Originally posted by Rich thinks Valve took poetic license:

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I went out to Google, and it looks to me, without doing a lot more research, that Valve took some poetic license. From what I see, max rounds per clip on M16 and M4 and other Colt variants, is 30. (By the way - the M4, which IS a COD4 weapon, is just a colt with a 6" shorter barrel.)

There is a box type clip with 40 rounds, and a helical clip with 90 rounds. Also, the firing rate of the colt is faster than L4D at 10 rounds per second or higher, whereas I measured 8 rounds per second. So it looks like Valve decided to give you more rounds per clip, but slow the gun down a bit.

Not the first time I?ve seen this. The Bullpup in CSS fires much faster when you aren?t looking through the 2x scope. My point being that the gun doesn?t know you are looking through the scope and shouldn?t fire at a slower rate. But, as Miles tells me, Valve does that kind of thing to try to balance out the effect of various guns, lol.

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Originally posted by Rich compares Uzi smg to Colt assault rifle:

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UZI STATISTICS: Total rounds, 530, 50 per clip, 9 full clips of ammo, 10th clip with only 30 rounds. FIRING RATE & RELOAD: The 50 rounds fire in 4 seconds, and the gun reloads in 2 seconds.

COLT STATISTICS: Total rounds 410, 50 per clip. 7 full clips of ammo, 8th clip of only 10 rounds. FIRING RATE & RELOAD: The colt fires 50 rounds in 6 seconds. It reloads also in 2 seconds like the Uzi.

COLT VERSUS UZI: Faster firing rate with uzi - 12.5 rounds per second, versus colt firing rate of 8.33 rounds per second. You are able to empty a 50 round clip into an attacking horde in only 4 seconds versus the more leisurely 6 seconds on the colt.

Total time of full fire to empty: Uzi fires 10 full clips in 40 seconds and last clip in, let's say, 3 more seconds. You reload 10 times, which takes a total of 20 seconds. So with Uzi "fire until you are out of bullets" time is 63 seconds.

The colt fires 8 full clips in 48 seconds. Last clip of 10 fires, let's say, in 1 second. You reload 8 times, for 16 seconds. So with Colt "fire until you are out of bullets" time is 65 seconds.

That is roughly the same firing time, 63 versus 65, for both guns. But the Uzi spits out 25% more ammo during that time period, however with not as much power per bullet as Sam correctly points out. You can see the difference when you do a colt head shot and watch the blood pour out in a bright burst of red, which is kind of funny. You don?t get the same red display using the uzi is my experience.

But, also in my experience, the total number of bullets flying out of the Uzi, 25% more bullets per total time period from full to empty, or 50% more bullets per time period on a per clip basis, makes it a gun that can match the colt, or, perhaps even beat the colt, in close range killing power!!

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Originally posted by harvrdguy:

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How is the L4D coming?

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Originally posted by omegaman7:

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Im about to drop one of those things though, that takes up a great deal of my time. DONT ASK LOL!

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Originally posted by rubixcube:

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Originally posted by omegaman7:

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Im about to drop one of those things though, that takes up a great deal of my time. DONT ASK LOL!

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Caring for a giant hydroponic marijuana setup? LOL!

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Quote:

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Agreed Rich, you really need to work on friendly fire, I'm not great especially when Boomered, but well, frankly, you have no sense of direction or sense of occasion!
We're halfway along the map and hear "wait, where are you guys?" and find you trapped in a window, or cupboard!

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Originally posted by Jeff:

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Look forward to doing it again guys.

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Originally posted by Keith:

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:-) getting L4D tommorow

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Originally posted by Sam, the Olympic Sprinter:

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Agreed Agreed Rich, you really need to work on friendly fire, I'm not great especially when Boomered, but well, frankly, you have no sense of direction or sense of occasion!
We're halfway along the map and hear "wait, where are you guys?" and find you trapped in a window, or cupboard!

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Originally posted by why you shouldn't linger:

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And the lingering behind part - wow - I learned my lesson! Way after midnight, with different players, I was just seconds behind when the team jumped down from the roof top near the beginning of Dead Air - I had just mentally told myself "don't dally" and a split second later I got tongued by a smoker. I yelled out and because the smoker had tongued me from on-top a high-rise, they managed to blow the thing's tongue off, but I was down for the count. They couldn't come back - no way back up. I told them, "don't worry mates, I'll bleed out here in a minute and I?ll see you up ahead." I counted down my life for them, lol. Then, one guy typed out for me an old trick of his, to just go to console and enter "kill" for faster re-spawning!

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Originally posted by don't give the director time to beat you up:

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It is really true, that the more slowly you go through the level, the more zombies and tanks and boomers and hunters the Director throws at you. You get beat to a bloody pulp, and you haven?t gone more than 100 yards! So you are better off blasting through fairly quickly as another team and I discovered much later yesterday on Dead Air - especially trying to get through the offices - and only one guy on the team was at the skill level of Sam or Jeff.

Our first times through, we got hunters, we got boomers, we got a witch, we even got a tank, and of course we got horde after f**king horde. My uzi was fantastic until I ran out of ammo! We were checking every goddamn office looking for damn pills and taking our time - we scanned the rooms quick like Jeff mentioned, but there are tons of little offices in that one section. After failing to get through that level about 3 times in a row, we got mad and we just blasted through, and the Director didn?t have time to throw that much at us. This time the tank was out on the street near the Storage Room safe house. We got inside quickly, without having to kill the tank. We all escaped while the tank was killing one of us, and the level that had repeated over and over endlessly was finally done, and our dead buddy was there with us after reload. That?s one way to do it ? sacrifice a guy ? I remember it well - the dead guy was me. Haha.

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Originally posted by it's not just a shooter:

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By the way, I learned that of course, this is also a strategy game. I was able to help that particular team leader.

There is a section when you come down from the overheads in a train station where there is ammo down below, and then you have to open a door triggering a crescendo event, a massive horde attack. Their strategy was to open the door, throw in a red gasoline can and set it on fire, and then rush up or handle the horde that way. That worked like crap and everybody got the hell beaten out of them and was low on life later and eventually got killed. After a couple times like that, I said ?Look, we?re losing too much life. How about we try to defend from up on top?? There is a leaning yellow girder that takes you back up. I don?t know where I had defended like that ? probably a couple weeks ago - but I had remembered it working well. He said ?Sure we?ll try that.? Much better strategy. Then he and I started working as co-captains.

We got friendly trying to get our very ailing team through that level ? keeping track of total team health packs and total ammo. We weren?t successful the first time ? but back near the start ? after the successful new defense, I asked him ? ?Look, tell me something, where is the next ammo?? He said ?It?s at that place where we?re doing the new overhead defense.?

I said, ?Oh yeah?" Then I said, "Well, ok, that?s not really very far from here. On past attempts we?ve been getting horde after horde, going through this building. I normally try to save my ammo and use dual pistols. But our team has been losing too much health in this building, although right now we?re all pretty healthy. So, I'm thinking, 'No more pistols, full Uzi, use all my ammo, and kill all those sons of bitches!'"

He said ?That sounds good!" Then he said, "Ok guys, that's the strategy - primary weapons, spray those bullets, and don't worry about ammo."

We finally made it out of that level! Knowing the maps is really helpful!! That only comes with experience.

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Originally posted by why you shouldn't start until the team is ready:

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A few hours later another team wanted to defend from the rock. I told them, "Don't start until I'm on top - it takes me a while!" Somebody started anyway. A guy said "Good luck down there!"

Originally posted by why it should have worked anyway with me below:

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It actually should have worked, even with me stuck below, as I think about it now, if they were all shooting accurately and could thin out the horde for me. In fact, thinking about it now, the only real advantage of the rock is that the tank can't get you - and you do have some height advantage to shoot the horde. But a good defense with two crouched in front, should work in front of that rock - it's a corner and they can't come from behind.

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But in any case, they should have waited for me - a couple guys jumped down to help out - and only Zoey got out alive. I watched her use auto shotgun on the tank who stood below her not doing a thing - also unable to climb up. Tomorrow I'm gonna go back with the bots and practice if it takes an hour until I can get up on that stupid rock!!! Hahaha. (It's some kind of Half Life crouch jump with a running start - but some of them didn't seem to need the start - some said go to the corner - but one guy said not quite at the corner. F*ck! I hate those prince of persia jumping tricks!!)

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Originally posted by why Rich loves dual pistols:

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Talking about dealing with tanks, I really love dual pistols! What does a tank have to do with dual pistols ? well they come in handy if you get disabled and you can only use pistols.

As Sam knows, I am always fretting until I get the second pistol. "It's not in EVERY safe room, Rich - we'll find it a bit later." Hahaha. It makes all the difference in the world if you want to save your ammo - you can do a lot of shooting with dual pistols! I think if you're playing with Zoey the bot, that's her weapon!

But I actually finished off killing one tank in Dead Air Advanced with my dual pistols, and I'll bet Sam has probably done that many times also. Somehow the tank nailed me with a chunk of something - way out toward the edge of the map in front of the escape airplane. To my surprise all of a sudden he was on top of me and nobody was close by.

Remembering what Sam said about shooting the tank in the head, I blasted my dual pistols as fast as I could at his little head, and suddenly he keeled over after pounding me about two or three times. I had that happen before but never on Advanced. I heard somebody say "He killed him." I had 12 life after being revived and didn't have time to celebrate, the horde was coming! Lol.

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Originally posted by sammorris:

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Omega: That happens with a lot of programs in win7, not just L4D, seems like a bug with the new OS which is annoying.

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Originally posted by Rich on some in-game timings::

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It's time to dispel some myths. I ran L4D in a window just now and windows time clock in another little window on the giant dell. I watched the sweep second hand.

Myth #1: Some weapons slow you down - NOT TRUE I checked in the street outside the safe house at the start of the Boat House finale. From one end of the street to the other and back, takes 27 seconds. I don't care if you are carrying hunting rifle - which seems like a slower pace - or if you are carrying pipe bomb, or pistols, or shotgun, or auto shotgun, or Colt M16. Total round trip is 27 seconds!! Every weapon runs just as fast. You run slow when you have low life - (but I got down to 40 and still ran in 27 seconds.)

Myth #2: Colt fires slow! No, Sam was closer than I was. Colt fires very fast. I emptied 5 clips = 250 rounds, holding my finger on the trigger the entire time. Total time on colt M16 assault rifle was 30 seconds. That included 4 reloads, whereas before I was measuring 6 seconds per clip, which would have been 30 not counting the reload time. I don't know if the colt was firing faster tonight, or you just can't try to measure one clip. Anyway, total time on Uzi was 26 seconds. I repeated several times - as I say the total times include 4 reloads.

To try to get a feel for reload times, I then tested 10 reloads on the Colt, and got 22 seconds, with usage of 39 rounds. The 22 seconds was measured twice. You have to fire at least one round, so I held down my finger, and as soon as it started firing I let up and hit reload. If reload takes 2 seconds = 20 total, then does the colt fire 39 rounds in 2 seconds, no it takes a bit longer than that, maybe more like 4 seconds, and you also have to factor in my reaction time. Perhaps reload is more like 1.6 seconds. Ten reloads = 16 seconds, 39 rounds is about 4 seconds, total reaction time 2 seconds, or 0.2 seconds to release fire and hit reload per reload. So let's use 1.6 seconds for reload time.

So, subtract 6.4 seconds for 4 reloads: Colt fires 250 rounds in 30-6.4 = 23.6 seconds = 10.6 rps. I had said 8.3, I was wrong. Colt is about 25% faster than I thought.

Uzi fires 250 rounds in 26-6.4 = 19.6 seconds. Uzi rps is 12.8. I had said 12.5 - I was pretty close. It fires 21% faster than the Colt - I had said 50% faster - but the difference is less than I had thought.

Colt 10.6 rps, Uzi 12.8 rps.

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