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Official docTY Taiyo Yuden thread
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. October 2006 @ 08:21 |
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@Mort81,
I think the media is ok, I'm using genuine TY, Ritek, and Verb media with the odd 'cheapy' in there every once in a while. I'm not even concerned about the 'cheapy' media just the 'good stuff'. I am going home in a little while and check all the stuff previously noted and go from there. Are you thinking the PSU is the prob? btw how do you like the Litey SHM-165H6S? If for some reason I determine the optical drive is the problem I may go to one of those. I really think the PSU may be the culprit but not 100% at this point.
.....c
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@cincyrob,
That is why the gurus have said the Nero Quality Test is just that and not to be looked at with exteme accuracy. I think the tests that windtrade says to look at may be more helpful in determination of the validity of a good/bad burn. Learning as you are so I may need correction from the gurus. lol. I have done the same thing with some of my discs and found that no matter the make and model the Nero QT will give a different result about 50% of the time.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 12. October 2006 @ 08:27
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windtrade
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12. October 2006 @ 08:57 |
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Quote:
while i would NOT RECOMMEND prodisc, there was at one time where the media produced by them were very good, given your system was setup correctly and you didn't overburn~ :) i haven't used any 16x Prodisc yet, so i don't know if they've become "better" or "worse," but if you have, please do share you experiences with them, i'd be curious to know~ :P
@docTY - I can report on Prodisc 16x media.
Lite-On SHM-165H6S, fw HS0E
on Fujifilm 16x DVD+R code out as DVD+R 16x Prodisc R05.
I've burned maybe 25 or so from a pack of 50 and the discs burn and play great. The Nero disc quality, benchmark, and scandisc tests are all in the top range of what I have tracked over the past few months.
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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12. October 2006 @ 09:09 |
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greensman,
I like my litey every bit as good as my benq for burning. I don't need or mess with dvd-ram feature but do use the LS feature on occassion. I prefer my benq for ripping cause it is a little faster.
Your PSU might be a good place to start. It doesn't appear that your problem is due to ripping or encoding (since the encoded folder plays ok from your hdd). Might not be getting sufficient juice to your burner/s.
As promised, here are some scans of MCC 004 media burned with my benq 1650.
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435 |
AfterDawn Addict
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12. October 2006 @ 09:20 |
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@Mort81,
Thanks for the reply. I'm not home yet but can't wait to look at the things mentioned before and make sure there is not something that I overlooked. Getting a little excited about coming to a close on this pixelation stuff. btw I found some other good deals on the net for some upper end PSU's. Newegg and TD have some really good deals for those looking for PSU's. Cheaper than CompUSA but not any better for sure. Thanks again.
@DocTY,
Sorry to HOG up your thread with these problems but the help is greatly appreciated.
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windtrade
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12. October 2006 @ 11:46 |
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I just don't buy it is a PS problem; for that matter, I don't think it is hardware, media, or burning related problem. Let's make sure we compare apples to apples. First off, it is impossible to isolate this problem if trying to compare what is being seen via a STB and PC. There is no way to diagnose what is going on inside the STB so a valid diagnosis must be done soley on the PC. Let me offer this diagnostic process to solve this once and for all. lol
0) Complete cold start reboot system.
1) Play burned disc using PC sw player and note EXACTLY where a few different pixelations is observed. Make sure to run this test a couple of times, playing about 15-30 seconds before the observed pixelation to help eliminate hardware related issues. The rationale is the system will be at steady state current draw: disc spun up fully, sw player components fully loaded, etc. We've all seen the occasional stutter problems when jumping around a disc and various things in the system need to "catch up".
2) Run the Nero benchmark and scandisc tests. This verifies the physical disc and its contents are cleanly read off and transferred to the PC and can not be the cause of the pixelation. Still, I would observe very closely if the drive is spinning down/up at the same time the pixelation occurs as spinning up the disc would take more energy for a few moments.
3) Defrag the hard drive fully, not a "smart" defrag but a full defrag that puts all files back together and leaves all free space as a single block.
4) Copy the burned disc PC vobs/ifo to the same hard drive and play via same PC sw player to see if pixelation appears in the same spots.
Note: We will assume that the PC copy operation makes an identical copy during the transfer. You can run a binary file compare to validate this step to confirm this copy.
If you see the pixelation in the same places, we can eliminate problems from the following sources: burning, media, drive, power supply, and the problem may be related to a poor transcode or encode, bad source material, or possible problems in the playback chain: video card, sw player filters, etc.
If you don't see pixelation, we can confirm thus far that the actual data on the hard drive and burned disc are bit identical, the video is being played along the same video chain, the PC drive can read at 1x without glitches. Humm.. I did not think we would get here but if so then it appears we still have no answer. I'm out of ideas yet will not concede it is a power supply related problem. Who's next? :-)
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. October 2006 @ 17:06 |
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@windtrade
thanks for your personal experiences w/ the 16x prodiscs, i'll keep that in mind if i ever decide to try them out in the future~ so, i take it liteon's really like them (given that they're both taiwanese companies...it makes sense) :)
nice suggestions/analysis of greensman's issues and how to rectify them...i believe all this "Testing" is gonna do his head in pretty soon if together we can't nail where the problem resides...
as i mentioned in my most recent post, even the best PSU with high wattage isn't going to resolve it until we know exactly where the pixellation is originating from... :) so, in part, i agree w/ ur statement that the powersupply is not the culprit~
@greensman
no worries, all the knowledgeable members here are involved to HELP YOU, i like the challenge myself (can't speak for anyone else) :) as you stated, many good deals can be had for powersupplies online that end up being much cheaper than buying the identical product locally, my last suggestion regarding powersupply for you IF you choose to take that upgrade route in the near future (if all else fails in us pinpointing ur system issues) is that stick with a decent one w/ 400w+ or higher (i would even go as far as suggesting maybe something along the lines of a 500w for future upgrades which leaves you some room without having to purchase a new one at a later time), the 350w you have currently is not a bad unit, it's just lacking in the power output to the rails as for what your system may need...so to answer your initial question about the 2 Antec branded psus, go for the 480w in your first link :)
i'm basically tackling this issue of urs from a similar standpoint as my good friend mort81, we agree on a LOT of things and when troubleshooting our own problems when they arise, together we've resolved many an issue just by picking each other's brains~ :)
windtrade made some very good points and he has the right idea in his approach of this, it's very logical and his reasoning is on the mark...i'm pretty much at a loss of words at this point and repeating what i've said before is beginning to annoy me (LOL cuz i have nothing else new to add, so, i'm annoying myself) :)
docTY
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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AfterDawn Addict
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12. October 2006 @ 21:09 |
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@DocTY, Mort81, & windtrade,
Between dinner, baths (3 children), and the wife I have found one (or more) problem that I missed earlier. I looked at the ripped and encoded video files from the PC and they have some of the same anomalies as the disc. There seems to be more on the disc, is this due to screen size? Ok let the roasting begin for my errors. Now, with that said what can I do from here. I'm betting that the correction is easier now. I'm not even going to make any guesses. Thanks for making me double check windtrade and using some logic as the Doc said. Looking forward to the rib jabs and the help.
..........c
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. October 2006 @ 00:39 |
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:) greensman
as mentioned here in my last 2nd to last sentence directed at you~ :)
http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/117/296925#2448654
and i quote myself here a few posts up
Quote:
or possibly that your backup when played on your computer you don't notice the pixellation, but on a much larger screen when played on standlone player you notice?
:) if the pixellation/anomalies are apparent to you WHILE WATCHING the video files ON YOUR PC, you can safely bet they will be there on the disc after burning as well~ :) given you are watching on a LARGER screen as well, the smallest artifacts that you notice on your computer monitor will be magnified even MORE SO~ :) i was pulling at straws when i mentioned this earlier, seems like i got "close" to the solution? hehehe
so, can we say that we've narrowed it down to the ripping/encoding portion of your backup that is giving you these issues? perhaps try a different method for the ripping/encoding from the original disc to see if this 2nd time around, it may have a "cleaner" rip? i'm not sure exactly what you used to RIP the file first, but i would suggest a diff. program this 2nd time around (ie. ripit4me, anydvd's ripper, dvdfabdecrypter, etc. whatever you used the first time around, try a different method from the ORIGINAL disc) :) then encode/transcode as you normally would w/ dvd-rb pro + cce/procoder or one of the included encoders, or w/ Nero recode2 if a transcoder is your preference :)
no worries, we're getting somewhere now..and making a little bit of progress is far better than being "stuck" at a standstill~ looks like you can wait on your PSU upgrade for now as well~ save some $$ and work with the tools/programs/hardware you have currently~ :)
this is the silver lining to that proverbial dark cloud we've been experiencing...good luck with your future backups...
docTY
Recommended Media:
Taiyo Yuden 4x dvd-r TYGO1/ 8x dvd-r TYGO2/ 8x dvd+r YUDEN000T02/ 16x dvd+r YUDEN000T03
Verbatim 8x dvd+r MCC003
Verbatim dvd+r DL (MKM001)= flawless no compression backups
"Do Yourself A Favor, Use The Good Stuff
TY & Verbs 4 Life~ :)" ~docTY~
"Its better to be quiet and appear stupid, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
I am always prepared to recognize that there can be two points of view - mine and one that is probably wrong - John Gorton
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windtrade
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13. October 2006 @ 07:53 |
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Quote:
w/ Nero recode2 if a transcoder is your preference :)
NO!!! Don't you want this guy to ever get out of the asylum?? Greenman - As you are a noobe to movie ripping do the following to make all these problems go away. Some of this echoes docTY's recommendation.
Start simply and:
1) Make movie only backups. Do not keep extras, menus, alternate audio tracks; subtitles are fine. This minimizes and often times eliminates the need to compress at all.
2) Start the transcoder and make appropriate selections as stated above. It will indicate how much compression is needed. Use the transcoder if the required compression is less than 10-15%. If greater than that use encoder software such as DVD Rebuilder.
I am certain following this simple guide provides the best overall balance of quality vs time in making backups.
Software required:
1) Decss tool to unlock commercial encryption. Use what you have already if you are not getting hit with new protection schemes that cause your tool to fail. AnyDVD is the premier tool ($$) as the updates are constant and quality of the software is top rate. There are free ones but you need to get advice elsewhere. Look at these if you come across discs that have problems.
2)All transcoders compressing less than 15% produce quite similar results. DVDShrink, CloneDVD, or Nero Recode pretty much do the same thing. If the one you have seems to create less quality than you desire, then just make the cutoff point lower (10% instead of 15%) and go with the encoder option. An encoder will NEVER make a lesser quality backup than a transcoder.
There is far more technology involved in the front end of the backup process (encoding, avisynth filters, authoring, etc.) so just use this and get going on a safe and proven path. As time and interest permit, you can learn and learn and learn (never ends, trust me) about the finer points and options to making custom backups that are uniquely suited to your needs.
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georgeluv
Member
1 product review
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13. October 2006 @ 08:36 |
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i just ordered 100 dvd cases and 100 ty premium 8x dvd-rs from www.mediasuperstore.com (i have never had -r issues, and i use one of the oldest dvd players on earth). the econoline ones were 9 bucks cheaper but didnt come with free shipping, so the premium ones were actualy cheaper.
my querstion is, whats the diference besides the way they are packed and did i order good disks? (i probably should have asked that before i ordered them).
and also, are there any DL disks out there that are in the same price range as cheap SL dvds? i herd that pretty much all DL blanks being made right now have problems. i just want to be able to rip an entire dvd without compression, i have a 50 inch tv and when i compress a fully packed DL dvd onto a SL DVD-R it definatly makes the video lower in quality. i love special fetures so i dont realy want to get rid of them.
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windtrade
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13. October 2006 @ 08:52 |
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Your TY premium discs are fine, no need to worry further on this point. Some may argue about packaging but practically it is not an issue. The shrink warp is so tight there is no way they can slide around and create scuffs or scratches. Once open you may want to move onto a spindle for storage but the premium ones should already come in plastic boxes which are fine as is.
DL media is more expensive, no doubt; Problems may be more but that may be partially attributed to less experience with it and the various combinations of drives and media that work well and experience using the burning software to get correct burns. It's not an issue for you unless you plan to have the TY you just bought collect dust.
The only way to copy a full DL disc with no compression to another DVD is with DL media and if that is what you require then you need to return the media and get DL media. You'll need to get advice from others on experience with solid DL media.
Another way would be to put the movie only on one SL disc and the extras on another. The problem with this is the main title may still require compression so it is not solution for all titles.
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georgeluv
Member
1 product review
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13. October 2006 @ 09:41 |
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oh i know i need DL disks and stuff, i got the ty premium 8xers for making my own dvds from scratch (from tv shows and dowloaded videos) with my own menues and everything. i use TMPGEnc software for authoring, burning, and encoding. i know that TMPGEnc dvd author is dl compatable though, so it would be realy usefull for entire seasons of HD tv shows.
the main reason i want DL disks is so i can do straight rips with dvdclone, wich is DL compatable.
i have two burners, TMPGEnc reads them as: HL-ST DVDRAM GMA-4020B A105 and TOSHIBA CD/DVDW SD-R5372 TU53. the latter is what i generaly use cause the first one only does 2x. the toshiba has 16x, +/-, and DL capabilities.
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aabbccdd
Suspended permanently
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13. October 2006 @ 10:06 |
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remember NOT to burn DL media above 4x speed
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gus738
Suspended due to non-functional email address
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13. October 2006 @ 10:41 |
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@kivory666 , dell is number # 1 for a reason , when ever you buy a system from them make sure to max out warranty , they'll cover evertying , not 1 cent to deliver or parts or repairs or swaps what so ever , the warranty pays off easily no matter what , they exchanged me so far no more then 5 xps durring my warranty time (4 yrs ) i'd say 3 or so xps , xps 700 being the newest one ,
everyone has scratched disc even if its 1 in so many , what i do everytime and never fails is , everytime before i burn a dvd i grab my commericial cd cleaner ( NOT scratch remover) like this one http://www.educational-software.com/maxe...er-details.html
but i like more the scuare ones , well after i clean the dvd with the properl tools i use AnyDVD and clonedvd2 , thus NEVER fails , unless the dvd is UNPLAYABLE meaning full of scratches which was once in thousands of dvds lol .... n e ways what im trying to say is a scratched dvd wont affect it , oh and the other day i discover clonedvd2 was trying to repair a chapter of a dvd meaning it has a somewhat repairing dvd disc , it had a finger print , i took it out cleaned it and re read it , i dont like ripping a disc if it has a finger print or dirt ,, i always clean it with the proper fluids and disc cleaner
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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13. October 2006 @ 11:02 |
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georgeluv,
The best and only DL media I recommend are verbatim dvd+r's. Be sure to booktype them dvd-rom and I recommend burning at 2.4x (for starters anyway).
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435 |
Senior Member
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13. October 2006 @ 11:33 |
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Originally posted by Mort81:
The best and only DL media I recommend are verbatim dvd+r's. Be sure to booktype them dvd-rom
Couldnt have said it better so I quoted it.
Lets also tout the skills of ImgBurn software when using DL discs.
Build the ISO from the original disc then write. Anyone else want to toss out names of favorite DL burning programs please do.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. October 2006 @ 11:34
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AfterDawn Addict
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13. October 2006 @ 11:41 |
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ImgBurn for DLs gets my vote deadrum333
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Senior Member
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13. October 2006 @ 11:44 |
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As Per Mort & Deadrum Verb D/l's are the only ones I've found worth the bucks and best burns at 2.4x. Also the only 2 programs I've had the best luck with is Image burn & Clone would also like to hear of any other programs for D/L's . chris Edit Meant Clone DVD 2
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. October 2006 @ 08:05
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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13. October 2006 @ 17:33 |
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drinks on me, just got promoted...lol 1 TY for everyone ....
just found some 8x+r sony MIJ's at staples. 23.95 for 50pc cake. had to get them.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 13. October 2006 @ 17:33
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aabbccdd
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13. October 2006 @ 20:57 |
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CloneDVD 2 works well also for DL backups
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Senior Member
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13. October 2006 @ 22:43 |
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If I'm not mistaken arent dl's a small fortune, if you want to keep out compression and keep all your menus and extras just split it in 2 disc's, makes perfect copys and a lot cheaper.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 05:43 |
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but if you split them and put them on 2 disc isnt thats the same as useing a DL disc? useing twice the disc... just my way of looking at it
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frbernard
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14. October 2006 @ 07:47 |
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To the person not capable of burning on anything but dl: I use AnyDVD, CloneDVD and only TY medium and can burn a film or series of any length. Sometimes the compression is down to 48, but they still turn out just fine and the viewing is perfect. I have burned some discs that were up to four hours in length and they were perfect.Just wanted you to know that there are possibilities beyond DL or splitting up the project
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windtrade
Member
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14. October 2006 @ 08:51 |
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@frbernard - I'll assume your post is tounge in cheek but am responding as those less experienced might get the wrong idea. Please do indicate when posting something to be taken in jest.
Quote:
Sometimes the compression is down to 48, but they still turn out just fine and the viewing is perfect. I have burned some discs that were up to four hours in length and they were perfect
To those struggling with terms and processes such as shrinking, transcoding, encoding, DL (dual layer) vs SL (single layer) - it is virtually impossible and impractical to think for a second that you compress a dvd movie in half and not notice the digital artifacts (pixelation/macroblocking, loss of detail) created from the compression if you display on a standard monitor or larger in size. I'll concede if you are watching a movie compressed this much on an ipod video or other such sub 3" mobile video device you can get away with this option but no way on viewing back on a big screen.
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. October 2006 @ 09:37
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 09:34 |
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Quote:
Sometimes the compression is down to 48, but they still turn out just fine and the viewing is perfect.
I most definately would not want to watch it, especially on my 52" HDTV. That is even pushing it for dvd-rb/cce and even then would most likely have artifacts but not as bad as CloneDVD.
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435 |
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