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Post Your Bad Media Experiences Here
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AfterDawn Addict
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10. December 2005 @ 15:46 |
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I agree on the burner support, none of mine support -DL's. I bitset all my DL's because I have 2 Toshiba DVD standalones and a Panasonic DVD Recorder that only play -R media, it was one of the main reasons I bought my Plextor so that I would be able to use +R media, which I think plays better on them than the -R. Also according to LUK! you cannot tell a DVD-DL where to put a layer break, as you can with a +DL. This is from one of his posts on using ImgBurn (Decrypter) for burning DL's.
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Here is an extract from the Mt. Fuji Command Manual for Multimedia Devices - Version 6.
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4.17.4 Recording mode for DVD-R Dual Layer media
DVD-R Dual Layer media makes use of sequential recording as well as Single Layer discs. DVD-R Dual Layer media supports three kind of recording modes. They are Disc-at-Once (DAO) recording, Incremental recording, and Layer Jump recording. Once a recording mode is determined, the recording mode shall not be changed afterwards.
4.17.4.1 DAO recording
DAO recording is supported by DVD-R Dual Layer media by using Format 1 RMD. Lead-in through Lead-out is recorded in one recording action. The Middle Area on L0 and L1 may be recorded after Lead-out is written. The Layer Jump Address is fixed location and is not changeable.
When DAO recording is used, all unrecorded user Data Area shall be recorded. When the amount of user data to be recorded is less than the capacity of L0, the Shifted Middle Area may be used as an exceptional case.
http://forum.imgburn.com/index.php?showtopic=183
From what I read you are better off using the +DL's and booktyping if you can because you cannot change the layer break in a -DL as you can in a +DL.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 10. December 2005 @ 15:47
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Moderator
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10. December 2005 @ 23:55 |
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hey that's nice info there from all re the DL stuff; i'm still not gonna go DL at any point but i can file the info away somewhere in the old noggin
Main PC ~ Intel C2Q Q6600 (G0 Stepping)/Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3/2GB Crucial Ballistix PC2-8500/Zalman CNPS9700/Antec 900/Corsair HX 620W
Network ~ DD-WRT ~ 2node WDS-WPA2/AES ~ Buffalo WHR-G54S. 3node WPA2/AES ~ WRT54GS v6 (inc. WEP BSSID), WRT54G v2, WRT54G2 v1. *** Forum Rules *** |
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brobear
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11. December 2005 @ 09:14 |
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I'm with you creaky. Looks like we'll be seeing HD DVD and/or blue ray before we see those DL prices get low enough to be usable. With the transcoding and encoding software improvements, I can backup most any DVD without editing more than the sound track and still have high quality on my 60 inch TV screen using the DVD5 media.
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Senior Member
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11. December 2005 @ 09:53 |
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brobear-You said it ! Anyhow not every movie would require using DL- media even if you wanted to/ prices dropped ! Yes Many would but not all ! & I agree with you & creaky ! Happy Holidays!
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. December 2005 @ 09:54
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AfterDawn Addict
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11. December 2005 @ 11:14 |
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i'm just the type to never limit my experiences with just one "type" of disc, and compounded on the fact i'm a very obsessive buyer, that's why i have gotten my feet wet w/ DVD+R DLs :)
excessive/compulsive = buy media in BULK for me~ :) i can never be happy with 50-100 discs, i simply add a "zero" to the end of the quantity and then take it from there...lol
that's just me, but, i can see with the prices of DLs being quite pricey, there are other alternatives at this point with GOOD QUALITY dvd5s for under $0.40/piece here in the U.S. :)
happy burning and happy holidays all~
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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brobear
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11. December 2005 @ 15:47 |
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Until just recently, the price of DL was so high, one might as well buy 2 copies of a DVD if they wanted a backup. For those of us with large video libraries, the price of backups would be huge if we went with those. Most transcoders like DVDCopy3, Recode2, and Shrink (using quality settings) can handle the compression on most movies using DVD5. For those big blockbusters, there's Rebuilder with CCE or one of the other good encoders. So, it isn't much of a loss in quality (if any that's visual). A friend of mine has a big screen projector and his DVD5 backups do great on the big screen.
The cost of acquiring the original DVDs is bad enough. Good thing it's spread over a few years or our spouses would be in revolt. Though I'm not always practical, I just see spending my money on other things than pricey media, like newer equipment. I'll toy with DL a little just to say I dabbled, but I doubt there will be many around my house until the prices plummet.
Happy Holidays.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. December 2005 @ 15:48
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AfterDawn Addict
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11. December 2005 @ 16:02 |
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@brobear
once again, your point of reason is unsurpassed...i totally agree. :)
makes a valid arguement in continual use of dvd5s, i just use the DL media when i feel a movie is REALLY GOOD in my opinion, and i DO want all the extras, deleted scenes, bloopers, etc... :)
Happy Holidays to you my friend,
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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brobear
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11. December 2005 @ 16:51 |
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I'm just glad we've had those low cost DVD5s to rely on. Have you tried RB/CCE? I use it when I have a good movie I want the best backup quality for. I keep the entire disc with the software set to keep only 1 language (when more than one is available). I just did full backups of "The Dukes of Hazzard" and "Fantastic Four"; 7.4 and 7.5GB respectively. Excellent picture quality on my 60 inch screen, so I don't feel I'm losing anything by using the DVD5 format. It does take a bit more time to encode than a direct recording with DL, but the software can run while I'm sleeping or doing something else equally as enjoyable. The RB/CCE is notoriously slow, but then so is Shrink with Quality Settings in use. The programs like Recode2 and DVDCopy3 are best for those who are in a hurry.
I suspect the current DVD formats will be with us for a while yet. I know I'm not going to mortgage any of the family in order to run out and get all the new "stuff". I'm going to sit back and see how this one plays out.
Just around the corner we have the high definition movies. That's going to be an interesting media problem as well as equipment and recording problem. I hope everyone has been paying attention. 2006 is going to be an interesting year if everything comes out that is scheduled. Microsoft will be releasing the new OS, Vista (the old codename was Longhorn). That will tie into the encryption from the movie industry on the new high definition format. Then we'll have issues with equipment that will play the movies and record it. There's supposed to be built in limits on how often we can do a backup. Many of the monitors we have now won't play the new format, blocked by encryption and Vista. Keeping XP isn't supposed to be an option, as it isn't supposed to have the drivers or the support for the newer systems coming up. We're worrying about bucks with media now, we're soon to be facing a new nightmare covering media, software, and hardware. It's going to take quite a beefy PC to even run the new Vista and new hardware systems. Think 2GB RAM, new monitors, whatever drives for the new media (HD DVD or blu ray), and a 64 bit processor; and that's not even considering new gpus and sound cards. The industry really gave us something to think about for the New Year.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 11. December 2005 @ 16:59
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. December 2005 @ 02:10 |
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Quote:
I know I'm not going to mortgage any of the family in order to run out and get all the new "stuff"
I too, have no plans on running out to buy the new "stuff", in fact too many stores are still selling the old "stuff" so as you stated things will not change for awhile. I only use DL's to backup movies I really care about and those seem to be few, DVD RB does an excellent job and since I only do movie only there is minimal loss of quality.
I still like to err on cautions side and burn at 4x, but do go 8x with my Plex with no problems. Now they are coming out with 18X burners, speed seems to be the thing, yet I'm not sure this is really necessary. Guess I am getting too old, lol
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brobear
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12. December 2005 @ 03:15 |
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I have no idea what the speeds will be with HD DVD and blu-ray. One of those will be the option if we want to record high definition movies. At least that is what's on the menu, if things don't change. DL will turn into one of those older formats. Then maybe they'll drop those prices so the working man can afford them. As I said before, I think it's going to be interesting to see what happens.
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Moderator
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12. December 2005 @ 03:39 |
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i can definitely see me losing interest in all the newer technology like blu-ray, HDTV, Vista yada yada yada (or should (or should i say consumer-blocking technology!). i like gadgets as much as the next man but not if i have to sell my soul just to buy the darn stuff and then jump thru five times more hoops just to do anything technical. i can see me sticking to my current dvd collectoin and just going to the cinema in the future instead of all the new technology :)
Main PC ~ Intel C2Q Q6600 (G0 Stepping)/Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3/2GB Crucial Ballistix PC2-8500/Zalman CNPS9700/Antec 900/Corsair HX 620W
Network ~ DD-WRT ~ 2node WDS-WPA2/AES ~ Buffalo WHR-G54S. 3node WPA2/AES ~ WRT54GS v6 (inc. WEP BSSID), WRT54G v2, WRT54G2 v1. *** Forum Rules ***
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. December 2005 @ 03:45 |
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Just when I get everything working in synch they always through out something new, with a pricetag that is way beyond my means. I remember my first VCR cost 350.00 and look at them now. We had the BetaMax and VHS battle and then out came laser disks (who even remembers them) and now HD and Blu-Ray. I figure it will take awhile to get it all sorted and til then I will stick with what works for me and my wallet.
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Senior Member
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12. December 2005 @ 04:28 |
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arniebear- & friends Yes Early adopters pay the price for being 1st kid on the block with the new toys !And many times the kinks or bugs are'nt fully worked out yet ! So sometimes your paying the price twice ( repair Cost ) IT's that way with Consumer Electronics = Audio /video equipment ! and also with Computers & associated equipment ( peripherals ect... I agree with you gentlemen that it's great that DVD+R DL media has dropped in price recently albeit not enoough! and I agree with the idea of possibly trying a couple of DVD+R DL disc just to say I've dabbled as was said and to see how compatable with players it will be ! But Mainly I plan to stick with DVD5 in both + & - formats for the immediate future ! Also thanx for the info about bitetting and DVD+R DL media compatability with standa alones ! Apparently my burner is capable of bitsetting DL media should I ever buy it ! Thanks to all for the enlightening & informative post ! Happy Holidays & Happy Burning!!!!!
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princosux
Newbie
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21. December 2005 @ 19:58 |
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went to use my princo dvd of family and no longer works ...what do I do now??? Is it all lost
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AfterDawn Addict
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21. December 2005 @ 20:26 |
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ouch~ as ur screen name implies, yes, princo DO sux~ :)
well, i've had my Princo's fail shortly after burning...some lasted 3 months, some less...but, all in all, they ALL do not work anymore.
you COULD possibly try using DVD Decrypter to RIP, and see if you can even get them onto your harddrive...this suggestion MAY or MAY NOT work, but, a little hope is better than ZERO hope right?
while, personally, none of my Princos will even RIP, let alone play, too many errors that all my programs just simply "give up"...but, you MAY have better luck...
try ripping them and getting them onto your hard drive, using either File Mode or ISO READ mode in decrypter...out of what programs I personally own, decrypter has been MY life-saver on those hard to rip discs (that were scratched, dirty, unplayable, etc)...for ME, if decrypter can't do it, nothing else i have will, it's my FINAL SOLUTION...good luck
docTY~
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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brobear
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22. December 2005 @ 02:44 |
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Quote:
decrypter has been MY life-saver on those hard to rip discs (that were scratched, dirty, unplayable, etc)
I don't know about the etc, but Skip Dr or one of the other resurfacing tools might help out on those scratched up discs with surface flaws on the outer laminate layer. I've saved a number of unreadable discs that way, ones that even DVD Decrypter or recovery software couldn't read.
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rick5446
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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22. December 2005 @ 06:20 |
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I have had some luck with CD Check when it comes to recovering my DVD's.But it takes a while[Hrs].I'll use DVDDecrypter to recover all the data that it will,by individualy selecting ea file seperately to rip,the ones it does'nt I use CD Check to recover
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brobear
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22. December 2005 @ 07:09 |
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When the problem is deterioration of the inner dye layer, there's not much hope. Whether from physical damage or just poor manufacture or bad materials, once the inner layer loses the digital data, there's nothing that can be done, it's gone to the "black hole". ;) So, what you get is often just parts of the original. I'd just redo the project. I realize the original sometimes gets misplaced. ;) When just scratches on the outer laminate surface, resurfacing does the trick better than recovery software. Even with the recovery software, the optical head has to be able to pick up the digital data. Recovery software usually just tries more reads and doesn't time out as easily, but ends up skipping bad sectors. Good luck.
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rick5446
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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22. December 2005 @ 08:30 |
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Well I agree with U brobear..except if it might be your home videos..& it happens to be your only copy..U can still recover some of it no matter how disappointed U might be
I have found that in some cases its just a matter of a few seconds that are unrecoverable,with just a few distorted areas..But when U do hit that bad block no computer will copy it,your only recourse is to try a recovering program or spend the hours re-doing.I would only recommend this for personal home videos,not on a movie.As I said earlier it is time consuming..but recovery,lets the program do all the work in some cases it is worth a try.Just a personal opinion
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brobear
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22. December 2005 @ 15:02 |
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Of course it's worth a try. A person should use everything at their disposal, especially if it's something not replacable such as home movies. I was just adding to your statement, not trying to detract from it.
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rick5446
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22. December 2005 @ 15:50 |
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Funny you should say that brobear..cause thats all I was doing..seems like this is going to be chaptered with different directors Hahaaaa
Stay tuned for the exicting chapter 5 of the recovery of the tainted DISC. U don't wanna miss it.Just hope we get to hear the out come!After all it is nice to get feed back on any suggestions that are posted, Negative as well as Positive
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brobear
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23. December 2005 @ 01:08 |
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Recovery is an either/or proposition. The lucky get their "stuff" back and the unlucky don't. You naturally get varying responses as to how well it worked out depending on the user and how crappy the media was that crapped out.
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SlitanJ
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26. December 2005 @ 17:10 |
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About the DVD5 - DVD9 / -bluray HDDVD progress...
First of all I too do think the next-gen optical drives will be a significant progress. Great increase in space and somewhat in speed.
As is the DVD9 somewhat like.
But I do too to think of their's not-so-usefulness. In the not-so-worthy of my money way.
Generally I think the whole concept of "burning discs", (i.e. special software, susceptibility to failure, sensible medium, generally write-only, cumbersome in writing) is reaching its limits.
The more the optical drives(and discs) become "faster and larger in capacity, the more the "burning process" becomes of problem. Discs easily fail, writings easily fail, times get longer.
Where that progress (even with it's shortcomings) comes really handy, is in movies, where the one-disc concept is really usefull. Movies are to be read slowly and lineraly, and never to be edited. And they are meant to be of the disc's exact size. Yet still, what you really earn is a fidelity you propably cannot distinguish [since you propably never have the required equipment to play them back at their full capacity], let alone how useful actually that is.
Ofcourse such would go for audio too, only DVD-AUDIO players are not that frequent (yet?).
Anyway, for the general-use data, you need somewhere where you can add and remove it freely, and not in chunks of disc size. You need it in an easily manageable medium.
If it is to be on a burnt disc, whether it is in 4 or 50 GB how much of a difference would that make? You wouldn't be able to reproduce and perceive results better than DVD-VIDEO, you already can't with DVD-AUDIO, unless for an unsignificant few. You would still need numberous discs.
That is why, against other technological advances, is met with disregard.
Usually, when an advance is useful and thus really needed, it is met with the enthusiasm of people eager to acquire it. As such were the CD and DVD, or new processors for some period of time. As it was with audio cards.Perhaps as still is with 'VGA cards'. Or more propably as is with network links.
Technology is measured in usefulness, not 'goodness'.
What would really make a difference, would be a single piece of equipment that would 'bring' data in an even more easily accesed way.
Magnetic storage has its own serious problems of protection. That was something the optical disc drives supposedly resolved.
Maybe something in the usb-stick progress could be more of an advance.
Discs are nice for handling out things. One of floppy's great advantages, was its reusability. Someone gave you something in a floppy, you would most often keep it in a hardisk and then use the same floppy to give out something of yours, to someone totally different. It would keep on pileing on. You just needed a 'pool' of floppies, makeing use of them in a 'flowing' way. RW technology could be used, yet still the vast majority of optical discs kept collectively, are ROMs.
Optical discs have their limits in use. What is really needed is not yet another better CD-ROM.
Machine, so in itself being a great power in diminishing labour and creating goods, so does it bring excessive harshness and hunger.
In a fate's weird vice, new sources of fortune, transform to one's of suffering.
K.M.
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Senior Member
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27. December 2005 @ 04:41 |
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SlitanJ wait for it ! The price of DL media has.nt come down enough yeT ! So Oh yes I'm gonna go out and buy a new more expensive format & Newer More expensive hardware ! I'm going to wait for the actual technology to hit the mass market first ! before I dump current dvd technology ! Like I said wait for it & the price will drop !My 1st cd burner a HP 2x unit cost me almost 400.00 my second cd burner was almost 300.00 with tax - & it was a 10X unit ! my 1st dvd burner vast me about $100.00 and is a 8X Nec , My second dvd burner cost me $42.00 and is a 16x DL capable Nec-3500A ! Point I'm making is Quailty & features go up and prices drop over time ! But like you I.m staying with the current tech atleast for now!
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brobear
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27. December 2005 @ 07:32 |
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What's a floppy? LOL That technology is getting so old, I have one, but I rarely use it. I used to have a boot floppy, but that isn't necessary anymore. Lot's of PCs nowadays don't even have one. It's usually an option on new sytems. Point being, useful technology gets dated and becomes less useful.
BIGTOXY69's suggestion of "wait and see" coincides with mine. Anybody need a Zip drive? I bought into the wrong technology before. So, it makes sense to see what is going to end up being the mainstream offerings. I suspect CDs and DVDs will be with us for a few more years. They'll probably be a bit more useful than floppies.
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Optical discs have their limits in use. What is really needed is not yet another better CD-ROM.
Actually I wouldn't mind seeing a better DVD +/- R/RW drive. The technology has been improving on those. As for those CD ROM drives, they've had CD players for the longest. Developers would be hard pressed to come up with something new on those lines. Without the optical format, we'd be without our CDs and DVDs. I think I'd rather give up the floppies. With the optical format being advanced and the technology growing, we need those newer and better drives. With the new video formats coming from the movie industry, the current DVD technology will fall short. High definition movies, when they come into production, will require more space per disc than what is currently available; hence blu-ray and HD DVD.
SlitanJ
I agree, we don't need a new CD-ROM drive. However, I think that the optical formats have been much more useful in the advancement of PCs than the floppy and we can benefit from improvements. As to popularity, just look at what people are using. Software apps, music, data, videos, and photos are all being stored to disc as a portable media. Maybe optical drives will go the way of the floppy, but it doesn't look like that for now. Anyone hanging onto floppies... all I can say is, give em up and join the rest of the world in the 21st century. Anybody want some old floppies? (They probably wouldn't be worth shipping costs though.) ;)
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