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The New AMD Building Thread
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2010 @ 15:00 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
Unless they can only use 4 cores or less, in which case it's a pointless investment. The 955 can do everything the 1090 can do otherwise. The 6 cores are fabulous CPUs for existing AMD owners that can use them, otherwise you're better off with a quad, from either brand.
Sam,
I don't know? If I was going to be doing a new AMD Phenom IIx4 955BE build, I think I might spring for the extra $36 and buy the 1055T. With both Intel and AMD now producing 6 core CPUs, I don't think it will be that long before we see a decent sized shift to more Multi-Threaded Apps. The Intel's are far too expensive to buy, for them to have manufactured them, just for the exercise.
For me upgrading the CPU, I would go with the 1090T BE because I can recoup what I paid for my 955BE, quite easily, due to the low price I paid for it and how new it is, to begin with. I would only need to come up with about $150 cash, and I can make very good use of the two extra cores for video encoding.
Russ
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2010 @ 15:03 |
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The AMD X6 CPUs are really only of much use to existing AMD owners though, and many may already have decent CPUs. My point is that, to someone who already owns a 955, they may as well just keep it, rather than buy an X6. To someone who doesn't, they may as well get a 955. The 1055 may only be $36 more, but has to be overclocked a not insubstantial amount to perform on equal per-core, 2.8 to 3.4. As you rightly point out, most people don't overclock.
For people who use apps that can take advantage of 6 threads on a regular basis, they are of course a much more viable. For the majority though, they aren't a worthwhile upgrade.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 18. July 2010 @ 15:04
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AfterDawn Addict
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18. July 2010 @ 15:19 |
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Originally posted by sammorris:
The AMD X6 CPUs are really only of much use to existing AMD owners though, and many may already have decent CPUs. My point is that, to someone who already owns a 955, they may as well just keep it, rather than buy an X6. To someone who doesn't, they may as well get a 955. The 1055 may only be $36 more, but has to be overclocked a not insubstantial amount to perform on equal per-core, 2.8 to 3.4. As you rightly point out, most people don't overclock.
For people who use apps that can take advantage of 6 threads on a regular basis, they are of course a much more viable. For the majority though, they aren't a worthwhile upgrade.
Sam,
Damn! Shot down with my own words! :) You are right though, it's only worth it for the Enthusiast! We have met the Minority, and they is Us! LOL!
Russ
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18. July 2010 @ 15:27 |
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Sure. I'd love to have an X6 to play with in video encoding apps if I actually used them, overclocking the heck out of it would produce some seriously nice numbers. Fact is though, what one core of an AMD can do at 4ghz, a core of even an i5 can do at 3Ghz, an i7 could probably manage a little bit more, and I'm willing to bet you can still overclock i5s and i7s a fair bit further on conventional hardware. As an existing AMD owner who's at enthusiast level and encodes video, the X6 is the perfect CPU, and even to someone building a new system solely video editing, the X6 is probably the better choice. If non-enthusiast, it's not such a hot deal though, and if gaming is more of the main concern, forget it, for now at least. Personally I see Intel's approach as relatively sound. The sort of people who can make use of six core machines fully are typically businesses buying top-grade machines, and when you can afford the extreme CPUs, the hex i7s are in a class of their own, not to mention they still overclock like hellfire. Once six cores become beneficial in other areas, I reckon mainstream 6-core CPUs may appear, but in truth, I think by the time this happens 8-core CPUs will be around, and it may end up being a bit of a washout.
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Red_Maw
Senior Member
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19. July 2010 @ 01:09 |
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I was looking them from the stand point of having to buy the cpu, MB and ram. Obviously if all you need is a cpu that's the most cost effective route.
btw if I'm not mistaken hasn't AMD already released an 8-core cpu?
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19. July 2010 @ 02:15 |
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Originally posted by Red_Maw:
I was looking them from the stand point of having to buy the cpu, MB and ram. Obviously if all you need is a cpu that's the most cost effective route.
btw if I'm not mistaken hasn't AMD already released an 8-core cpu?
Red_Maw,
Those were Opteron 6100 series, Server chips for socket G34 server motherboards. Not only 8 cores, but 12 cores as well. From the 8 core 1.8GHz 65w 6124HE to the 12 core 2.36GHz 115w 6176HE. All have 4MB of L2 and 12MB of L3 cache. I would imagine that some of these will wind up as either Socket AM3, or a new socket for the general consumer market. I'm betting on AM3 for the 65w 1.8Ghz 6124 and the 80w 2.0GHz 6128, replacing the current two 6 cores, at about $265 and $295 respectively!
Just think, we have Bobcat and Bulldozer to Look forward to in 2011. Things are getting exciting at AMD!
Russ
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 19. July 2010 @ 02:23
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AfterDawn Addict
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19. July 2010 @ 03:27 |
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Well I figure look at the Clawhammer Opterons. We had Athlon 64 architecture in those well before the technology hit consumer grade. It's only a matter of time before 8 core CPUs trickle down and we have even more hardware to play with. Sure the 6 core Phenom II is a beast but, like Sam says, not really useful for a gamer. That's why I still haven't given up my original run 940. Outside of a few CPU whore games, it performs spectacularly.
I think the next CPU upgrade I jump on will be Bulldozer. They sound a lot more confident about it than they ever did with Phenom I. I'd really like to see AMD take the lead again after so long being restricted to the budget and value market. Sure my Phenom II is an excellent performing CPU, but it still doesn't touch an i5 or i7. I suppose if I bought that 30" screen and the graphics hardware to use it, I'd have had an i5 long ago. But as it stands, keeping my graphics setup tame has allowed me to squeak by with my Phenom II for now.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388 |
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Red_Maw
Senior Member
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20. July 2010 @ 01:05 |
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Hmm okay so those Opteron 6100 cpu's were what I was thinking of. Not to burst any bubbles but if I remember correctly the last thing I heard about them was that they barely compete with the intel 6-cores. Bulldozer on the other hand still shows some promise. Even if they don't beat or provide stiff competition to i5/i7 cpu's I'm interested in seeing how AMD's "inverse hyper-threading" works out. With programming for parallel computing still a long way off something like that might just be the performance boost we've been waiting for.
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walri
Newbie
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20. July 2010 @ 16:47 |
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Hey guys,
I'm about to build an AMD box running off a ASUS M4N98TD EVO AM3 mobo with a AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz Processor and had a compatibility question. I checked the specs of the mobo and it says that the only rear panel port for optical drives is a S/PDIF Out port. I've always wanted a blu ray player in my machine and was wondering if I could use a blu ray optical drive (the LITE-ON Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM SATA Internal BD-COMBO Model ihes108-29 - OEM) with SATA only interface with the ASUS M4N98TD EVO AM3 mobo.
Thanks guys,
J
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AfterDawn Addict
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20. July 2010 @ 17:32 |
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Excellent drive man. But I'm not sure what you're asking.
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20. July 2010 @ 17:37 |
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Originally posted by walri:
Hey guys,
I'm about to build an AMD box running off a ASUS M4N98TD EVO AM3 mobo with a AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz Processor and had a compatibility question. I checked the specs of the mobo and it says that the only rear panel port for optical drives is a S/PDIF Out port. I've always wanted a blu ray player in my machine and was wondering if I could use a blu ray optical drive (the LITE-ON Black 8X BD-ROM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM SATA Internal BD-COMBO Model ihes108-29 - OEM) with SATA only interface with the ASUS M4N98TD EVO AM3 mobo.
Thanks guys,
J
walri,
The S/PDIF is for sound only! The Optical goes to a FiberOptic cable, and plugs into a special port on many sound systems.
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20. July 2010 @ 17:38 |
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SPDIF is an external audio interface, if you have a home receiver to connect or other external system, not using the computers on board audio.
If you have a BD reader you can still hear the onboard audio using only SATA.
EDIT:And TheOne wins by 1 (minute)
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 20. July 2010 @ 17:40
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walri
Newbie
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20. July 2010 @ 22:38 |
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So basically they will be compatible with one another? What I'm really asking is where I would be able to attach (in which port) the blu ray player on this particular motherboard.
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Senior Member
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20. July 2010 @ 23:11 |
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All data passes through SATA to motherboard similar to a DVD/CD drive, similar to a hard disc drive.
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Red_Maw
Senior Member
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21. July 2010 @ 01:13 |
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Originally posted by walri:
So basically they will be compatible with one another? What I'm really asking is where I would be able to attach (in which port) the blu ray player on this particular motherboard.
One end of the sata cable goes into the BD player and the other into a port on the MB.
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AfterDawn Addict
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21. July 2010 @ 01:19 |
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And PLEASE don't do it while the Mobo is running. You can wreak havoc on the Southbridge and channel doing that. My brother made that mistake on one of his Dell boards. It fried one of the IDE channels :(
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21. July 2010 @ 01:41 |
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AfterDawn Addict
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21. July 2010 @ 03:20 |
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The GTS250 is faster, period.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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21. July 2010 @ 03:26 |
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Originally posted by Estuansis:
The GTS250 is faster, period.
Estuansis,
I like the 1GB MSI card. Just wondering if the extra 512MB of memory is worth the money difference? A lot of people on line say yes!
Russ
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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21. July 2010 @ 05:53 |
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the gts250 is quicker, but they are based of the same tech unfortunately. Both are G92b GPUs, just the GTS250 has 128 "cuda cores" (aka stream proccessors) and the 9800GT has 112.
basically what nvidia have done is:
8800GTS 512MB> 9800GTX> 9800GTX+> GTS250.
all the same core, just branded differently over 3 different generatioms, just because most of the public won't have a clue as to what has happened. Yes there has beena die shrink and an oc, but essentially it's the exact same card.
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21. July 2010 @ 06:10 |
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GTS250 and 9800GT are indeed identical, save clock speeds and unlocked processors, and while the 9800GT isn't quite as old as 3 years, the 9800GT is indeed identical, including clock speeds, to the 8800GT, which will be three years old in about november.
GTS250 and 9800GT are indeed identical, save clock speeds and unlocked processors, and while the 9800GT isn't quite as old as 3 years, the 9800GT is indeed identical, including clock speeds, to the 8800GT, which will be three years old in about november.
All of these cards are, save differing numbers of processors, memory and clock speeds, the same card.
8800GS
8800GT
8800GTS 512MB
9600GSO (G92 version)
9600GT (G92 version)
9800GT
9800GTX
9800GTX+
9800GX2 (though obviously this is two of them)
GTS150
GT230 v2
GTS240
GTS250
GT330
8800M GTS
8800M GTX
9800M GT
9800M GTX
GTX260 M
GTX280 M
GTX285 M
Quadro FX 2800M
QUadro FX 3600M
Quadro FX 3700M
Quadro FX 3800M
Quadro VX 200
Quadro FX 3700
Quadro FX 4700X2 (2 GPUs)
Gets around a bit, that architecture, doesn't it?
This is just the G92 as well, not its weaker spin-off, the G94, which is otherwise very similar.
As for rough performance comparisons, it looks something like this:
Radeon HD5770: 1100
Radeon HD4860: 1050
Geforce GTS250: 1000
Radeon HD4850: 1000
Radeon HD4770: 980
Radeon HD5750: 950
Geforce 9800GTX: 920
Geforce 8800GTX: 890
Geforce 8800GTS 512MB: 860
Geforce 9800GT: 760
Geforce 8800GT: 750
Radeon HD4830: 750
Geforce GT240: 660
Geforce 9600GT: 560
Radeon HD5670: 550-600
Radeon HD3870: 500-550
Geforce 9600GSO: 490-500
Geforce 8800GTS 320/640: 490-500
Geforce 8800GS: 490-500
Radeon HD5570: 440-490
Radeon HD4670: 420-470
Radeon HD3850: 400-450
Geforce GT220: 340
Radeon HD4650: 275
Geforce 9500GT: 240
Geforce 8600GTS: 240
Radeon HD3650: 210
Radeon HD5450: 150
Radeon HD2600XT: 120
Radeon HD2400XT: 80
Geforce 9400GT: 70
Geforce 8500GT: 65
Radeon HD2600 Pro: 65
Geforce 8400GS: 55
Geforce G210: 50
Radeon HD3450: 50
1GB GTS250s are marginally faster than their 512MB counterparts even if you ignore the memory size, but it's not much of a jump. If a 1GB card is cheap, buy that, otherwise there's no need to go hunting for the 1GB version, not with a resolution below 1920x1200 at least.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 21. July 2010 @ 06:30
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21. July 2010 @ 15:54 |
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Sam,
After looking over the information you provided, I guess the GTS 250 with 512mb of memory would probably be my best choice for an nVidia card. I'll keep my eyes on this MSI then.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/NewProduct...N82E16814127495
I'm not ready to order just yet, as I have to get the 9500GT sent back to MSI first.
Thanks again, Sam.
Russ
GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor
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Red_Maw
Senior Member
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21. July 2010 @ 22:39 |
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Originally posted by omegaman7:
And PLEASE don't do it while the Mobo is running. You can wreak havoc on the Southbridge and channel doing that. My brother made that mistake on one of his Dell boards. It fried one of the IDE channels :(
I do that all the time with hdds, is that problem only with ODs?
Originally posted by theonejrs:
Oman7,
I know the suggestion was made to me where I would unplug and plug in the monitor while the power is on. Ain't happening, at least not by me!
Russ
I do that all the time too lol. Never had a problem, maybe I'm just lucky.
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Senior Member
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22. July 2010 @ 00:20 |
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Technically speaking, SATA specs say it was made to be hot-swap able, but your BIOS settings can affect this ( AHCI, RAID=yes, native IDE=no), as well as mobo controller age/type and I believe I read somewhere (can't find it now to properly cite) that older drives that have both molex and sata power options won't work using molex but will with sata power.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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22. July 2010 @ 00:43 |
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I guess it's simply a good guideline to shut the the system down ;) Plus his blown channel was IDE. IDE probably doesn't like that LOL!
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