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The Official Graphics Card and PC gaming Thread
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AfterDawn Addict
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28. April 2010 @ 03:14 |
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I may look to selling some of my stuff, so I can upgrade LOL! Or, I'll just be patient. I do have some things to sell though. For instance, I have a wireless router and PCI adapter card that are still in the box, that I can't see using now. By the time I need such a device, it'll probably be too slow ;) Long story why I have them...
The 260 is fairing ok with most modern games. And the 965 should get me by for a while. I've only seen a handful of processes capable of bringing it to its knees ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
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28. April 2010 @ 03:17 |
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Yeah the GTX260, especially your 216 model, is a very capable video card with any modern title. The few demanding games out there that challenge it are brand spanking new. There are still yet games to come out you could probably max.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388 |
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28. April 2010 @ 05:59 |
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Jeff: I can certainly see the appeal of the Phenom II X6. If there were a similarly priced hex for i5 I'd be sorely tempted as well. Add to that the Phenom II X6 is hands down the best CPU AMD have ever made. It ups the core count to 6 while retaining the 120W power draw of the newest 955/965 steppings, thus it can overclock to 4Ghz on air.
However, ultimately it is still a Phenom II, which means versus your 940 there is no benefit per core per clock cycle. You are either buying higher clock speed (a waste, with your 940 already at 3.7) or the extra cores. So it comes down to whether you'll use the extra cores. 4 cores, the 1090 is just a 965. Six, and it's a midrange i7 (as in, 870/940/950). If the upgrade is almost solely concerned with gaming, I wouldn't bother. If it's concerned with video encodes and rendering that can use all 6 cores, go for it, it's well worth the money.
Good to hear you've got your second 5850, that's turning into a seriously powerful machine :P
Rich: I wouldn't leap at suggesting two HD5850s over an HD5970 for someone with a full 32x bandwidth. They'd get slightly more performance but I'd want to make sure that's all they wanted to do before suggesting it. An HD5970 is a fair bit more expensive, but occupies a lot less space, and more importantly, allows for extra GPUs to be added, or alternatively, something else to use the slots otherwise unusable with two cards installed. For many, it's a no-brainer, the two 5850s win every time because they're a lot cheaper, but the 5970 price is falling in the UK, so it's not necessarily an easy choice, depending on the user.
You seem to have overlooked the article we posted about how GPUs perform at 4x bandwidth. Remember, you cited Far Cry 2 being bad, but that was the only case of the three games where there was any effect at all. There is a much more comprehensive review from I think it was Tweaktown, that tested over a dozen games, with the exception of STALKER Clear Sky, all of them showed 5% drop or less, running an HD5870 GPU at 4x.
The one difference is that sadly said article did not consider minimums. This is something I will have to look into, but bear in mind, even if the drop in minimum fps works out to be 12% on average, running 3/4 GPUs is still very much worth it, as even with only 50% scaling on the additional GPUs it more than makes up for the difference.
Q9450 and an HD5850 tricky to say, at stock clocks not a great deal, low teens thousands. Get the CPU up to 3.7-3.8Ghz and you might get close to 20,000, you may even go over it.
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AfterDawn Addict
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28. April 2010 @ 08:14 |
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Quote:
If the upgrade is almost solely concerned with gaming, I wouldn't bother. If it's concerned with video encodes and rendering that can use all 6 cores, go for it, it's well worth the money.
I'm not too watchful of encoding times and whatnot. I've never done it enough to tweak my PC specifically for it. As you probably guessed, this build is 100% gaming focused. I want to find out conclusively whether or not it helps in certain games. It's an afterthought really, but it is a CPU upgrade for my current platform. That's why it's so tempting. Why go all-out and switch to i5, when I could just get a 6 core Phenom II? That plus considering it uses the newest stepping means it would probably OC higher too. I'm interested to see where the prices settle down to. It could very well be my next CPU upgrade.
Quote:
You seem to have overlooked the article we posted about how GPUs perform at 4x bandwidth. Remember, you cited Far Cry 2 being bad, but that was the only case of the three games where there was any effect at all. There is a much more comprehensive review from I think it was Tweaktown, that tested over a dozen games, with the exception of STALKER Clear Sky, all of them showed 5% drop or less, running an HD5870 GPU at 4x.
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/H..._Scaling/1.html
Read em and weep. Barely any performance loss down to 4x. Theoretically then, even 16x/4x Crossfire would be worth using. If so, I know a few budget board users who will be jumping on the Crossfire bandwagon :P
Of course, 2560 x 1600 on 1x is obviously out of the question due to the sheer data throughput needed. But up to 1920 x 1200 with 4x is consistently within ~5% at all times. I daresay those results are pretty conclusive. They run something like 22 tests with consistent results all the way through.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 28. April 2010 @ 08:22
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AfterDawn Addict
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28. April 2010 @ 08:17 |
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Quad cores for gaming make sense for the most part, but they're far from being properly utilised. I can hardly think of any games that will work with 6 cores.
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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29. April 2010 @ 02:41 |
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Been playing arkham asylum for over a half hour now. Reminds me of how left 4 dead runs. Real smooth, and averaging 60F/ps. Can't seem to find any graphics settings. I likely haven't looked hard enough though LOL! While I think it looks good, I wouldn't say it looks incredible. But that could be due to my resolution settings. It's definitely not running at 1920 x 1200.
I haven't bought it yet. I decided to see if it warranted opening my wallet ;) So far, it's definitely really close. They sure do make the game pretty simple. They hand you clues on a silver platter LOL!
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 02:46 |
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Quote:
Been playing arkham asylum for over a half hour now. Reminds me of how left 4 dead runs. Real smooth, and averaging 60F/ps. Can't seem to find any graphics settings. I likely haven't looked hard enough though LOL! While I think it looks good, I wouldn't say it looks incredible. But that could be due to my resolution settings. It's definitely not running at 1920 x 1200.
lolwut? Did you try looking in the install folder? I'm pretty sure there is launcher exe in there with a video settings menu. With your card you should be able to absolutely crank it at 1920 x 1200.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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AfterDawn Addict
7 product reviews
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29. April 2010 @ 03:06 |
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Originally posted by Estuansis:
lolwut? Did you try looking in the install folder? I'm pretty sure there is launcher exe in there with a video settings menu. With your card you should be able to absolutely crank it at 1920 x 1200.
While I'm perfectly capable of figuring out such a process, why would they do that? Why not put those settings WITHIN the game. Not everyone knows how to navigate the system folders. I suppose the manual that comes with the game probably states such though :p
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 03:23 |
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Hey jeff, when you say Launcher exe, do you mean Launcher .ini? I'm familiar with ini files. I'm 99% confident in understanding their functions. I've had to reconfigure more than one, on more than one occasion LOL! Is this seriously the way Batman Arkham Asylum is re/configured though???
To delete, or not to delete. THAT is the question! This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 29. April 2010 @ 03:24
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 04:11 |
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Nonono
C:\Program Files (x86)\Eidos\Batman Arkham Asylum\Binaries\BmLauncher.exe
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 04:20 |
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LOL! Thanks. That's still a silly way to have it setup. Not everyone is gonna know to look there.
Looks like it was set for 1680 x 1050, with anti aliasing disabled. And V sync was enabled. Ever since sams recommendation, I've wondered about having it enabled. From what I understood, V sync limits frames to 60 F/ps??? Or at least all that Fraps can record...
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 05:53 |
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VSync does limit the fps to 60. In some instances it can stop tearing (good), others it causes lag (bad). AA can only be enabled in Arkham Asylum on nvidia cards without a config hack, as nvidia inserted a line of code into the game stating 'If Primary_RenderDevice=ATI, AntiAliasing=disabled'
Jeff: Yes, but at 2560x1600 there is a fairly substantial hit :P
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 18:43 |
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Haha new disxcovery. Enabling Vsync in the Metro 2033 cfg file improves framerates significantly. This can be duplicated and seems to work on EVERY system. The theory is that turning on Vsync disables the 3D Vision optimizations. I'm not sure if this is really true but I DID get a 10FPS increase. My Minimum on my benchmarking spot also went from 17 to 22. Make of that what you will.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessag...&topic=53962903
I don't recommend the r_gi tweak because it causes drops more often than improvements and messes with how certain effects are rendered.
The Vsync and FOV tweak though, are magical. Especially the FOV really makes the game sing! :D
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 29. April 2010 @ 18:45
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 18:44 |
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Thanks to both of you for helping me out. Means a lot ;)
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 18:47 |
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Not a problem. I pride myself on knowing just how to tweak a given game. It is my pleasure to pass some of the knowledge on :D
BTW check my edit if you plan to play Metro. The Vsync tweak really works!!! Even on ATi cards!
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 29. April 2010 @ 18:48
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 18:51 |
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I lol'ed. That's an interesting effect, but can you not disable that feature normally? What effect does it have on the detail?
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AfterDawn Addict
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29. April 2010 @ 19:04 |
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Absolutely nothing. You're simply enabling Vsync. Considering you probably don't hit 60 much to begin with, I think the trade is worth it.
Quote:
Well, first thing after installing and launching the game once to put in your settings. Once you have the video and controls where you want, do this.
1) Go to your My Documents folder, and turn on Show Hidden Files in folder options.
2) Go to AppData / Local / 4A Games / Metro 2033 and open user.cfg
3a) Search for r_gi 0 and set it to 1. (Trust me.)
b) Next search for r_vsync off and change it to on.
c) And lastly go down to sick_fov 45 and change it to 60.
4) Save file. Ctrl+C to copy it, and go to Steam / Userdata and do a file search for user.cfg
5) When and if it finds it (should), paste the file over to ensure settings propigate.
What this does:
Setting A turns on Global Illumination. Now, if you're running a weaker CPU, this might actually be a performance hit, but in most cases it actually acts as a gain. It changes the lighting to a different system that works better with DX10 and 11. So if you're running DX9, I'd recommend against this change. For a full discussion on how dramatic this changes lighting ingame, check Wikipedia.
Setting B is Vsync. Fairly obvious, but the FPS gains are dramatic and prevents screen tearing. Discussion currently seems to believe the reason for the massive FPS gain is the with vsync on, all 3D display tech turns off, and since no drivers to use it anyway, no reason not to use this.
Setting C is Field of View change. This is most noticeable on widescreen displays. This one is up to you, but with so many complaints about naseua from having such a tight FoV, here you go. If you are fine with the cramped screen, ignore this or change it back. I still recommend it though, as things like your pnuematic weapon pressure displays frequently go offscreen with 45 degree FoV.
Like I said the r_gi tweak isn't really recommended and several people on that forum have confirmed my thoughts about that. The FOV and Vsync ones work a treat though.
He mentions copying it over. He's referring to the directories. There's a cfg in the AppData folder and an identical one in the Metro 2033 install folder. After you change one, set it to "Read Only" and overwrite it over the other one.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 29. April 2010 @ 19:12
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3. May 2010 @ 10:39 |
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MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|. |
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3. May 2010 @ 10:51 |
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Interesting but not really applicable to anything at all as 3DMark = Nvidia's Private Sex Slave
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
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3. May 2010 @ 10:53 |
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nothing harp on about in the real world, just damn impressive.
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|.
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. May 2010 @ 11:53 |
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Oh for sure it's a very impressive system. Not disputing that.
But first, four GTX 480s? I'm surprised the 1200W PSU they were using was enough. Even then I think they were using two...
Also, all evga? Nice system and everything but branded systems like those make me sick. The only reason Kingpin uses all Evga parts is because they pay him to do it. You should pick components on their individual merits, not their brand name...
That system is virtually impossible to build with retail parts. The Evga Classified SR-2? Show me where that's actually for sale. It's been out almost a month and so far the only working one I've seen is in that test. Also the price would be over $600 in retail stores. Oh yeah not to mention there are only a handful of cases in the world that can fit that board and every single one of them either needs mods or a custom-order motherboard tray...
I understand it's just a record benching system. But the simple fact is that it's about triple the price of the usual ultra high-end gaming PC, and without LN2, really isn't that much faster in practice. Vantage is about the only thing to use that kind of power. Most ACTUAL GAMES are still just barely warming up to quad cores, let alone 12 cores.
I can almost guarantee two 4GB 5970s would challenge that for much cheaper, much less heat, much less power draw, and they would live longer too. The GTX480 goes back to the 8800GTX, the 6800 Ultra and even the FX5950 Ultra. I wonder how long before the reports of dead cards come flooding in...
Kind of sad really when Nvidia promote the speed of their cards on a benchmark designed specifically to make Nvidia cards look WAY faster than they are and scale perfectly in SLI...
Like I said, I totally get the spirit of why it was done. But it was wholly unnecessary and took like half of Nvidia's stock of working 480s...
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. May 2010 @ 12:00
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. May 2010 @ 11:55 |
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lol whats with the rant? its just benchmarking. everone knows its got nothing to do with real life.
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|.
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. May 2010 @ 12:02 |
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Made some edits, added more. Specifically this:
Quote:
Like I said, I totally get the spirit of why it was done. But it was wholly unnecessary and took like half of Nvidia's stock of working 480s...
Benchmarking is one thing, but that was just a waste of time. Even with all those parts crammed into a working gaming PC, much slower systems would probably match or beat it simply because nothing scales that high yet.
Also it doesn't hurt to mention I severely dislike Nvidia for many many reason, not the least of which being their bully tactics and retardedly high prices with little to no performance to show for it...
Yeah I may be biased but I have my reasons :)
"Nvidia, The Way It's Meant To Be Played" What, you mean on fire? Or do you mean not at all because the card is dead?
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T 4GHz(20 x 200) 1.5v 3000NB 2000HT, Corsair Hydro H110 w/ 4 x 140mm 1500RPM fans Push/Pull, Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD5, 8GB(2 x 4GB) G.Skill RipJaws DDR3-1600 @ 1600MHz CL9 1.55v, Gigabyte GTX760 OC 4GB(1170/1700), Corsair 750HX
Detailed PC Specs: http://my.afterdawn.com/estuansis/blog_entry.cfm/11388
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 3. May 2010 @ 12:05
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. May 2010 @ 12:09 |
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waste of time is subjective though. for benchmarkers, it wont be, for us normal people yes.
MGR (Micro Gaming Rig) .|. Intel Q6600 @ 3.45GHz .|. Asus P35 P5K-E/WiFi .|. 4GB 1066MHz Geil Black Dragon RAM .|. Samsung F60 SSD .|. Corsair H50-1 Cooler .|. Sapphire 4870 512MB .|. Lian Li PC-A70B .|. Be Queit P7 Dark Power Pro 850W PSU .|. 24" 1920x1200 DGM (MVA Panel) .|. 24" 1920x1080 Dell (TN Panel) .|.
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AfterDawn Addict
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3. May 2010 @ 12:22 |
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I have to agree with Jeff to an extent. What is the point of the EVGA setup? It's as bad as liquid nitrogen results really, perhaps worse since it's more expensive.
For a start nvidia abuse 3dmark scores by artifically raising the score if PhysX is enabled.
Rather hilariously (well not really, but in an 'I told you so' kind of way) this week sees both the death of an 8800 in one friend's system, and an Asus P5B board bricked through the BIOS updates being bad from someone else.
Benchmarking stems from usability scoring. When benchmarking has got so far ridiculous it ceases to mean anything. After all, stupid high clock speeds on CPUs, we'd never need them, but if we replicated them we'd get improved performance. What use does the EVGA example serve? Nobody could ever hope (or want) such a system, especially when Quad SLI fares so poorly compared to Triple SLI, which is far, far more available. Add to that fact that nvidia's multimonitor system is basically non-existent, so all this processing power is going into 2560x1600, to play what? Crysis Warhead? Two 4GB 5970s would take care of that. Metro 2033? Maybe, but because you're using nvidia cards you only get high detail, not very high. What's left? There's needless benchmarking and then there's just utter pointlessness. This is the latter. These cards got a very high benchmark score. Likewise, if you attached large rockets to a car it'd be the fastest road car ever, but er, you get the point.
That and what Jeff said, nvidia's corruption. It was almost forgivable for many when their products were good. Now that they're bad, there's no real reason to buy anything from them, save PhysX, and I'm sorely tempted to try the fully hacked drivers that run the PhysX straight off an ATI GPU and forego the hybrid.
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