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Official docTY Taiyo Yuden thread
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AfterDawn Addict
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14. October 2006 @ 10:17 |
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You might be missing frbernard's point. He's PLEASED with the product he's achieveing. I agree I would not want my movies compressed to 48% either. But I'll not fault someone who is not asking for help and is just giving an opinion about his outcomes. I likewise respect your view that it shouldn't be done; and I agree. JM2C
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windtrade
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14. October 2006 @ 11:07 |
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Quote:
and the viewing is perfect
I happy he is pleased with the results he gets @ 48% compression; I just don't want noobes doing the same thing and the majority see significant visible faults in the output and start wondering what is going wrong, when in fact we know exactly what is causing the issue.
Maybe my response is more to the recent extended series of messages that pinpointed visible artifcat problems to the process of compressing movies.
man - this thread is getting way OT. :-)
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frbernard
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14. October 2006 @ 11:16 |
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Windtrade: No, I was being serious. What I stated is my experience using AnyDVD and CloneDVD. What was it that made you think I was joking?
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frbernard
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14. October 2006 @ 11:20 |
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After reading the response about my satisfaction with what I produce. My backups play as well as the original from which they were copied. I really can't tell the difference nor can anyone else who views them. When I say 48% I mean at the first rate, usually then the second box indicates them at about 53%
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 12:29 |
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greensman,
I've been brainstorming. What was the reduction level on the backups you were experiencing some pixelation problems? Are you doing movie only or keeping some extras? Reason I ask if there is a lot of compression required and you are saving some extras, sometimes the extras will have a lower bitrate and look poor compared to the main movie.
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435 |
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georgeluv
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1 product review
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14. October 2006 @ 14:17 |
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how do i test a dvd BEFORE i burn something to it? i have cd-dvd speed version 2.11.4 is that good enough? what should i look for when i test it before and after i burn it?
will updating to the latest firmware for my toshiba sd-5372 make it burn better or just faster? it already goes 16x. i have firmware version tu53.
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 18:39 |
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i just bought me the epson R320 printer. did my first dvd cover on a printable verb..this is way to sweet.now i guess i need to order some printable TY's online cause i doubt i canfind them in alocal store??? am iright thinking this
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Senior Member
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14. October 2006 @ 19:46 |
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@cincyrob If you find them locally let us know, I've been buying the Verbatims at Micro Center 16x+r for $14.99 for 50. Chris
Edit The Ty's I've only found on Line
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. October 2006 @ 19:47
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AfterDawn Addict
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14. October 2006 @ 19:48 |
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@cincyrob,
Nice to get back on topic. lol. I have seen the printable Maxell MIJ at Walmart and Office Depot. Unfortunately I can't recall any of the printable TY's anywhere. I am sure they exist but you will have to get Sony's or Fuji's if they exist. Doc any ideas here? Your best bet is to visit http://www.meritline.com/taiyo-yuden-8x-...-printable.html for DVD+R's and DVD-R-white-inkjet-hub-printable.html" target="_blank">http://meritline.stores.yahoo.net/taiyo-...-printable.html for DVD-R's ($32.99/100 pk delivered right now!!!) I'm sure there are some other deals out there but Meritline is pretty good.
@Mort81,
I have visited with DocTY and windtrade and posted my errors in this thread stating that I missed some anomalies in the ripped folder. I'm looking at some other rippers and trying to narrow down the problems with my system. I can't think of another problem than maybe a scratched disc. Any ideas on this? btw most of the files I was backing up were about 30-40% compression with DVD-RB Pro. I have tried to back up The Wild today and I keep getting errors with Recode2 and DVD Shrink doing only the movie with about 9-10% compression. I can post the Nero log file in the Nero forum or just post it here if you guys want to see it. I did The Lakehouse but haven't checked it yet so I will make an effort to report back on that. btw again, I don't mind if you want to PM me, it would be less clutter for the Doc's thread or post in an appropriate forum.
Where is the Great Creaky? I may need some advice from you Creaky about these silly Nero log files.
.........c
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AfterDawn Addict
4 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 20:01 |
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@chris.
do they still have the printable verbs onsale at microcenter?i know the reg. disc are on sale still.
@greensman...
sorry to wonder off the beaten path. i tend to do that.
the sony MIJ'+r's are hard to find
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Senior Member
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14. October 2006 @ 20:13 |
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They did last week when I was there they weren't advertised in the flyer but were still on special on the shelf. I have noticed a price jump on DVD's here in Michigan at the OD and Circuit City and Comp USA and wondering if Micro Centers going to drop there Verbatim line. I also picked up some more of the Cd Printables. Your right it's just plain fun printing with the Epson and the Ridisc ink I've been printing on the regulars for the kids just letting them dry for 12 hours. Chris
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AfterDawn Addict
6 product reviews
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14. October 2006 @ 20:24 |
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I picked up my last 50 pk of verbatim DVD+R hub printables from rima.com for 45 cents a disc (if my memory serves me right) with free shipping. Best price I could find at the time.
greensman,
I'm going to be talking to kivory tonight and we'll put our thoughts togather as to what might be a solution to your problems.
Rig #1 Asus Rampage Formula Mobo, Intel Core2Quad Q9450 CPU @ 3.55ghz, 2gb Corsair DDR2 1066 Dominator Ram @ 5-5-5-15, TR Ultra 120 Extreme w/ Scythe 9 blade 110 cfm 120mm Fan HSF, HIS Radeon 512mb HD3850 IceQ TurboX GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, CM Stacker 830 Evo Case, Rig #2 Asus P5W DH Deluxe Mobo, Intel C2D E6600 CPU @ 3.6ghz, 2gb Corsair XMS2 DDR2 800 Ram @ 4-4-4-12-2t, Zalman CNPS9500LED HSF, Sapphire Radeon X850XT PE GPU, Corsair 620HX P/S, Cooler Master Mystique Case, Viewsonic 20.1" Widescreen Digital LCD Monitor, Klipsch Promedia Ultra 5.1 THX Desktop Speakers, http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=348351 http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=236435This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 14. October 2006 @ 20:27
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AfterDawn Addict
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14. October 2006 @ 21:26 |
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@cincyrob,
I was j/k. You brought us back to the reason this thread was started. About DVD media and in particular Taiyo Yuden media. LOL. As I said I haven't seen the TY in a retail store but the Verb's and Maxell MIJ are on the good stuff list. http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=149381 Here is a listing for a SAM's CLUB in the Cincinnati area (assuming you are from there....lol) for some Verb's $39.57/100pk (+tax of course). At least this way you can put your hands on them without waiting for a shipment and also see if you like them. I would peruse through their stock and try to find the 8X's though. A little more stable than the 16X at this point according to most of the gurus on here. I have used some of the 16X non-printables and they have been ok but like most of the guys here I still like the 8X stuff.
@Mort81,
Thanks for caring. I know we are getting close to the solution.
.........c
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15. October 2006 @ 01:05 |
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@greensman - i'm still ere :)
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Senior Member
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15. October 2006 @ 13:18 |
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I burned a 3.5 hr movie on a DL disk and noticed that I forgot to change the write speed down to x2.4 per the media specs and had it at x6... so far the movie is great? What does this mean? I would of thought that over writing [which I can do, but it is not set up for that at this time]would distort the image-my question is did it automaticly change the write speed and not the number in the box?
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. October 2006 @ 13:36 |
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@herrick
Are you sure the DL was written @ 6X? I would have thought the burning program, which you didn't mention, would have burned the media at it's 2.4X rated speed.
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Senior Member
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15. October 2006 @ 13:46 |
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I used AnyDVD w/ CloneDVD2 and I noticed after it in the finalization point. The log in the left hand corner stated it was at x6
Win. 7/Case- Thermaltake Armor11 bays "full case"-with side fan panel... removed stock fans replaced with SCYTHE 92mm 2ea. and SCYTHE/s-flex sff21f 120mm 2ea./ sunbeam 4 fan controller/Processor-Intel Core2Duo E6850 3.0 w/ Zalman CNPS7700-CU cooler/motherboard-Asus P5N32-E SLI p680I/PSU-Cooler Master RS 850 watt real power pro sli/Sound Card-Creative Sound Blaster X-FI FATAL1ty/Cables-Thermaltake Rounded IDE ATA & ATA2/Memory- 4 Gig Corsair XMS 800 MH/HDD-1ea. WD 300GB 10K VelociRaptor Sata-1ea.WD 320GB 7200rpm Sata/Drives- 2ea. Benq 1655 [Rev.BCDB]2ea.LG GH24NS70[rev.GN00]/52in1 card reader&Writer&USB/ Video cards- 1ea. EVGA Gforce Nvida GTX 550Ti /Monitors- 2ea. ACER AL2017 LCD 20 in. ea/Printer-
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. October 2006 @ 13:47
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. October 2006 @ 14:18 |
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Interesting? Well if it plays great then the burn was great.
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Senior Member
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15. October 2006 @ 14:27 |
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very interesting, the media was Ritek or Ridata x2.4 DL disk- I've only gotten into it about 30 min.- I might of gotten away with it because it was a T.V. show on TNT. In the past I have noticed that the made for T.V. movies are more forgiveable then 3+ hrs. of video that was a movie for the theaters...sounds crazy, but I do alot of older TNT Bible movies and get away with very high compression in the past, now I use DL... just thought I would throw this out there.
Win. 7/Case- Thermaltake Armor11 bays "full case"-with side fan panel... removed stock fans replaced with SCYTHE 92mm 2ea. and SCYTHE/s-flex sff21f 120mm 2ea./ sunbeam 4 fan controller/Processor-Intel Core2Duo E6850 3.0 w/ Zalman CNPS7700-CU cooler/motherboard-Asus P5N32-E SLI p680I/PSU-Cooler Master RS 850 watt real power pro sli/Sound Card-Creative Sound Blaster X-FI FATAL1ty/Cables-Thermaltake Rounded IDE ATA & ATA2/Memory- 4 Gig Corsair XMS 800 MH/HDD-1ea. WD 300GB 10K VelociRaptor Sata-1ea.WD 320GB 7200rpm Sata/Drives- 2ea. Benq 1655 [Rev.BCDB]2ea.LG GH24NS70[rev.GN00]/52in1 card reader&Writer&USB/ Video cards- 1ea. EVGA Gforce Nvida GTX 550Ti /Monitors- 2ea. ACER AL2017 LCD 20 in. ea/Printer-
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AfterDawn Addict
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15. October 2006 @ 14:54 |
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@Doc, Mort81, and Creaky:
I decided to post here initially and see what you guys thought. I am giving you the 2 failed Nero Recode2 logs. I know DVD-RB Pro is better but I didn't want to wait 2-3 hours for another failed process. I was in the movie only mode with The Wild and I played the video from start to finish and didn't notice anything wrong with the picture along with the rip from the PC.
first failure:
Project type: Main Movie to DVD
Target size: DVD5 (2282925)
05:14:11 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 56
Command table patching started...
05:14:11 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 133
All tables successfully patched!
Burn settings:
Target: BENQ DVD LS DW1655
Number of copies: 1
Write speed: 5540 KB/s
Temp folder: F:\Nero Recode 2 (25653772288 bytes free)
Direct burning: false
Target media: DVD R/RW, DVD DL, DVD-RAM
Shutdown when finished: false
Advanced Analysis: true
Compress Adaptive: false
05:14:17 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 231
Compile DVD: init
VTS_01 Title Vobs [9611 vobus] 5323.72MB -> 4458.72MB [R 0.84]
Video: 4205.45MB, extra: 253.27MB
Audio: 3 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch English 228.79MB [enabled]
1. 1. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch French 228.79MB [disabled]
2. 2. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch Spanish 228.79MB [disabled]
Subpicture: 4 streams
0. 0. English - Normal Captions 5.68MB [enabled]
1. 1. French 0.00MB [disabled]
2. 2. Spanish 0.00MB [disabled]
3. 3. English 0.03MB [enabled]
05:14:18 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 1152
Compile DVD: begin copy 1
05:14:18 File NeroRecorderBase.cpp, Line 488
Writing to disc: DVD+R
05:14:18 File NeroRecorderBase.cpp, Line 502
Free capacity on disc: 2283092 sectors (2295104)
05:14:18 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 684
Compile DVD: begin deep analysis
05:18:23 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 381
An unknown error occurred in the advanced analysis engine.
05:18:23 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 382
Compiling DVD volume failed
05:18:23 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 301
Compile DVD: exit
05:18:23 File burner.cpp, Line 961
An unknown error occurred in the advanced analysis engine.
second failure: (really the 3rd but tried entire movie)
Project type: Copy entire DVD
Target size: Custom (2273280)
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 56
Command table patching started...
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 1 - VTSM_PGCI_UT - LU 1 - PGC 7 patched!
08:31:39 File CmdTableAllocator.cpp, Line 60
*********** DVDStructuresGenerator Error **********
==> Invalid address!
D:\Source\Stone\Nero\DVDVideoStructures\DVDVideo\Generator\VTSIGeneratorImpl.cpp
line: 122
****************************************************
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 1 - VTSM_PGCI_UT - LU 1 - PGC 8 patched!
08:31:39 File CmdTableAllocator.cpp, Line 60
*********** DVDStructuresGenerator Error **********
==> Invalid address!
D:\Source\Stone\Nero\DVDVideoStructures\DVDVideo\Generator\VTSIGeneratorImpl.cpp
line: 122
****************************************************
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 1 - VTSM_PGCI_UT - LU 1 - PGC 9 patched!
08:31:39 File CmdTableAllocator.cpp, Line 60
*********** DVDStructuresGenerator Error **********
==> Invalid address!
D:\Source\Stone\Nero\DVDVideoStructures\DVDVideo\Generator\VTSIGeneratorImpl.cpp
line: 122
****************************************************
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 1 - VTSM_PGCI_UT - LU 1 - PGC 10 patched!
08:31:39 File CmdTableAllocator.cpp, Line 60
*********** DVDStructuresGenerator Error **********
==> Invalid address!
D:\Source\Stone\Nero\DVDVideoStructures\DVDVideo\Generator\VTSIGeneratorImpl.cpp
line: 122
****************************************************
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 1 - VTS_PGCITI - PGC 1 patched!
08:31:39 File CmdTableAllocator.cpp, Line 60
*********** DVDStructuresGenerator Error **********
==> Invalid address!
D:\Source\Stone\Nero\DVDVideoStructures\DVDVideo\Generator\VTSIGeneratorImpl.cpp
line: 122
****************************************************
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 2 - VTS_PGCITI - PGC 1 patched!
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 5 - VTS_PGCITI - PGC 1 patched!
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 101
VTS 12 - VTS_PGCITI - PGC 1 patched!
08:31:39 File LangStreamPatcher.cpp, Line 133
All tables successfully patched!
Burn settings:
Target: BENQ DVD LS DW1655
Number of copies: 1
Write speed: 5540 KB/s
Temp folder: F:\Nero Recode 2 (18698379264 bytes free)
Direct burning: false
Target media: DVD R/RW, DVD DL, DVD-RAM
Shutdown when finished: false
Advanced Analysis: true
Compress Adaptive: false
08:31:50 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 231
Compile DVD: init
VTS_01 Menus Vobs [930 vobus] 48.60MB -> 36.83MB [R 0.27]
Video: 23.98MB, extra: 12.85MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 10.36MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 1 streams
0. 0. Unspecified 0.67MB [enabled]
VTS_01 Title Vobs [9612 vobus] 5324.09MB -> 4024.69MB [R 0.66]
Video: 3777.13MB, extra: 247.56MB
Audio: 3 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch English 228.79MB [enabled]
1. 1. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch French 228.79MB [disabled]
2. 2. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch Spanish 228.79MB [disabled]
Subpicture: 4 streams
0. 0. English - Normal Captions 5.68MB [partially enabled]
1. 1. French 0.00MB [disabled]
2. 2. Spanish 0.00MB [disabled]
3. 3. English 0.03MB [partially enabled]
VTS_02 Menus Vobs [6 vobus] 0.09MB -> 0.09MB [not compressable]
Video: 0.01MB, extra: 0.08MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 0.07MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_02 Title Vobs [8 vobus] 0.82MB -> 0.31MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.22MB, extra: 0.09MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 0.07MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 1 streams
0. 0. Unspecified 0.00MB [enabled]
VTS_03 Title Vobs [16 vobus] 0.50MB -> 0.44MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.23MB, extra: 0.22MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 0.19MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_04 Title Vobs [21 vobus] 7.52MB -> 3.85MB [R 0.27]
Video: 3.26MB, extra: 0.59MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch Unspecified 0.55MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_05 Title Vobs [37 vobus] 10.16MB -> 0.46MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.11MB, extra: 0.35MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch Unspecified 0.00MB [partially enabled]
Subpicture: 1 streams
0. 0. Unspecified 0.00MB [partially enabled]
VTS_06 Title Vobs [36 vobus] 14.41MB -> 0.55MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.21MB, extra: 0.34MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch Unspecified 0.00MB [partially enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_07 Title Vobs [68 vobus] 2.17MB -> 1.62MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.71MB, extra: 0.91MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 0.77MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_08 Title Vobs [921 vobus] 419.65MB -> 9.19MB [R 0.27]
Video: 0.21MB, extra: 8.98MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch English 0.00MB [partially enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_09 Title Vobs [1 vobus] 0.01MB -> 0.01MB [not compressable]
Video: 0.01MB, extra: 0.00MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch Unspecified 0.00MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_10 Title Vobs [371 vobus] 186.73MB -> 3.62MB [not compressable]
Video: 0.00MB, extra: 3.62MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 5.1-ch English 0.00MB [disabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_11 Title Vobs [690 vobus] 304.24MB -> 185.66MB [R 0.27]
Video: 175.88MB, extra: 9.79MB
Audio: 1 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch English 8.44MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
VTS_12 Title Vobs [583 vobus] 261.35MB -> 172.07MB [R 0.27]
Video: 156.82MB, extra: 15.25MB
Audio: 2 streams
0. 0. Dolby Digital 2-ch English 7.06MB [enabled]
1. 1. Dolby Digital 2-ch English- Director's Comment 7.06MB [enabled]
Subpicture: 0 streams
08:31:50 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 1152
Compile DVD: begin copy 1
08:31:50 File NeroRecorderBase.cpp, Line 488
Writing to disc: DVD+R
08:31:50 File NeroRecorderBase.cpp, Line 502
Free capacity on disc: 2283045 sectors (2295104)
08:31:50 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 684
Compile DVD: begin deep analysis
08:36:54 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 381
An unknown error occurred in the advanced analysis engine.
08:36:54 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 382
Compiling DVD volume failed
08:36:54 File burn_dvdfiles.cpp, Line 301
Compile DVD: exit
08:36:54 File burner.cpp, Line 961
An unknown error occurred in the advanced analysis engine.
I am not very good a looking at these things because of obvious reasons. lol. Take a gander and see what I need to do. Thanks in advance and looking forward to your responses.
...........c
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Moderator
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15. October 2006 @ 23:02 |
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@herrick - good point. i sometimes backup my episodic dvd's to single layer (i stil haven't found a need for dual layer) and as i'm backing up the entire disc the compression ratio is far lower than a movie (average 2hour movie anyway) would usually be. But for episodic tv shows the quality on the original dvd isn't 100% crisp (don't know about recent ones i usually only buy older series boxsets for stuff i missed over the years, i rarely watch tv) and the quality of the backup is far lower than most people would tolerate. I've tried out DVD Rebuilder a little but i haven't got the patience for 2/3 hours just for one disc (i know a lot of people say that and a lot of people argue against people not having/making time, but i hardly have time to watch stuff most of the time, never mind have my PC tied up for hours just doing one disc; also i won't leave home PC's on unattended). But anyway, back to my point, on my 32" LCD the episodic stuff has visible 'artifacts' (maybe not the correct term); the best way i can explain it is when you put your face right up to the screen and watch a retail DVD you can see blockiness, but with my episodics (done via DVD Shrink) you can sit at normal distance from the screen and see blockiness. However that's fine for me for episodic stuff; i watch stuff like that for the content/story so the quality doesn't matter as long as the picture isn't actually jerky. For films i prefer much higher quality, but again, some blockiness is tolerable to me. If it's like a 3hour epic movie then i don't bother backing up, i just watch the original, it's rare i watch epic movies over and over so i don't worry about the original disc being at risk of damage.
@greensman - i'm not very familiar with Recode logs, mainly as i've never used it.
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aabbccdd
Suspended permanently
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15. October 2006 @ 23:19 |
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creaky i am with you and agree I'm going to do the complete original "Star Trek" series in a few weeks and if the compression is a little higher than i want it its not that big of a deal,being an older show. i do save my DL blanks for some concert/music DVDs though if needed
This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 15. October 2006 @ 23:21
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AfterDawn Addict
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16. October 2006 @ 08:47 |
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This message has been edited since posting. Last time this message was edited on 16. October 2006 @ 08:48
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aabbccdd
Suspended permanently
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16. October 2006 @ 09:25 |
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Pete you think there not going to make drives anymore?
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AfterDawn Addict
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16. October 2006 @ 09:39 |
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aabbccdd: BenQ's have gone out of production if I am correct.
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