. If you?ve had problems with a backup and you?ve used DVDremake, perhaps you made a change to your movie that made it buggy, unworkable, but let?s not blame CCE.
Vurbal has reminded us on more than one occasion that DVDrebuilder is still beta software. Since hearing the reports of these problems I?ve researched it over and over again on the net and we seem to be the only pocket of people reporting these problem. This method is the best of all the affordable methods of backing up those long and large movies and that we all agree on, so let?s share it.
If you were a newbie and you surfed through our threads and read this information, wouldn?t this turn you away? If this method doesn?t get positive and accurate support from us, then how long do you thing its authors will continue to improve it? We need to report bugs but if we?ve added an unexplained variable to our reports such as having edited the movie with another application but we fail to give it weight in our reports, thus making our reports pointless.
My instincts tell me that a company that makes a $25,000 and $2000 software didn?t screw-up on their $58 software. Let?s keep it accurate and include anything that we did that might have caused our movies to be less than they could be but let?s not jump to conclusions and confuse those who came to us seeking help only to find us in disarray. Who wants to get tied up in a mess that will cost them $58?
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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ddlooping
Senior Member
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9. July 2004 @ 17:14 |
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 18:13 |
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ddlooping
It would be a lot easier with your game if you had the material out in the open, instead of us having to download the files.
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Moderator
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9. July 2004 @ 18:16 |
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lol ... I was going to try. But I don't have/use DVD2One or IC8 :-)
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 18:29 |
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TMcCallie
Did you do as I asked and try turning off some of the programs? Close/exit AnyDVD, I mean off, and use DVD Decrypter or Smartripper and put a decrypted file to HD. Then use the software to transcode the files with AnyDVD still off. Turning if off should be enough to take AnyDVD out of the loop. If you want overkill, use msconfig and take out the AnyDVD. With all your software, you should have had the AnyDVD set to come on only on demand.
When AnyDVD is on, you should make sure Safe Mode is unchecked. That is a troubleshooting mode and not meant for normal operation. Plus, your InstantCopy will not work in Safe nor will others like the InterVideo. You can right click on Safe Mode in settings and you will get a message box with the complete warning message.
You will need to follow Sophocles instructions as well. Clean your registry. If all else fails, you might want to reinstall AnyDVD. Remember to go through Add Remove in the control panel and reboot before installing.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. July 2004 @ 18:35
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 18:33 |
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ddlooping
I checked it out and downloaded the first set of compilations. I quickly noted that their file sizes varied and one can reasonably assume that the video with larges file size is going to have less compression and potentially a better picture.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 18:38 |
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Sophocles,
Are you saying it is an unfair comparison of files? I noticed the different file sizes on the question thread but didn't care about downloading to do the trial.
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 18:40 |
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I'm saying that I could easily screw with the results and post them. One file size was almost 50 percent larger, I hope that was the original.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 18:46 |
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A skewed guessing game, guess I don't wanna play.
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AfterDawn Addict
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9. July 2004 @ 18:51 |
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They should ALL have the same compression to be fair. I'm finishing up "Butterfly Effect" in rebuilder/cce, then I was gonna take the test. Guess after what soph said I'll have to look at it now.(pretty astute observation there sophocles)
 GO VOLS ! |
AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 18:53 |
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bigorange
I only did the first compilation, could you do the second?
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
Member
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9. July 2004 @ 18:58 |
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Brobear
Yes I have cleaned History, Internet files and registry.
Yes I have tried it with decrypter to HD file and then Shrink (same results). When I did this i had ANYDVD turned off and nothing running except the two programs.
Funny is that I can back it up with DVDFab with no problem but not Decrypter/Shrink/or Recode 2.
I have not had this problem with any other movies and I have backed up quite a few since then.
I personaly think it is somehting to do withANYDVD.
I also deleted ANYDvd through the control panel ADD and Remove Programs and then rebooted.
I then reinstalled ANYDvd and registed it with my paid for Activation Key..LOL
Problem still there.
Guess I will just ignore this and use DFDFab to back up the other two movies like I did with Big Fish., and then see if it happens again.
Thanks
Tom
Also, Safe Mode was not checked in ANYDvd
HP 7975 Pentium 4W/2.0 XP Home
1 GB RAM
Maxtor 80 GB and WD 80 GB (used for movies only)
Pioneer 116 DVD ROM,and BenQ 1640 Combo
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AfterDawn Addict
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9. July 2004 @ 19:01 |
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haven't tried yet soph, gotta burn Butterfly Effect, then I'll let you know. Files just done in Rebuilder. Spent a LOT of time in Remake on that one, wheeewwww!
GO VOLS !
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 19:07 |
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Ok this is the file size results for compilation number 3.
VTS_01_1 is 1.58 megs I BET MAIN MOVIE
VTS_03_1 is 1.37 megs DVD SHRINK
VTS_02_1 is 982 KB IC8 OR DVD2ONE
VTS_04_1 is .99 megs IC8 OR DVD2ONE
The difference between the largest and smallest file is
48%.
The difference between the second largest and second smallest is 28%
I bet I can tell which is which by their file size alone as long as I know the bias of its author.
Never screw with a math teacher.
_
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. July 2004 @ 19:13
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 19:11 |
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I got curious and took a peak. The clips varied just a bit in clarity. Hard to make a comparison test with downloaded images. Did anyone blow these up to check them out? Plus why the different file sizes?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. July 2004 @ 19:15
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 19:14 |
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I don't have to blow them up just look at the difference in their file sizes. Remember these movies only run for about 2 seconds.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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9. July 2004 @ 19:21 |
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Wonder if this was to whet our curiosity or bias the test pool? Any way it goes, DVD Shrink gets a much more critical test when it arrives. But then the bet has already been hedged. They already said some of us more critical may not find much difference. The placebo effect?
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. July 2004 @ 19:22
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AfterDawn Addict
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9. July 2004 @ 20:49 |
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OK, soph I noticed that on one row in each compilation, I couldn't even open. In one row sizes were different, but in the other all were exactly the same, around 12 or 16, I believe. Since it is a test for the shrink thread, I've got to believe shrink must finish high on most if not all. I will admit that I could be WAY off base here, it would be far from the 1st or the last time. Nevertheless, I ranked them to what I truly thought and not on the "try to outsmart them" theory. BTW soph, I'm as sick of this movie(must've done it 6-8 times during our "testing" frenzy) as you are Daredevil. Too bad they didn't use that for the test. heh heh
Here goes: first one in all- main movie.
1st compilation, row 2: dvd21,shrink,IC8
3rd row: IC8,shrink,dvd21
2nd compilation, row 1-IC8,shrink,dvd21
row 3-IC8,dvd21,shrink
3rd compilation, row 2-IC8, shrink, dvd21
row 3-shrink, IC8,dvd21
ddlooping, how bad are you going to embarrass me by publically posting results? For the record, it would have been a better test if we could have seen them side by side. Thanx in advance for that excuse. LOL I am, in fact, anticipating the arrival of the "new" Shrink with baited breath(ya think noah would send it to me?). I hope it lives up to the rumors, it was my 1st app along with Decrypter and I have fondness for both. See ya! PS-when is your new guide coming out? heh heh
GO VOLS !
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AfterDawn Addict
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9. July 2004 @ 20:57 |
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Hey brobear, talk about placebo effect! One guy in the other forum said all the samples sucked for this test. He said, and I quote,Quote:
I don't think it really matters to much which video, in any of the compilations, is made by which software. The quality is lousy on this level no matter what you use.
Now, my question is this, doesn't he realize the first sample was the movie itself with NO compression?
Where is the app that improves the original, I guarantee sophocles and I will be 1st in line. Ya know what I mean, verne?
GO VOLS !
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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9. July 2004 @ 21:27 |
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First compilation
VTS_01_1 is 3.43 megs main movie
VTS_02_1 is 2.21 megs
VTS_03_1 is 2.08 megs
VTS_04_1 is 2.10 megs
The difference between the largest and smallest file is 39%. Imagine doing a backup with shrink at 61%. The second largest and smallest file is 6%..
Second compilation
VTS_01_1 is 2.18 megs main movie
VTS_02_1 is 1.45 megs
VTS_03_1 is 1.69 megs
VTS_04_1 is 1.31 megs
The difference between the largest file and the smallest is 40% and the difference between the second largest and the smallest is 22.5%, the difference between the two smallest is 10%
Third compilation:
VTS_01_1 is 1.58 megs I BET MAIN MOVIE
VTS_03_1 is 1.37 megs DVD SHRINK
VTS_02_1 is 982 KB IC8 OR DVD2ONE
VTS_04_1 is .99 megs IC8 OR DVD2ONE
The difference between the largest and smallest file is
48%. Between the second largest and smallest is 28.4%
A 6% variance is relevant although marginal but the rest is significant enough to invalidate the comparison.
_
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 9. July 2004 @ 21:29
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ddlooping
Senior Member
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10. July 2004 @ 09:27 |
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Sophocles, I did enjoy your Sherlock Holmes power of deduction. :)
However, I wouldn't have spent the 10 hours it took me to make these compilations just to deliver a biased test.
Picking still frames or using less compression with DVD Shrink would have done the trick nicely and in a few minutes.
As explained on the web-page:
- I used DVD Shrink to make a movie-only copy of LOTR-ROTK, with "No Compression", including one AC3 5.1 stream and one subpicture stream.
- I then ran it through IC8, DVD2One and DVD Shrink, using their optimum settings.
In the case of IC8, "Movie-only", "High Quality", "Anamorphic (16:9)".
In the case of DVD2One: "Movie-only", "Constant Ratio" (this is the recommended setting for movie > 2.5 hours).
In the case of DVD Shrink: "Deep Analysis", two of the three new "Quality Options".
I ended up with three movie-only backups, one for each software.
DVD Shrink >> 4.36GB
DVD2One >> 4.36GB
IC8 >> 4.25GB (IC is well known for its undersizing/oversizing issue).
I then looked for scenes in the DVD Shrink backup which showed quality degradation.
Obviously, I didn't take the time to view the backups in their entirety, and mainly fast-forwarded until I noticed such a scene.
In the compilations, I included three of the scenes were a difference in quality was apparent between the backups (viewed on an EIZO 17" LCD display, at 1280x1024, using WinDVD in "Full-Frame" mode).
I then used DVD Shrink to re-author this scenes, removing the audio/subpicture streams so as to make the compilations smaller in file size.
The discrepancy in the sizes of each title simply illustrates the way each of the transcoders applied different amount of compression, depending on their algorithms.
I made two more compilations at a user request (nwg), this time not including DVD2One.
http://www.dvdshrink.info/temp/beta/ROTK_COMPILATION4.zip
http://www.dvdshrink.info/temp/beta/ROTK_COMPILATION5.zip
I'm about to make a 6th one, at another user request.
http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37290&perpage=15&pagenumber=9
This is simply to try and be as fair and objective as possible.
I do hope this will show I did not choose the scenes in the first 3 compilations to favor DVD Shrink.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. July 2004 @ 09:42
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ddlooping
Senior Member
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10. July 2004 @ 09:57 |
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P.S: in all the compilations, as indicated on the web-page (nice work Sherlock :D ), VTS_01_1 is always the original.
I normally pm the answers so as not to spoil the game for others, but I'm gonna make an exception. ;)
"Compilation 3":
VTS_01_1: original.
VTS_02_1 (982KB): DVD Shrink.
VTS_03_1 (1.37MB): IC8.
VTS_04_1 (0.99MB): DVD2One.
Close but no cigar (or is it pipe), Sophocles. :)
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AfterDawn Addict
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10. July 2004 @ 10:06 |
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I believe I hit that nail on the head.
"3rd compilation, row 2-IC8, shrink, dvd21
row 3-shrink, IC8,dvd21 "
GO VOLS !
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. July 2004 @ 10:06
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ddlooping
Senior Member
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10. July 2004 @ 10:15 |
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bigorange, I'm affraid I have absolutely no idea what you mean by "row". :D
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AfterDawn Addict
1 product review
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10. July 2004 @ 10:19 |
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You may not have intentionally changed the settings but the compression rates are different on the files which is evidenced by their sizes. I did a similar test about a month ago but I also included DVDcopy 2, and nero recode. I have to confess that I found it difficult to get a good look at your results because they played through to quickly for me to really give them a close inspection.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. July 2004 @ 10:27
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