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Intel P4 vs AMD
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brobear
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21. March 2006 @ 18:25 |
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Quote:
I said in my last post that the reason that the temperatures were lower in brobears bios than i twas in windows was because he let it idle for a while in Windows.
LOL In your haste you got that backwards, I'm sure you meant "were higher in brobear's BIOS than it was in Windows" as the lower temps were with Asus Probe in Windows. Is that good wine or beer? You're on Spring Break aren't you? ;)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 21. March 2006 @ 18:26
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AfterDawn Addict
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21. March 2006 @ 23:51 |
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I was wondering how long it'd be before that typo was picked up. The temperatures should be higher in the BIOS theoretically as the CPU will be doing more work, and the fan may not spin as fast as in windows with some load-sensitive setups. This is of course comparing to Windows idle, if the system is operative, the BIOS should be cooler.
Brobear, I'm surprised that system isn't stone cold with all that cooling in there!
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 00:35 |
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LOL Any cooler and I'll have to defrost it before running. Considering the human body is running at 37 C, this PC is cool to the touch and barely warm when running hard doing hours of DVD encoding. For now I only have the rear exhaust fan running in addition to the fan on the Zalman "cooler". As I mentioned before, I only have a 170 watt PSU till I get a replacement. This P4 is cool in comparison to some others I've seen and it appears to be cooler than some AMD processors. The Thermaltake case is in anticipation of a later build and is sort of overkill for the system now housed in it.
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ScubaBud
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22. March 2006 @ 02:06 |
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I'm sorry, I could have sworn that after I posted that exact quote and even mentioned it came from Asus Support your first words were:
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wrong again
Yep, they sure were there? That's why I posted the website to clarify once again. Now I see:
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That's exactly what your image capture shows, it supports what I've been saying all along
Being facetious I added the statement; "Should we include that the PC must be turned on as well?" just to make sure that I wasn't accused of not including everything in my statements while under your rule so to speak.
Dance, dance, dance, dance, dance. <G>
Brobear?s original statement:
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Here's a shot of the Asus Probe, that 5 C less than the BIOS reading on the CPU. The MB temp seems to be right on at 32C, the BIOS was reading the same (31 to 32 C).
My first post:
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When Sophocles stated in one of his posts about IDLE temperature differences in Bios setup then when using Asus Probe or a Windows program he was correct since the bios cannot put the CPU in a low power state, only Windows can.
My second post taken directly from Asus Support:
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When Windows is idle, OS will put the CPU into the low-power states (C1,C2 or C3 state). But in BIOS setup, the CPU cannot support these states. So the CPU temperature detected in BIOS H/W Monitor will be several Celsius Degrees higher than in Windows.
Both are clean and clear statements and sufficient to address Brobear?s concern. If someone asks the time of day, there is no need to explain how to build a watch, just answer the man?s question!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 22. March 2006 @ 02:38
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 02:58 |
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LOL Now how do I build a watch, or does building a PC that keeps time count? Hard to carry around though, the CRT monitor alone is more than I want to be carrying. I appreciate the info from all on the why. I got it some time back. System runs hotter in BIOS because Windows can't place it in a lower power state till Windows boots. Makes sense. Strange though that the temp variation in BIOS is only a bit lower than what the CPU reachs after hours of encoding. I don't mind, neither is high. Glad I have the Northwood. ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 03:43 |
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Absolutely, even if I was an Intel fan, I'd look around for Northwoods instead!
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mudearies
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22. March 2006 @ 04:02 |
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AMD.
the allmighty mudearies...
79% Sony Fanboy , 10% xbox fanboy , 11% Kidtendo fanboy. |
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 04:52 |
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The Northwood was probably some of Intel's finest. They went for more speed and left the Northwood architecture behind. On single cores, Intel should take a leap backwards. They're starting to get there with the duo cores, but AMD had a huge headstart with those.
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22. March 2006 @ 05:05 |
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scuba
The quote supported my view and not yours. I've said time and again that
windows uses ACPI trhough the bios and that C1,C2, and C3 states use ACPI and that is done throuhg the bios. Without the use of the bios there would be no C1,C2, or C3 states. By the time windows reaches sthe point of using them it is in IDLE and the temperatures will be lowered. But they are also being lowered in the bios at the same time and nothing will change that.
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 05:56 |
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Oh give it a rest you two!
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 10:50 |
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Actually they support my point of view that BIOS temps vary from ones noticed idling in Windows. LOL
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AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 11:10 |
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Yes but to spend pages arguing about it?
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 11:25 |
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You want an argument? "Who is on first ..."
I think we've covered sensors, thermistors and the like and BIOS and operating temps. After a while the info starts agreeing and the only thing that differs is the personalities involved, or rather in this case remain similar. ;)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 22. March 2006 @ 11:28
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AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 11:31 |
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Anyway, back to the topic in hand, has anyone heard any more on the Conroe CPU?
I'm slightly sceptical, partly because the speeds intel have quote would be near double the speed of the prescott/gallatin, which just seems too unrealistic.
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AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 12:30 |
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I suppose it is a dead argument lost in semantics.LOL
" Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:
Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/. |
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 13:25 |
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And just a few years back sources were saying 3GHz was "The Wall".
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 22. March 2006 @ 13:25
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AfterDawn Addict
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22. March 2006 @ 14:30 |
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Meh, AMD have yet to go over it!
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 19:30 |
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They're gradually getting there. AMD paid attention to the overall design which included memory usage and have beat out the faster Intels for the past couple of years. With Conroe, Intel seems to be following AMD's example; slower, but capable of more work with the duo core architecture.
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... the speeds intel have quote would be near double the speed of the prescott/gallatin, which just seems too unrealistic.
As far as speed goes the Conroe is slower that the fast Presscotts. I wonder if you meant performance instead of speed. The tradeshow Conroe was running at 2.66GHz and those Prescotts are well over 3 (if we're talking about the same CPUs). What are those figures you're referring to? Remember, we like seeing the specs to go with those statements and a link to go with it when possible.
I read an article from AnandTech that previewed the Conroe and noticed the results were good, but not stellar. http://www.anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=2713&p=4 The Conroe previewed by Intel at the tradeshow was a duo core running at 2.66GHz. What I saw from the benches was that AMD wins at encoding and Intel is a better gamer. That's hardly a walk away win, though it does put Intel back in the running, if AMD doesn't pull a surprise of their own.
As far as Conroe making a "monkey" out of the Presscott, look at what the AMD processors have been doing. From that perspective, it doesn't appear that incredible.
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Member
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22. March 2006 @ 19:45 |
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I think Intel hired the the top engineers from amd. so now intel is amd or is amd intell? well i am on second!lol intell will eventually come out on top again! By next year things should get interesting..looking past the conroe.......:)
p-4 3.2 prescott HT curently at 3.6/Abit IC7-G (Abit rule!)/2 Gig Mushkin extream 2.5-2-2-6
LG 20.1 FLATRON WIDESCREEN/BFG 6800 ultra@450 mgz/2 wd raptor 150 raid/Ultra 500 watt Direct connet ps
NZXT GUARDIAN CASE(BLUE)
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Member
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22. March 2006 @ 19:45 |
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I think Intel hired the the top engineers from amd. so now intel is amd or is amd intell? well i am on second!lol intell will eventually come out on top again! By next year things should get interesting..looking past the conroe.......:)
p-4 3.2 prescott HT curently at 3.6/Abit IC7-G (Abit rule!)/2 Gig Mushkin extream 2.5-2-2-6
LG 20.1 FLATRON WIDESCREEN/BFG 6800 ultra@450 mgz/2 wd raptor 150 raid/Ultra 500 watt Direct connet ps
NZXT GUARDIAN CASE(BLUE)
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 20:03 |
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LOL We got it the first time. LOL And the race is on... ;) Interestingly enough, Conroe is still the hardware equivalent of vaporware till it gets to the marketplace and we see what it can actually do. It just leaves people saying "If it works as claimed, ..." With an Extreme version of the Conroe (which we'll probably see later) in comparison to what is being claimed for the standard version (shown at a tradeshow), it's believable that the Conroe could be a viable answer from Intel to AMD's dual core supremacy. Even if AMD comes out with a surprise of their own to nullify the Conroe, Intel still has time for development of a Conroe "Extreme" that can up the ante.
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22. March 2006 @ 20:07 |
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I personally think beyond the conroe. look at all the chips in the last 12 months. mind bogoling. I think it should be named The BALTEK EXTREME EDITION! I think i'll start my e-mails to intel tonight!
p-4 3.2 prescott HT curently at 3.6/Abit IC7-G (Abit rule!)/2 Gig Mushkin extream 2.5-2-2-6
LG 20.1 FLATRON WIDESCREEN/BFG 6800 ultra@450 mgz/2 wd raptor 150 raid/Ultra 500 watt Direct connet ps
NZXT GUARDIAN CASE(BLUE)
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 20:44 |
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Mort81 made an interesting post on PC performance on the RB thread. It's sort of a blast from the past, circa 2004. A Northwood 3.4GHz P4 was $418 at Newegg and Intel had just introduced the Prescott as the Northwood's replacement.
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I found these cpu comparisons interesting http://www.hardcoreware.net/reviews/review-208-1.htm On page three you will see the difference in time to encode video with different cpu's. I don't know how accurate it is and I know AMD has come a long ways since this was published.
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22. March 2006 @ 21:54 |
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brobear, Yes that is very interesting...like looking back in time. still it seems that this quote seems to hold true?
Quote:
If you game more than anything else, I would still recommend the Athlon64. However if you're into working - I'd go for a Pentium 4
or did AMD closed the gap as far as "working"
p-4 3.2 prescott HT curently at 3.6/Abit IC7-G (Abit rule!)/2 Gig Mushkin extream 2.5-2-2-6
LG 20.1 FLATRON WIDESCREEN/BFG 6800 ultra@450 mgz/2 wd raptor 150 raid/Ultra 500 watt Direct connet ps
NZXT GUARDIAN CASE(BLUE)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 22. March 2006 @ 21:55
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brobear
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22. March 2006 @ 22:04 |
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Seems things are changing again. For the longest, Intel had it all. Then AMD crept into the gaming arena. Then, for the past couple of years top AMD processors have been beating the top Intel processors across the board. The tests of the new Conroe showed the Intel having a significant advantage in gaming and the AMD a marginal advantage in encoding. Anandtech favored the Intel over the AMD. Read the Anandtech article from the link I supplied in the previous post.
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